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Maybe it's time to move to Linux

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Original post by Raghar
Dual partition computers are best. When one OS would go down, the other works as backup. The problem with Linux is it could just read from NTFS in administrator mode, so you need to plan ahead, and create one small 10 GB partition as shared formated under FAT32.


maybe its just me but i would read that as a problem with windows...

good points all, personally i think linux( because it is free ) will continue to grow, but will not eat at microsofts share. most computer buyers get windows anyway, and only die hard linux fans will choose to use linux exclusively, far more will run dual boot / seperate windows and linux machines.

i agree with cross platform development.

it makes sense to support librarys and utilities that are available for users on any os, it makes life easier for us - the developers.

if cross platform librarys are seen to be supported then third party librarys may make an effort to make their own librarys cross platform too.

ditto for linux drivers - when many people want to buy hardware and will prefer to buy ones that are known to work under linux, the drivers will improve.

linux doesn't yet have the market share to force manufacturers to do this yet.

i have to buy a new graphics card( i broke my own one :( ) and i am choosing a NVidia card because the drivers for linux are good(according to what i've heard)
my Linux ATI drivers i tried to install frighten my kernel( probably because i dont know too much about linux system software ). its sad that i cant make my descision based on the relative quailty of the hardware, but in supporting NVidia maybe i will make some small difference to ATIs linux policy.

it's alright - i'll stop now...

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Quote:
Original post by Oluseyi
That said, there is no guarantee that Linux will grow to double-digit desktop marketshare, simply because the system is designed around principles that range from opaque to incomprehensible to most users.


Having done a bit of tech support, I'm not sure that Windows is much more comprehensible to most users. I read an interview today with Rickford Grant, Author of Linux Made Easy - where he made an interesting point about computers in general. Here's an excerpt"
Quote:
The same thing is true with something as simple as a USB storage device. I still get looks of amazement from some people when they see me use one and find out what it does – a real Polaroid-camera-in-post-Cultural-Revolution-China sort of reaction. There's nothing inherently difficult about the things, but when you don't know something, everything seems that much harder. If it weren't so, bookstores wouldn't be filled with books telling people how to use seemingly simple programs such as iTunes, iPhoto, MS Word, or even Nero.


I think Grant is overly optimistic about linux on the desktop, but he has some interesting things to say. For me the big difference for the average user is the lack of dedicated tech support for linux. Until companies like Dell start providing PCs with linux preinstalled and support at the level they now do for Windows, linux probably won't leave the server/ desktop for techies role.

Quote:
Original post by Oluseyi
I doubt it. The PS3 is designed for the living room, not for the den; it is designed as a consumer entertainment device, not as a general-purpose workstation.


I'll be curious to see how linux on the PS3 turns out. Some of the things done with the PS2 surprised me - like this cluster of ps2s which was estimated to be capable of 500 GFLOPs. More info here. Pretty amazing considering the ps2 only has 32 megs of RAM.

I suspect a big drawback will be the linux driver for the nvidia card will be crippled on linux. This is completely a guess on my part that this will be the case, but I just can't see Sony wanting an official driver for linux.



Anyways back to the OP. Yes, you are probably not going to get many sales for the linux version of your game, but if you use SDL you can develop on linux and create a linux, windows, and mac executable without too much difficulty.

I would suggest you try out linux and see if it works for you, it's not going to be a magic bullet that will solve your problems. If all you're looking for is to not use a Microsoft product, also take a look at what Apple is offering these days, you might be a lot happier with that than linux.

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Original post by rip-off
i have to buy a new graphics card( i broke my own one :( ) and i am choosing a NVidia card because the drivers for linux are good(according to what i've heard)


I haven't had any problems with the Nvidia drivers for linux, but they are a major pain to install. Once you've done it once it's not that bad, but from my experience - doing it the first time isn't much fun. But you don't have much choice as the unofficial "open source" nvidia drivers are rather lacking in performance.

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Original post by Will F
Having done a bit of tech support, I'm not sure that Windows is much more comprehensible to most users.

Windows isn't exactly a shining paragon of transparency, but it's probably the most transparent of currently available desktop UIs. More importantly, it's the most frequently revised in the search of better and better presentation schemes and desktop metaphors.

Before I continue I should perhaps clarify a bit. Some will no doubt point out that Windows employs the same windows, icons, menus, pointer (WIMP) paradigm available on all contemporary GUIs, and even a few ancient ones! Yes, however Microsoft explores the most variations on that theme of current GUI developers/vendors. Microsoft popularized the Wizard as part of its task-oriented GUI initiative of a few years back; this has largely been scaled down, as there isn't quite the proliferation of overt Wizards there once used to be, but we still see the lasting impact in installers, configuration menus and other sequential task UIs. This is good.

Next comes the Ribbon set to debut in Office 12. Taking a page from Apple and running further with it than the boys from Cupertino, the Ribbon is a context-sensitive main menu replacement that gives a visual indication of the effect of selecting an item, say, in Word (how exactly will your text be formatted, for example). This is consistent with task-based UI rather than command-based, but a step above asking a series of questions with radio or check box option answers.

Linux GUIs are forever playing catch up to Windows in this regard, while Apple UIs debut great ideas but never push them to logical, functional conclusion - being too caught up with looking pretty. Case in point: Mac panels. Panels are like modal dialogs, but lack the border - and thus the ability to be moved around - of traditional dialogs, visually emphasizing the fact that you can not continue work in the parent window until the panel is dismissed. Problem? Lacking dialog borders, panels can't visually indicate that they have keyboad focus (only their constituent controls can), and the parent windows appropriately shade themselves when losing focus, resulting in a bizarre instance where no window appears to have focus, including the desktop!

Quote:
I think Grant is overly optimistic about linux on the desktop, but he has some interesting things to say. For me the big difference for the average user is the lack of dedicated tech support for linux. Until companies like Dell start providing PCs with linux preinstalled and support at the level they now do for Windows, linux probably won't leave the server/ desktop for techies role.

That won't be enough. Until the GUI becomes an efficient sole interaction vector on Linux - that is, until a power user need not drop down to the console unless s/he really wishes to - Linux will remain a geek toy. Considering that even Windows is intimidating to a persisting number of daily computer users, tech support isn't enough. The technology itself needs to change and adapt to the needs and preferences of users.

Linux particularly struggles here because of the "scratch your own itch" mentality, and the fact that primary users are extremely technical people more comfortable with the expressive facility of the command line. To them, a GUI is a somewhat frivolous frill, illustrated by the fact that the best Linux IDE remains Emacs. (Yeah, yeah, you love Anjuta or KDevelop - whatever.) The best minds, so to speak, are not working on tools designed or intended for "lesser minds"; in the worlds of Windows and Mac, the exact opposite is true because of the difference of the core userbase.

Linux is great technology. People don't buy great technology. They buy technology which they perceive to be more useful to them. There are an abundance of factors, from "coolness" (iPod) to marketing (Windows over OS/2) to usability (iPod family over Creative Zen series) to clannish community ("artists use Mac!" said the aspiring digital artist), but just about none of them is working in favor of Linux being perceived as a viable option for your average computer user.


As for the PS3, PS2 Linux barely registered on my consciousness. I don't need - nor do I find practical - a cluster of PS2s, and I can't play any indie/hobbyist games on my PStwo, so... yeah, whatever.

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Quote:
Original post by Oluseyi
That said, there is no guarantee that Linux will grow to double-digit desktop marketshare, simply because the system is designed around principles that range from opaque to incomprehensible to most users.


What principles would that be? Sounds like you are talking out of you ***, frankly. IMO Unix is well designed compared to Windows.

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Original post by brulle
Quote:
Original post by Oluseyi
That said, there is no guarantee that Linux will grow to double-digit desktop marketshare, simply because the system is designed around principles that range from opaque to incomprehensible to most users.


What principles would that be? Sounds like you are talking out of you ***, frankly. IMO Unix is well designed compared to Windows.


Your fault is that Unix is not Linux.

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Quote:
Original post by Oluseyi
Linux particularly struggles here because of the "scratch your own itch" mentality, and the fact that primary users are extremely technical people more comfortable with the expressive facility of the command line. To them, a GUI is a somewhat frivolous frill, illustrated by the fact that the best Linux IDE remains Emacs. (Yeah, yeah, you love Anjuta or KDevelop - whatever.) The best minds, so to speak, are not working on tools designed or intended for "lesser minds"; in the worlds of Windows and Mac, the exact opposite is true because of the difference of the core userbase.


There's a really good article about this at Joel on Software called Biculturalism.

Personally I would be a bit surprised to see linux grow into double digit desktop marketshare. There's just too much working against it - for one thing, the average user expects to be able to play mp3 files or watch DVDs, they don't care about patent issues and the like, they just want it to work. Another problem is that everyone wants to work on the sexy problems, no one wants to work on things like the GUI or documentation. Companies like Microsoft and Apple can afford to pay people to do this, while open source projects have to hope someone volunteers. It'll be interesting to see if Trolltech's business model around Qt and KDE works out.

Quote:
As for the PS3, PS2 Linux barely registered on my consciousness. I don't need - nor do I find practical - a cluster of PS2s, and I can't play any indie/hobbyist games on my PStwo, so... yeah, whatever.


PS2 linux barely registers for me too, but I just think it's kinda neat. There are some indie/hobbiest games for PS2, check out PS2Vision. I really haven't spent too much time looking into it, but some can be played off a memory card. I suppose that since SDL works with ps2 linux, you could theoretically play some open source games if you have the ps2 linux kit. But yeah, it's not really all that exciting. The ps3 just sounds like it has a bit more potential... I suppose we'll have to wait to find out

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Original post by doodle_sketch
Your fault is that Unix is not Linux.


Really?

Quote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix-like
Despite the trademark, the Unix community at large is somewhat more nebulously defined, and Dennis Ritchie, one of the original creators of Unix, has expressed his opinion that Unix-like systems such as Linux are de facto Unix systems.

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Not sure what to say about linux, but GNU's Not UNIX. [wink]

Anyways, this thread is going nowhere fast. Take care.

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Quote:
Original post by Will F
Another problem is that everyone wants to work on the sexy problems, no one wants to work on things like the GUI or documentation. Companies like Microsoft and Apple can afford to pay people to do this, while open source projects have to hope someone volunteers.


Nope, no problem. People work full time developing Linux, Gnome and KDE, supported by sponsors or employed at companies.

Quote:
It'll be interesting to see if Trolltech's business model around Qt and KDE works out.


No. It has already been working out for quite a while.

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