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c++ is annoying

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i've made another attempt to learn c++ and although i understand most of the concepts pretty well, i think that's completely ridiculous that it takes so long to get anything done. could anyone point me to some other programming languages that are low level like c++ but don't take so long to get anything done? any help is appreciated. [Edited by - skyfire on November 12, 2005 5:00:17 PM]

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I'm sorry to say that low level languages in general have higher development times. Switching to another low level language isn't going to help things.

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could anyone point me to some other programming languages that are low level like c++ but don't take so long to get anything done?


I think that the problem that you are having with development time is directly related to your desire to program in a low level language.

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http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=356264

Okay well, according to this post you made about 7 days ago it doesnt seem to me like you've been really studying C++ for a very long time. Maybe try sticking with C++ for a bit before you give up?

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I am really not experianced in c++, but I know that there are some books out there that teach you (step-by-step) how to make a game engine using c++ (e.g. Beginnning Game Programming by Michael Morrison).

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Original post by skyfire
also, it seems like there isn't enough information on how to make games with dev-c++. everyone seems to be using msvc++ and i can't afford msvc++.


Microsoft has released MSVC .NET 2003's optimizing compiler as a free download as well MSVC .NET 2005 Express Edition is available for a free download for the next year. (The free download lasts a year, you can use it as long as you want.)

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Original post by SiCrane
Quote:
Original post by skyfire
also, it seems like there isn't enough information on how to make games with dev-c++. everyone seems to be using msvc++ and i can't afford msvc++.


Microsoft has released MSVC .NET 2003's optimizing compiler as a free download as well MSVC .NET 2005 Express Edition is available for a free download for the next year. (The free download lasts a year, you can use it as long as you want.)


argh! i can't download that compiler because of network problems.

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Original post by skyfire
nope. i even tried to download the img file but it always stops at 20%. maybe bill gates has hijacked my computer.


Why would he stop you from downloading one of his endorsed products? [grin]

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Original post by skyfire
it was a joke. the point is, i can't download that compiler. i guess i'll just browse untill i find a language that suites me.


c++ works the same on many compilers.

the difference is (mainly) in the setup.

the things you have to change are libraries to link to, mainly. in visualc++ these are listed in the source. in dev-cpp you have to set them in project options.

c++ takes a lot more setup and getting used to but i think you'll find any language that comes close to it's power and flexibilty will require the same...

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I think you may want to take a minute and think about what part of getting results from C++ you think takes up all the time...

Setting up an application with directx or opengl/sdl doesn't take very long once you know how to do it - plus lots of that code can just be reused when you make youre next project so that would bring it's time down to zero...

After that, the main part of a game is the interaction of every object, and the player. In the case of, say a fps or other 3d environment, it doesn't matter if you're using c#, basic, c++, or assembly (well, assembly might be pushing it) - the bulk of that time is still going to be figuring out the math involved, and figuring out the structure and order of how everything happens and is evaluated. This part of a program, for the most part, will only change in syntax, and it's implementation will take you just as long in any language.

maybe the problem is that you haven't spent enough time learning c++, and so you don't know more "advanced" techniques or concepts that, in turn, make creation easier and faster. Try creating a simple program like breakout or tetris - then compare your code to that of someone who made the same program, but who has much more experience than you. I do this as much as possible and almost every time I find ways to improve part of my programs/games that I make in the future.

I also just have one more comment for you to consider. If you go and learn a higher level language like vb or c# etc for a while, and then eventually decide you want to learn c++ (because you shouldn't be able to get a job only knowing vb), you may find it almost impossible. I started learning vb, c++, and now c# all at the same time - and after a few topics in vb or c# I'd go back to c++ and get frustrated that doing the same thing in c++ was taking longer to learn. So, if you're anything like me, going from a high-level language to a low-level can be harder than just starting with a low-level... however that being said, i've been programming vb & c++ for about 4 years on and off now and c# for a little over a year, and 95% of the time i choose to program in c++...

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Quote:
Original post by skyfire
i've made another attempt to learn c++ and although i understand most of the concepts pretty well, i think that's completely ridiculous that it takes so long to get anything done. could anyone point me to some other programming languages that are low level like c++ but don't take so long to get anything done? any help is appreciated.


If you're not doing so already, take a look at SDL. It is fairly easy to get something up and running quickly using C++. Alternatively you might want to take a look at pygame, which is essentially a Python binding to SDL with some added classes useful for gamedev. Might make your life a bit easier.

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I second looking into SDL, or Allegro for that matter, both are similar and will get you going on making 2D games.

Developing in C++ becomes a lot nicer when you've figured out how to use the Standard Template Library (STL), and figured out what polymorphism is. Although C++ my seem difficult to get a grasp on (I still write horribly crappy code and have been with C++ for three and some years) you will be happy you stuck with it, as there really aren't as many limits to what you can do with C++ as there are with other languages.

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