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shader tool available

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I am reading shaderX book by wolfgang.It introduce many shader tool.but it is old,the book writed in DX8. some good tool website is unavailable(shader studio) So introduce me some good shader tool avaiable and popular.thanks

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Original post by Armadon
NVidia's FX Composer

Personally, I have always prefered FX Composer over RenderMonkey. In my opinion, the UI is much less convoluted and straightfoward. In RenderMonkey (at least when I was using it, which was a few months ago) there is an emphasis put on projects, while in FX Composer, you just open an effect and off you go.

I also know of people who just prefer to use Visual Studio as an FX editor, so it just personal preference. I recommend that you just try what's out there to see what you like.

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Original post by circlesoft
Personally, I have always prefered FX Composer over RenderMonkey. In my opinion, the UI is much less convoluted and straightfoward.

Agreed. FX Composer has a better UI but unfortunatelly no GLSL support. Is also has no Cg support, which is quite surprising since Cg is a NVidia creation actually. However, HLSL and Cg are pretty much the same.


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Original post by circlesoft
I also know of people who just prefer to use Visual Studio as an FX editor, so it just personal preference.

Is there a plugin actually, which adds realtime shader previews to MSVS? Never heard of any, though...

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Original post by circlesoft
I also know of people who just prefer to use Visual Studio as an FX editor, so it just personal preference.

** raises hand **

Gotta keep bugging the DX team to enhance it though [wink]

One thing to bare in mind with the VStudio tools is that the "Shader Debugger" you might see references to appears to have died with VS2005. My understanding is that PIXfW will be taking over much of it's functionality...

Jack

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Original post by jollyjeffers
One thing to bare in mind with the VStudio tools is that the "Shader Debugger" you might see references to appears to have died with VS2005. My understanding is that PIXfW will be taking over much of it's functionality...

That's really sad. The past few months, I have used the shader debugger *extensively* in my projects. They may say the "deep pixel" support in PIX replaces the debugging functionality, but in my opinion, it absolutely doesn't. Both the vertex shaders and pixel shaders I work with are complex, so it sucks to just have to guess at what is happening, without being able to step through it. Simply being able to query the write history of a certain pixel isn't enough.

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Is there a plugin actually, which adds realtime shader previews to MSVS? Never heard of any, though...

No, some people *cough*Jack*cough* are just so elite that they can pound out their shaders without even previewing them! (I bet its loads of fun getting your compiler errors at runtime though hehe)

Sometimes I just edit shaders in VS, if its just a quick change that I don't want to fire up FX Composer for.

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Original post by circlesoft
Quote:
Original post by jollyjeffers
One thing to bare in mind with the VStudio tools is that the "Shader Debugger" you might see references to appears to have died with VS2005. My understanding is that PIXfW will be taking over much of it's functionality...

That's really sad. The past few months, I have used the shader debugger *extensively* in my projects. They may say the "deep pixel" support in PIX replaces the debugging functionality, but in my opinion, it absolutely doesn't. Both the vertex shaders and pixel shaders I work with are complex, so it sucks to just have to guess at what is happening, without being able to step through it. Simply being able to query the write history of a certain pixel isn't enough.

Bare in mind that what I said is just based on a few bits-n-pieces I spotted over on the WGGT forums. A few people asked why the shader debugger wasn't working with VS2005, and (I think) Paul Bleisch suggested that they weren't going to push the issue as they're hoping that PIXfW would take over some of it's responsibilities.

Debugging the VS was a nice tool, but I could never get my head around debugging the PS via VStudio... just didn't make much sense to me. Deep Pixel analysis under PIX is definitely an improvement there (as I see it), but not sure what they can (or will) do with the VS debugger...

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No, some people *cough*Jack*cough* are just so elite that they can pound out their shaders without even previewing them! (I bet its loads of fun getting your compiler errors at runtime though hehe)

haha! I wrote some code this evening that exploded the D3DXCompileShaderFromFile() function... but the error handler dereferenced the ID3DXBuffer incorrectly when looking for error messages and brought the whole program down [oh] Learnt pretty quickly not to feed bad shaders into my code...

Jack

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Original post by jollyjeffers
Debugging the VS was a nice tool, but I could never get my head around debugging the PS via VStudio... just didn't make much sense to me. Deep Pixel analysis under PIX is definitely an improvement there (as I see it), but not sure what they can (or will) do with the VS debugger...

Normally, most of my debugging resides in VS, due to all of the instancing complications (ie constants not getting set correctly, ect...). I never really have to debug the PS, since I normally just go through it in FX Composer. So I guess that is correct - I wish they still had the VS debugger, at least.

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Run identical GPUs on CPUs with different speeds. It’s helpful to find
a system BIOS that allows you to adjust (i.e., down-clock) the CPU speed,
because that lets you test with just one system. If the frame rate varies
proportionally depending on the CPU speed, your application is CPU-
limited.

So introduce me this software that work,please.

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Original post by luasitdown
Run identical GPUs on CPUs with different speeds. It’s helpful to find
a system BIOS that allows you to adjust (i.e., down-clock) the CPU speed,
because that lets you test with just one system. If the frame rate varies
proportionally depending on the CPU speed, your application is CPU-
limited.

You can easily do this with PIX, and that doesn't require you changing the clockspeed of your processor. In my opinion, that is a pretty naive way to go about profiling an application. Just set up PIX to analyze your application, and that should tell you exactly what you want to know.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Quote:
Original post by circlesoft
Quote:
Original post by jollyjeffers
One thing to bare in mind with the VStudio tools is that the "Shader Debugger" you might see references to appears to have died with VS2005. My understanding is that PIXfW will be taking over much of it's functionality...

That's really sad. The past few months, I have used the shader debugger *extensively* in my projects. They may say the "deep pixel" support in PIX replaces the debugging functionality, but in my opinion, it absolutely doesn't. Both the vertex shaders and pixel shaders I work with are complex, so it sucks to just have to guess at what is happening, without being able to step through it. Simply being able to query the write history of a certain pixel isn't enough.



If you're familiar with Pix for Xbox, you can see how the coming support in Pix for Windows might replace the shader debugger. It is (substantially) a change in work flow without any loss in functionality. Instead of stepping through a shader ala traditional debuggers, you will scroll through a trace of the execution of that shader. In fact, one could likely write a stepping debugger on top of the trace -- it is really a UI issue.

Paul (still too lazy to find my password).

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Original post by Anonymous Poster
If you're familiar with Pix for Xbox, you can see how the coming support in Pix for Windows might replace the shader debugger. It is (substantially) a change in work flow without any loss in functionality. Instead of stepping through a shader ala traditional debuggers, you will scroll through a trace of the execution of that shader. In fact, one could likely write a stepping debugger on top of the trace -- it is really a UI issue.

Ahhhh ok, I was not aware that the Xbox PIX offered such functionality. I though that it was simply limited to the deep-pixel stuff that everyone knows about. That actually will work really well for me, since when debugging shaders, I have to make some runtime changes. This will be better, since I just have to fire up PIX and run it.

ps I believe GDNet has some really easy 'find your password' thing

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