Quote:Original post by Steadtler Also, usually in an online game you want both UDP and TCP. I've heard there are better and faster implementations of TCP out there, might want to look for that. Sadly, a LOT of packets gets lost 'out there'. And while you can afford a few packets here in there when transmitting voice, you can't take the chance that critical player commands will get lost.
Well, right now I'm messing around with Raknet, which has a REALLY nice verification system for UDP which I'm currently testing. I found a nice little way to get a system that can simulate dropped packets involves hitting a wireless router with a hammer. Things like movement and such I am sending as unverified since the info updates so often, it seems foolish to verifiy every walk command.
Custom UDP wrappers are pimp.
Quote:Original post by Bob Janova You kind of implied it by the game genre: fighting games with significant latency suck really badly, because it's a 'twitch' genre. (In general, of course; if you have some unique gameplay ideas such that it's fun without instant response then more power to you.)
I've got several ideas I'm messing about with that should be able to at least give some of the urgency of a fighting game like system.
wouldnt it be possible to make a twitch style game that just responds in a slower manner? I mean, people are constantly saying you cannot do it because of lag - but look at counter strike and other games. They are fairly twitch based. You move around and click a bunch. Lets say you have a ping of 200ms. Then your updates will be sent every 100 ms to the server. That will give you several clicks that are possible each second. For a standard punch (aka knife attack in CS) this should be possible cosidering that CS even uses TCP. The problem arises when you introduce combos. Youobviously have two choices:
A) gather clicks on client side then send out "i did a combo" B) gather click on server then send out "player did a combo"
Both obviously have thier pros and cons (if it would even be possible). The obvious flaw seems to be: in order to do a combo you must collect several peices of data in a very short amount of time and then conclude that combo is done (while determining that a basic move has not been done). This to me seems the real problem to me because of the introduced lag (er waiting) and determining if the combo was executed. Twitch play isnt the problem, twitch play with chained moves to determine combos is the real problem. With the MMO setup I would say you could not get basic twitch play (no combos). You would probably be able to pull it off with 20 or less clients.
I would like to hear other peoples ideas for doing combos in fast paced games, ive always thought this would be a cool thing to play. As for the OP, Im pretty sure you were asking about reatime, because if it was not realtime the problem is easy - send all the packets time stamped, wait a little bit, reformulate them serverside, then conclude if there was a combo.
Quote:Original post by Anonymous Poster wouldnt it be possible to make a twitch style game that just responds in a slower manner? I mean, people are constantly saying you cannot do it because of lag - but look at counter strike and other games. They are fairly twitch based. You move around and click a bunch. Lets say you have a ping of 200ms. Then your updates will be sent every 100 ms to the server. That will give you several clicks that are possible each second. For a standard punch (aka knife attack in CS) this should be possible cosidering that CS even uses TCP. The problem arises when you introduce combos. Youobviously have two choices:
A) gather clicks on client side then send out "i did a combo" B) gather click on server then send out "player did a combo"
Both obviously have thier pros and cons (if it would even be possible). The obvious flaw seems to be: in order to do a combo you must collect several peices of data in a very short amount of time and then conclude that combo is done (while determining that a basic move has not been done). This to me seems the real problem to me because of the introduced lag (er waiting) and determining if the combo was executed. Twitch play isnt the problem, twitch play with chained moves to determine combos is the real problem. With the MMO setup I would say you could not get basic twitch play (no combos). You would probably be able to pull it off with 20 or less clients.
I would like to hear other peoples ideas for doing combos in fast paced games, ive always thought this would be a cool thing to play. As for the OP, Im pretty sure you were asking about reatime, because if it was not realtime the problem is easy - send all the packets time stamped, wait a little bit, reformulate them serverside, then conclude if there was a combo.
I REALLY would like to send the "I did a combo" command right from the client, but naturally I would run into the issue of hacked clients sending combo after combo.
Quote:Original post by TheyDontCallMeMatt combo cooldown =]
I've never liked the idea of a cooldown in games. Not to mention that the cooldown could be over by the time the player finishes inputting the combo anyways. I'm thinking more of a system where, since all combos drain player stamina, that once the stamina is fully depleted, it starts draining the other stats so that the combos are effectively less powerful than a conventional attack.
Why does everything have to be MMO? A fighting game could easily be made to have less than 30 players and I don't think anyone would mind, they can only be fighting so many players at once. Look at Soldat, that is loads of fun and yet not MMO.
Quote:Original post by TheyDontCallMeMatt but the fight might be over way before all stamina is depleted
Well, obviously some numerical balance issues would have to be resolved, but thats no big thing to fix. It'll be trial and error for a while during the beta, but I can fix it.
Quote:Original post by ussnewjersey4 Why does everything have to be MMO? A fighting game could easily be made to have less than 30 players and I don't think anyone would mind, they can only be fighting so many players at once. Look at Soldat, that is loads of fun and yet not MMO.
Yeah, heaven forbid I want to make an MMO for my own fun, and to expose people to something I think they might enjoy.
This is as much about the fun of myself and others as it is about me fixing some of the problems I see everyday in the rampant clickfest that makes up other MMOs as well.
So I've slightly reworked the combo execution system so that it will be a lot easier for me to balance. Basically, instead of just removing from stamina and arbitrarily adding to other stats, I'm having it so that stat value can be detracted from any battle stat, with a few other slight twists.
Enter "The Divine Fist of Crazy Punching Arm Flailing Madness" Now, with the old stats, I would subtract an arbitrary amount from the stamina guage and let the player wail away, but last night I got to thinking. Now, I'll only add as much to another stat as I subtract from a stat.
So lets say that The DFOCPAFM has the following subtraction value: Stamina - 5
Obviously, we subtract value 5 from stamina, and add 5 points to ATK, or add 3 to ATK and 2 to agility. We never take more than we give, so we don't get crazy high values for combos like I used to.
Expanding on that, we can also make it so that combos drain stats OTHER than just stamina. Lets say we have an attack called the "Blind Strongman". What this would do is drain everything from the players natural accuracy rating, and put it all into the attack power. So basically, we'll have a very low hit rate, but a high attack power.
