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leiavoia

Java in the Work World?

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leiavoia    960
I've never used Java, nor have i ever had a use for it. My general area of expertise is in webdev (Perl, PHP, etc) and C++. So i was wondering, what is Java used for in the "real word" work environment? What kinds of applications is it used for? Is there any reason why i should take the time to learn it? (possibly leading to a job using it?) If you have used Java for non-personal, non-acedemic applications, i'd like to hear from you. Thanks for your time. I appreciate it.

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Telastyn    3777
I've not personally used it, but my last job involved doing QA on a Java app. It was the UI for enterprise level network security hardware.

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Sharlin    864
The two main areas nowadays seem to be:

* Web applications (with Java 2 Enterprise Edition)

* Mobile world (with Standard or Micro Edition).

I have some experience with the former, and even though I'm not too fond of Java as a language, I have to say that it works quite well on the server side. The strictness does make things safer.

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soconne    105
I worked at IBM for a year in Phoenix, Arizona at their web services department and ALL they used was Java. That's it.

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hey dude,

how have you been? its been a while.......

Java seems to be pretty popular in the NYC financial world.... i have seen it all over the place in that market.... there is some popular financial software that is web based written in Java - it has a distinct advantage in that you can build a windows styles app and have it embedded right into a browser, so no install is needed but all the flexability of a windows GUI is there.

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snk_kid    1312
Quote:
Original post by leiavoia
Is there any reason why i should take the time to learn it? (possibly leading to a job using it?)


No, unless you want to sell your soul to the financial/business sectors because that is where it's most popular but it's popularity is slowing down to languages like C#.

The only reason why it became popular was because of the Java hype train, the word "Java" became a new buzz-word in Business and was seen to be hip or cool to be developing software with it, typically by business managers who have absolutely no clue about programming & programming languages.

This was made worse due to the fact that some graduates where becoming equally clueless since there universities fell into the hype train too, they bascially brainwashed and dumb-down Computer Science (or any other computer related degrees) and there students by using Java as the main language (as in it's not the only one there taught but there main one will typically be Java, they will use in the majority of classes/modules/subjects throughout there 3/4 years of study). To find out more i recommend reading The Perils of JavaSchools.

Now the point of my post is popular does not necessarily mean good. The only merit of learning Java is maybe a wider employment opportunity for yourself but that is all.

[Edited by - snk_kid on March 16, 2006 4:38:03 AM]

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markr    1692
Java is widely used in online banking applications, etc, plus various other applications of these big companies.

They usually use expensive commercial app servers, such as IBM Websphere or BEA Weblogic. These are very expensive and make the management feel warm and fuzzy, after they've been to lots of brainwashingmarketing presentations about them.

It's perceived as being more reliable, secure etc, than, say, PHP. I say "perceived", because this perception is largely false, i.e. you can write lousy code in anything.

On the other hand, many excellent online banking systems do exist in Java - I know that my bank certainly uses it, and the majority of others do too.

Mark

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justo    184
Quote:
Original post by snk_kid
Quote:
Original post by leiavoia
Is there any reason why i should take the time to learn it? (possibly leading to a job using it?)


No

....

The only merit of learning Java is maybe a wider employment opportunity for yourself


now let's look at the question and think about this one again.

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Xelen    312
To answer your question there are two reasons that some of these companies are using Java. For the most part Java is cross-platform and not OS dependant. It is also capable of reaching out to other servers as well.

My dads a contractor with the military right now, and about all I know is that he is in charge of roughly 10-15 programmers who's main job is to develop and update this Java app. Basically from what I understand it interfaces with databases and makes reports, and probably has other functionality as well. I'm not really allowed to know any more than I do, haha.

But the main reason is cross-platform, and also allows for network communications to servers and etc which is a good thing. Also as others said it is handy to be able to imbed it into a web browser. Well I need to get ready for work.

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Scuppy    126

I work in the network security space and over half the apps I work with are built with tomcat. Most of the appliances are built on some sort of BSD and use java.

Good for web based apps
Huge open source code base
Cross platform compatible
Easy to find programmers

I'm not a java fanatic, I dont even like it, but if you're asking wheather you should learn java in order to get work, then I'd say go for it.

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Guest Anonymous Poster   
Guest Anonymous Poster
Quote:
Original post by Promit
Quote:
Original post by zedzeek
FWIW i believe from the latest survey, java was still the number 1 used language jobwise
It's been surpassed by .NET jobs, actually. Big demand, big pay.
Lousy source. On actual job search sites, I get more hits for Java than for .NET.

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Guest Anonymous Poster   
Guest Anonymous Poster
Quote:
Original post by snk_kid
No, unless you want to sell your soul to the financial/business sectors because that is where it's most popular but it's popularity is slowing down to languages like C#.


C# is only "rising" because Microsoft discontinued VB6 and other old tools. It's is the "natural way" if you use MS stuff or you can choose to migrate to Java to escape from having to "rebuy it" every two years.

No big deal there.

Quote:

Blah, balh... i recommend reading The Perils of JavaSchools.


That article is a (bad) joke.

Quote:

Now the point of my post is popular does not necessarily mean good. The only merit of learning Java is maybe a wider employment opportunity for yourself but that is all.


Did you actually consider the possibility that Java is good for something?

Nothing survives more than 10 years out of hype. And if financial institutions use it's a sign that:

- it's not going to disappear tomorrow, it's going to be there for a long time;
- It means that's a good technology;

I really get amazed how some people can get so fanatical about such things in computing.

It looks like some Linux freaks that when confronted with something that Linux doesn't do right they point a URL with some unfinished software at version 0.1.3 as the "solution". The same applies for language freaks pointing out the "solution for all problems" as being something that clearly is not fit.

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Guest Anonymous Poster   
Guest Anonymous Poster
Quote:
Original post by markr
Tt's perceived as being more reliable, secure etc, than, say, PHP. I say "perceived", because this perception is largely false, i.e. you can write lousy code in anything.


PHP? :) You have to be joking right?


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Guest Anonymous Poster
Quote:
Original post by igni ferroque
Java is used for lots of things; games, web services, web applications, desktop applications, mobile applications, embedded applications, etc. Since you seem to be into web development, have a look at these tools (which are my primary means for putting stuff up on the web):

Apache Cocoon
Spring Framework
Hibernate


I will just add something.

Some people may feel that's too much trouble when they see the 1652 different web frameworks in Java. Before anything use that as an "argument against Java", I'd say that's only a sign of the huge and rich open source community formed around it.

So I'd say for him to learn J2EE first (Servlets and all that stuff) with decent tools and then start using some framework IF necessary.

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snk_kid    1312
Quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
Quote:
Original post by snk_kid
No, unless you want to sell your soul to the financial/business sectors because that is where it's most popular but it's popularity is slowing down to languages like C#.


C# is only "rising" because Microsoft discontinued VB6 and other old tools. It's is the "natural way" if you use MS stuff or you can choose to migrate to Java to escape from having to "rebuy it" every two years.

No big deal there.



  1. Don't twist my words, i was not previously suggesting C# over Java.

  2. C# is ECMA standardized language, it's not solely owned by microsoft.



Quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
Quote:

Blah, balh... i recommend reading The Perils of JavaSchools.


That article is a (bad) joke.


It's not a bad joke, that article highlights what is or was currently wrong in both the industry and generally in academia (but not all universities).

Besides there are plenty more related articles that highlight similar issues aswell as other flaws. Now i'm not saying they should all be trusted but some of them are from very reputable sources from well respected people, that should sugggest something isn't quite as merry as some are making it out to be.

Quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
Did you actually consider the possibility that Java is good for something?


Yes i did/have and personally i don't, all i see is not just some but many flaws but that is completely irrlevent here and off-topic, and before you even try to suggest it, yes i do know Java, i've known it for a long time and i know it very well.

Quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
- it's not going to disappear tomorrow, it's going to be there for a long time;


I never said it was and unfortunately there is some truth in what you say this is mostly due to ignorance.

Quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
- It means that's a good technology;


No, not necessarily, realistically or more likely it's down to good marketing & advertising on Sun's behalf than anything.

Quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
I really get amazed how some people can get so fanatical about such things in computing.


I'm not being fanatical you're just trolling, it's like a movie review written by viewers, are you really going to completely trust all 9/10 out of 10 reviews? i doubt it.

Quote:
Original post by Anonymous Poster
... The same applies for language freaks pointing out the "solution for all problems" as being something that clearly is not fit.


I never touted any be-all-end-all solutions, i never made any suggestions to alternatives at all.

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