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A multiplayer FPS/RPG? Would it work?

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I''ve been tossing around this idea (that''s far to ambitious for me at the current time, but oh well) of making a multiplayer FPS that would work a lot like Everquest or Ultima Online. It would still be a FPS at heart, but you would have to buy your weapons and armor, gain levels, etc. Damage would also be handeled in a bit more RPG like manner (though a shot or two to the head would still be quite leathal). This game would take place in a game "world" instead of a "arena" (think Tribes 1/2 only much MUCH bigger) with seaprate towns and the like. Also, for the hardcore "Quake" type fans, we have small "Paintball" arenas in which you can play a "classic" FPS type game w/ out damaging your charecter. Sound fun so far? I think so! HOWEVER!!! If I was to (attempt) to do such a game I wouldn''t want it to quickly break down into a world wide deathmatch, thats what the "arenas" would be for. I would want people to socialize, trade, explore, etc. So, in order to discourage people from simply going on mad rampages I would set it up so that when you die, your charecter is gone. That''s right... gone, vanqiushed, destroyed, dead, NOT COMING BACK. No respawn. To continue playing after your charecter has died you must create a new one from scratch. Caught your attention yet? I have several reasons for doing this. One: It would obviously increase the games realism. ^_^ Two: People wouldn''t be so "Suicidal" if it meant they were going to lose a charecter that they just spent a week building up. Three: As stated above, It would encourage people to socialize peacably instead of killing womever they saw. Now remember, Damage is more RPG like, so your charecter isn''t going to die TOO easily. Also, the arena''s would basically be paintball tournaments, so losing there wouldn''t knock you off for good. There''s a bit more to this all than just that but I wouldn''t want to give away ALL my ideas! ^_^ So? What do you think? Any better suggestions? ----------------------------- Blue*Omega (Insert Witty Quote Here)

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Do you fight bots or other players? If it''s strictly PvP, then that''s a bad idea. Otherwise, if it''s mainly cooperative play against computer enemies, it''s a very good one. It sucks losing a character you''ve been working on for a while, and if it''s strictly PvP then someone will lose their precious character with each conflict. You''d have people running away from fights before the other can finish them off.

~CGameProgrammer( );

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As for the Bot/Human question, It would be a mix. Somewhat like Everquest or UO. AS for the "people running away" idea, that''s almost the type of reaction I''m looking for. If you can''t respawn then your charecter is suddenly a very precious thing. You would do whatever you have to to preserve it. This would bring out the "real life" reactions in people. I think that would make the game more interesting.

-----------------------------

Blue*Omega

(Insert Witty Quote Here)

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You''ll also need to make it so one really powerful guy (think Everquest lvl. 60 Paladin) can''t go over to someone that''s spent a few days on his character but is still relatively weak (lvl. 10 Wizard) and chop his head off. Otherwise, the game''s gonna grow into a "The weak stay weak while the strong grow stronger" sorta thing, and this probably won''t be too fun for the newbies. Just my 2 copper (That''s an Everquest saying. Man, I really want that game back)

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Oh, yeah. Forgot about that. ^_^
Simple solution!

Make multiple "worlds". The "Level 1-10" world, the "Level 11-20" world...

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Blue*Omega

(Insert Witty Quote Here)

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If you have separate worlds for the differing character levels, you miss out on some of the best interaction there is - That between an experienced player and one just learning the ropes.

You could try a form of policing wherein it''s considered "illegal" to kill someone outside a certain level range of your character. MUDs do this quite well I feel. It may not work for what you have in mind though.

I will admit that if the world has no-restriction pkill, I''d prefer one that had the separate worlds. (That''s too darn close to admitting I might be wrong )

Faradhi, opinionated ... extraordinaire

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There is an MMOFPS in development right now called Plantside...looks somewhat impressive, don''t know many details about it though. I do believe the guys at Verant are making it though...


-Ryan "Run_The_Shadows"
-Run_The_Shadows@excite.com
"Doubt Everything. Find your own light." -Dying words of Gautama

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Like in a paper/pen traditional RPG where death actually means death they set up some pretty good rules to keep players in check. In some doing bad things simply means your player won''t advance, sort of like the Shadowrun karmatic system (not like the UO one) One good example I can think of is the Star wars role playing game where you earned dark side points and if you got too many you lost control of your character and they became an NPC. Something like if you do evil deeds you lose your soul and some dark God (or other malignant force) takes control...

*****confused by earlier errors, bailing out....*****

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I don''t think the idea with the different worlds would work very well... One of the main ideas behind a role-playing game is, that you evolve your characte, isn''t it? And how do you see that you have gotten better? By comparing yourself with others...

So if you switch to a new world after level 10 it''s almost as if you started anew - not very rewarding!
There are other ways from discouraging players to kill others: bad reputation, "police", ... You could make the life of criminals a living hell! ;-) The easier the kill the worse the punishment should be...

Just my 2 cents...

------------------------------
www.BadEntertainment.net

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I can see that in order to have this all make sense I''ll have to explain the WHOLE idea. ^_^
I''m thinking of having this game take place in an sort of Techno/Wild West setting (Ever see Trigun?) You would start the game as a Citizen and would remain so until one of two thing happen. Good, high level players would have the chance to become "Sherrifs" (a.k.a. GM''s). On the other end of the spectrum, however, are the "Outlaws". If a player should do anythin illegal within the game (Kill a citizen or sherrif, rob a store, blow up a town... you get the idea) they become outlaws. Outlaws have bountys placed on their heads depending on how much damage they have caused. IE: a player whom has killed another player would have a $500 somthing bounty while a player responsible for the destruction of a town or two (a VERY difficult feat) might have a whopping $10,000,000 reward on his/her head! Outlaws would also have various restrictions set upon them, like not being able to play in most paintball arena''s or buy goods from general stores. In order to get supplies an Outlaw would have to buy from a sort of black market or player to player trade, or rob other players or stores. Also, outlaws would not get paid bountys if they kill/capture other outlaws. The title of Outlaw would be lifted if you were to surrender yourself to the proper authoritys and pay for past damages.

As you can see, an outlaws life would be a stressful and difficult one. The outlaws would baisically represent the "Hardcore" gamerers (You don''t make friends too easily when your worth $3,000,000). they would also encourage the all other players to abide by the rules. That "lvl. 10 charecter" would have more than enough reason to keep from chopping off the newbies head if he wished to keep that level 10 charecter alive.

Just a few comments to answer the questions that I know are inevitable.
For one: YES! you COULD feasibly destroy an entire town and all inhabitants therof. This would take a TON of skill (and luck) however. And yes, the towns would be repaired. Otherwise the world would become barren very quickly.
Two: Please don''t put up any post about it being a bad idea to have players as the GM''s. I''ve thought that through already. They would be "Sherrifs", not Gods.

Now that I''ve outlined the whole plan, what do you think?

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Blue*Omega

(Insert Witty Quote Here)

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Well, the idea is great. As a matter of fact, I''ve seen a few things about an MMORPG in dev right now named Neocron. It''s first person, and its an online game, not just a deathmatch. There is a problem about permanent death that needs to be addressed.

It won''t deter the sadistic (i.e. most of the PK population)

Now, don''t get me wrong. PvP is great, but "ganking" truly sucks. Its a common problem in UO (although easily tolerable, since there is no perma-death). But, like I said, it''ll still be irritating. Origin implemented an interesting (yet not too effective) idea of stat loss when you die as a murderer. Unfortunately, this just means that PKs group together in gangs. I''ll recite an example.

A group of people (all named Barney and all in pruble clothing ) decided to harass the murderer population. As a murderer, the only way to get resurrected (besides by another player) is to visit the Chaos Shrine. Well, this group of about 15-20 Barneys all grouped together around the chaos shrine. As a person was resurrected, they all proceeded to pummel him. All of these characters had no more than a 50 rating in wrestling (the max you can start with), but because there were so many, they easily vanquished the unarmed, and weakened murderers.

something like this could eaily occur in any online game unless measures are taken. In this instance, it was quite entertaining, because they were beating on the PK population, but couldn''t it reverse?

Just something to consider

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quote:
Original post by Blue*Omega

Um... isn''t that what GM''s are for?

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Blue*Omega

(Insert Witty Quote Here)


Usually, if the GM needs to step in it represents a flaw in the game. There are a few exceptions (ie, players being extremely offsensive while out of character), but generally you shouldn''t design your game to be dependent on GMs.

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Im really glad someone else mention PLANETSIDE for you to look into, sounds like a cool idea...it IS A MMOFPS. Its at the sony site so check it out.

You may want to also look into a game called INFANTRY (does the name SUBSPACE mean anything to ya). It is also a MOFPS (not too massive) but up to 50 to 100 can play in one arena at a time, and around 1000 players logged into the different servers each night. The view is top-town/Isometric ala UltimaOnline style, so didnt know what you had in mind. Currently this is a FREE game on sony site and i highly recommend you play it to get an idea of what you want. I have and the control and graphics are nice. Team play is a huge factor in winning.

The double edged sword of games like this is your lifespan. You have to be VERY creative in how players can keep items and the such WHEN they die, because they will die and probably pretty fast in a game of this nature. However, players HAVING TO become a little more accountable for actions is a very powerful thing. It could lead to the team/guild losing a base if your a stupid newbie and go out charging the field. (which happens way too often in INFANTRY) So i think there is huge potential for players of this type of game...if they can handle working in a team.

But the idea has been around a long time and your not the first to think about it.... but its still a fun idea and shouldnt stop ya from giving a go!!! GOOD LUCK MATE!

aka John M.
Never give up. Never surrender!


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BTW: I was thinking bout this whole idea and decided that taking EVERYTHING away from a player when they die would really suck, so... what if, when you die and create a new charecter that charecter "Inherits" all the items, cash, etc. that the old charecter had unless he was carrying that item at the time of his death. Example: If you have $13,000 and the charecter is carrying $3,000 at the time of death the new charecter gets $10,000.

-----------------------------

Blue*Omega

(Insert Witty Quote Here)

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If someone with good character decides that (s)he doesn''t want to play the game anymore, (s)he can go and eliminate a city as a last thing in the game world. And everyone in the city with decent characters would die. It would totally suck, so I suggest either of these:
1)forget the idea of total dying
2)or make it so that players can''t kill each other except in special arenas

Ppl play games for fun, they don''t want to get too pissed off because some 13 yo kid kills a character they''ve been developing for weeks.

As for the game otherwise, a MMOFPS would make a really cool game. It just requires unbelievebly fast servers, and because it''s a FPS, it must also have very low ping.

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Just reading quickly through the posts here...

Omega, have you tried Deus Ex? It dips very much into what you are dewlling on. But consider that you would at least have a bunch of 20 people to back you up. And then it was this story again....

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I don''t think the idea of levels would go well with a FPS. If the only weapons used by the player are guns, then stats like Strength would not aply. Defense would not work overly well either if the game were to somewhat realistic. You could realistically implement stats like Luck and Aim into it though. If you used the setting of the West, you could also try "draw speed", however this could provide somewhat of an unfair advantage for the slightly higher-level character. I think the idea of buying items is good and could add a lot to the game, as well as having different towns, however if you wanted an RPG-style level system in the game you should spend some time choosing what can reallistically be implemented in that also suits the setting.

Good idea!

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