What is worse then big rigs?
(Warning: this is a super rant post)
What is worse is a great game, but with lots of bugs!
I am talking about oblivion.
I have encountered a bug, I did some quest.
I fried my nuerons, fighting this orc hunter and when I finally killed him I discovered I couldnt finish the quest because of a bug.
Is it so hard to make a good game without any critical bugs?
I posted in the oblivion forums about this bug, and while seeing many other peoples complaining about their bugs, I understood this is hopeless.
It is not worth to play a game only to encounter these kind of bugs.
Computer science has developed enginerring methods to build programs with very few bugs. I believe, you know, UML and stuff. So is this all bullshit?
Why am I studing software engineering in the university if either what I am being taught doesnt work in the real world or either companies just dont use them in order to cut expenses or any other stuiped reason.
Say no to buggy computer games! Dont let those buggy game dealers reach your children!
Programmer time is expensive.
Careful programming requires more work (over a longer period of time) than would be required to simply 'make it work'.
Thus, few-bug programs are more expensive to create.
Games are a technology-driven market.
Taking more time would mean the technology a game is based on would be older by the time it is released.
Games are a hit-driven market.
Older technology would reduce the chance that a game would be a hit, and thus greatly decreases the chance of high profit.
Thus, bug-free games would likely make far less money, and the primary concern of a company is to make money.
Careful programming requires more work (over a longer period of time) than would be required to simply 'make it work'.
Thus, few-bug programs are more expensive to create.
Games are a technology-driven market.
Taking more time would mean the technology a game is based on would be older by the time it is released.
Games are a hit-driven market.
Older technology would reduce the chance that a game would be a hit, and thus greatly decreases the chance of high profit.
Thus, bug-free games would likely make far less money, and the primary concern of a company is to make money.
Quote:Original post by The C modest god
(Warning: this is a super rant post)
What is worse is a great game, but with lots of bugs!
I am talking about oblivion.
I have encountered a bug, I did some quest.
I fried my nuerons, fighting this orc hunter and when I finally killed him I discovered I couldnt finish the quest because of a bug.
Is it so hard to make a good game without any critical bugs?
I posted in the oblivion forums about this bug, and while seeing many other peoples complaining about their bugs, I understood this is hopeless.
It is not worth to play a game only to encounter these kind of bugs.
Computer science has developed enginerring methods to build programs with very few bugs. I believe, you know, UML and stuff. So is this all bullshit?
Why am I studing software engineering in the university if either what I am being taught doesnt work in the real world or either companies just dont use them in order to cut expenses or any other stuiped reason.
Say no to buggy computer games! Dont let those buggy game dealers reach your children!
Yes, writing bug free code is so easy. I mean, I always write games that take 2 years to develop, and they're basicly bug free, because I use UML!
No shit dude, UML isn't the answer to writing bug free code. It's the answer to developing a solid OO system, and only if you as a develop have a solid understanding of UML.
Writing 500K lines of code and expecting it to be bug free is stupid, and more important, impossible.
IT's a much anticipated guy by a large group of people/fans, and people expect way to much from developers. Just sit tight, and give the guys some time to fix their bugs.
Toolmaker
Having a totally bugless program of any size of probably wishful thinking, however I agree, I never understood how major bugs like these get past the play testers, isn't that what they're for? Maybe it worked at one point?
Mopeds. Big Rigs are huge...if one of them fit in your blind spot, you probably shouldn't be on the road. But you never know when you're going to run over a moped. Then you have all sorts of paperwork and forms and bloodtests...just a huge hassle.
CM
CM
Well, I believe these are mostly logical bugs. Bugs of bad design or bad OO.
If a character gets stuck, but basically the game works fine withuot any memory leaking or any crashing (there are also crashing bugs in oblivion), then its a bug purely of bad design.
Of course you cant excpect a game to be bug free, there will always be some bugs, but the question is, what is the magnitude of these bugs.
Are there no computer games other then oblivion that are as complex as oblivion but have a lot less bugs?
I think betsheda has messed up, there are other game companies that make games with a lot less bugs.
So it didnt have to be this way, its just a personal failure of betsheda.
If a character gets stuck, but basically the game works fine withuot any memory leaking or any crashing (there are also crashing bugs in oblivion), then its a bug purely of bad design.
Of course you cant excpect a game to be bug free, there will always be some bugs, but the question is, what is the magnitude of these bugs.
Are there no computer games other then oblivion that are as complex as oblivion but have a lot less bugs?
I think betsheda has messed up, there are other game companies that make games with a lot less bugs.
So it didnt have to be this way, its just a personal failure of betsheda.
personally, I would push for laws that would require companies to release products that meet some standard. how to set those standards? Not sure yet, but tools that break after only a few hours of common work, software that has a bug poping up commonly that actually affects how the program runs. Some NPC walking backwards or something wouldn't be a biggy, but a tax program that keeps resetting your income to -3mill or something would be considered illegal to sell.
I don't think industries should have to have laws to say how they work, but most usually do need them eventually.
I don't think industries should have to have laws to say how they work, but most usually do need them eventually.
Bethesda are well known for releasing games that are lousy with bugs. Daggerfall was absolutely pitiful without patches as I recall and even fully patched it was pretty dire. Morrowind had that wonderful issue with copy protection slowing the game to a crawl too. Without a no-CD crack my brother got all of about 5 FPS on my PC at the time.
Quote:Original post by Talroth
personally, I would push for laws that would require companies to release products that meet some standard. how to set those standards? Not sure yet, but tools that break after only a few hours of common work, software that has a bug poping up commonly that actually affects how the program runs. Some NPC walking backwards or something wouldn't be a biggy, but a tax program that keeps resetting your income to -3mill or something would be considered illegal to sell.
I don't think industries should have to have laws to say how they work, but most usually do need them eventually.
This would stifle innovation so fast that you'd be back in the seventies. I consider an OS crash rather severe. Would that mean Windows is illegal ? If you do that, you can kiss goodbye any complex piece of software or see it released in 4 years at 8 times the price point.
However, if software is directly related to a severe loss of data, you CAN seek damages.
Quote:Original post by Crazy_Vasey
Morrowind had that wonderful issue with copy protection slowing the game to a crawl too. Without a no-CD crack my brother got all of about 5 FPS on my PC at the time.
I'm still smarting from how I had to quicksave every minute just in case the game crashed. And I'm still pissed because I couldn't reach the highest rank in the Imperial Legion because that dude was willing to duel me for no reason, long before I was even in the Legion. And there was my character's nasty habit of falling through floors because he jumped and landed in the wrong way.
The worst part is that I still loved the game, which means that I want to play it RIGHT NOW. Which means exposing myself to some of these problems.
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