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SinisterUrge

Artwork feedback

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Ok guys, feedback please! http://www.skellyart.com/images/3dArt/trex.jpg http://www.skellyart.com/images/3dArt/vercingetorix.jpg http://www.skellyart.com/images/3dArt/Wolf.jpg That's the polygon count I was asked to use concerning the wolf and yes, it looks perfect when animated with deformation no being an issue.

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Looks awesome. Especially like the horseman. Imo, the T-Rex looks a little clumsy, but that's just me; you're nevertheless a better CG artist than I am ;).

Regards,

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TRex:
Anatomically impossible. Its feet rest way too far in front of its center of gravity (currently they are under his jaw). His weight is far in back of that. Also, the arms look too close to the legs, and they'd interfere with each other.

There is no sort of flow of topology in the mesh. If you look at a proper mesh, edgeloops follow muscles so they deform correctly, there is more geometry at the joints, there are only quads in deformation areas, etc. Right now there are a ton of needless triangles and no flow to the mesh, which leads to severe inefficiency and improper deformation (As well as being way to high poly currently for any game engine). It looks very sloppy, and is poor overall... you can achieve the same form with half the amount of polygons, and it'd probably look even better in a properly set up mesh.

The texture looks OK.

Gallic Horseman:
Anatomically incorrect again (we're seeing a trend here). Firstly, proportions are off, especially in arm length, hand size, foot size, some others. The shoulders are way off. The pectoral muscle leads under the deltoid (shoulder muscle), not into it. Right now the chest turns into the shoulder, which looks really strange. Also, it looks like his back is broader than his chest, which again looks strange. He has 8 abdomen muscles, which is impossible... anything greater than a 'six pack' is impossible. His bonnet string muscles on his neck look OK, but his collarbones coming from the pit of the chest look really strange, and appear to join up with the deltoid/pectorals.

The mesh is, TBH, extremely poor. First of all, why is it triangulated? Second of all, this mesh again lacks a proper topology. Topology should either follow musculature, or create an evenly deformable surface. Right now it does neither. What jumps out is his ribs... they shouldn't be modelled, they should be done via texture. Also, whats with the hair... that's not how hair is modelled. Between the horse tail and the horseman hair, you can eliminate a ton of polys while making him look much better.

Texture again is decent.

Wolf:
Easily your best model, but still needs alot of work. First, his front shoulder muscle is at the wrong place on the model, adjust the UV map or texture. And unless you have some edges following that muscle boundary, its going to be lost/distorted during animation.
The other thing you can do is make all square/cubic/4 sided surfaces rotated 45 degrees. Instead of the legs being a square in section, make them a diamond in section. This goes for the legs, tail, nose, etc., anything that should be round. You'd be amazed how much rounder a form looks.

Overall, you have enough experience that you can begin improving and refining your craft. I'd suggest the following:
If you are going to pursue creatures/humans, you need to learn anatomy. There is no way around this. You need to understand skeletons, muscles, weight, poses, locomotion, etc., to understand how a 'fictional dinosaur' moves and thus how its legs are modelled, and you need to know proper proportions and muscles to model a human.
Look at good, clean meshes. Examine how they do things (such as represent ribs), how their topology flows, their geometry distribution, etc.
Keep practicing, but make sure you're not going at things blind... make sure you get critiques, you continue improving, you get proper reference, etc.

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Original post by SinisterUrge
Your a wanker!

If I wanted "expert" feedback I'll go to a fellow professional, not an amateur know it all!

i'll just take a wild guess... and say that you didn't like what he told you ; )
but i do agree with him. your main problem is your messy wireframes, and yes it does matter how clean they are (alot!).

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Quote:
Original post by SinisterUrge
Your a wanker!

If I wanted "expert" feedback I'll go to a fellow professional, not an amateur know it all!


If you don't want to know, don't ask.
Post these in cgTalk or cgChat and you'll get an almost identical response to professor420's. His was detailed, helpful and constructive. Reply like you did above, and you'll get a swift ban from the forums. You very obviously aren't a professional, but you could at least try and act like one.

D.

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Quote:
Original post by SinisterUrge
Your a wanker!

If I wanted "expert" feedback I'll go to a fellow professional, not an amateur know it all!


Ouch!
Professor420 was just pointing out the weakness in your models.
I'm just a programmer but I work with (3d)artists all the time.
And I do agree completely.

Your models are a good starting point...
Now you should take the critics and improve.
How are you gonna improve if you just react like that?

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My bad!

Most of the feedback was great, but the anatomy isn't that bad. He does have a sixpack, not an eightpack, I found that insulting. I did use tonnes of reference material for the anatomy and the back muscles are far bigger than the torso muscles. I can choose to model some ribs if I choose to, its only a few extra polygons. As for the arms, hold out your arm and you will notice that the shoulder muscles are accurate in the model.

I realise I should have used quads instead of triangles. Its something I rectified in my latest model

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Original post by SinisterUrge
My bad!

Most of the feedback was great, but the anatomy isn't that bad. He does have a sixpack, not an eightpack, I found that insulting. I did use tonnes of reference material for the anatomy and the back muscles are far bigger than the torso muscles. I can choose to model some ribs if I choose to, its only a few extra polygons. As for the arms, hold out your arm and you will notice that the shoulder muscles are accurate in the model.

I realise I should have used quads instead of triangles. Its something I rectified in my latest model

yeah, you're right he does have a sixpack. however the main critiques for the horseman is that his hair is wasting a ton of polys, and the entire mesh is too high poly for the amoutn fo detail you have, so you could easily low the poly coutn and have it look nearly the same i think. and your t-rex model isn't bad, (alot of wasted polys though), but i say if you make him bend forward a bit his center of gravity will be fine.
and calling him a wanker (si that uk insult?) is not veyr nice, he was only trying to give you the advice you asked for.

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Original post by SinisterUrge
Your a wanker!

If I wanted "expert" feedback I'll go to a fellow professional, not an amateur know it all!

Please don't insult professionals by claiming to be their peer.

All your models are anatomically incorrect (anatomy, by the way, does not refer solely to the presence of body parts, but also to their relationship to each other - position, proportion, topology), with proportion being your weakest point. Your wolf is blocky, lacking articulation and nuance (though it's excellent for low-res, far-distance work).

A particular problem with your non-humanoids is inaccurate skeletal structure. The T-Rex's foot, for instance, lacks the clear articulation of the foot pad (the middle and rear portions of the foot of a tyrannosaurus rex, according to paeleontological data, will never intentionally touch the ground while standing/walking/running, so the bone structure reflects this to minimize load/stress; I suggest visiting a natural history museum and studying a dinosaur skeleton, if possible). The horse's legs are perfectly vertical, with no indication of the direction in which they flex when running (viewed from the fore, they should be slightly concave, with staggered angular joints and then a sharp reflex angle for the foreleg-hoof joint).

Ditto your wolf, which lacks hackles, haunches, legs (just like the horse, or a dog for easier observation). Accurately laying out polygons and textures comes second to accurately observing the nature of the thing you wish to model.

Good luck.

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