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Natrone19

Critique this......

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I would like some people to check out my help wanted post and critique it for me (its titled “New RPG” on the second page). The reason I have posted this here is because I want better response from programmers.

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you shouldn't double post like this for starters, but I'll go ahead and critique you here since it seems that you don't want anyone to break your dreams apart on your original thread.

You obviously have very little experience with this whole process. For starters, you can't expect anyone to jump on board with a project, especially one for a mass-market console, when you can't even spell check your own posts on an internet forum. This screams unprofessionalism and is a great way to lose any potential interest you may have had.

Secondly, you said you now realize that to develope for the PS3 you need a sony devkit. This is true of _any_ console on the market, not just the PS3. Furthermore, the amount of work necessary to complete a game for the PS2 is well beyond the scope of a 4 or 5 person team unless you have vast amounts of experience and expertise (I believe the Shadow of the Colossus team had 4 programmers, so it can be done). The PS2 comes with virtually *no* libraries or tools to work with. You can't even draw a triangle on the screen without writing the low-level libraries necessary.

Now, don't be discouraged, I'm just being realistic with you. Making a PC game is far more of a realistic goal to set for yourselves. But honestly, you're probably going to have to put some kind of demo together, even if it's very minimal, before you get any good response. Posting a single drawing isn't usually enough to garner support for your project, especially given that this kind of post pops up on gamedev almost daily, and is usually shot down.

Sorry if I sound harsh at all, but you asked for a critique, so that's what you got. Best of luck, don't take this too hard. Aim to make a PC game, stay focused, throw a demo together, and who knows, you may luck out.

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Since you asked, I have two problems with the posting. The first problem is an issue I have with most of the posts on that board. You don't go into nearly enough detail on your game idea. With a help wanted posting, you are selling an idea. The most important step to getting people interested in your project is to get them to fall in love with the idea behind it. They should read your post, and the first thing they should think is: "Yes I want to play that, I want to be part of making that." After you hook them, then you need to show them how the game can actually be made, and what skills you bring to the table, but the first step has to be the game idea. You are trying to get people to devote a lot of time to your project instead of someone else's or working on their own.

Some specific details from your posting:

Quote:

Brief description:
This RPG is in its early stages so some things are still being decided. The world and battle system of this game is very unique. We are also breaking free of today's standard cliché RPGs.


This is too brief, and way too generic. Sure it's early, you don't need to have all the details, but I'm sure you have something. Share it with us, convince us that it's going to be great. There has to be some reason in your mind why you want to make THIS game, you need to convey that reason.

If the battle system is "very unique" then describe it to us. That sounds like it could be a great selling point. You thought so too, which is why you brought it up, but you need to describe it to us or it doesn't help. In your mind, this battle system is probably one of the reasons you are interested in making the game, you need to use it to make us interested as well.

You say you are breaking free of RPG clichés. Give examples. Not just of what RPGs do wrong, but of what you plan to do instead. These things that bug you about existing games probably bother some of your audience as well. This is a potential way to get them invested in your idea.

The next bit describes you team and your plans, but this isn't too important until you've sold people on the project itself, more on this later.

Then we have:

Quote:

Additional Info:
Game title: .....

# of main Characters: 1

Genera: RPG

Summary of storyline: it is 2006 and it is Jerome’s 15th birthday. Just another day in a kid’s life that is not old enough to drive, but when he goes to sleep that night something weird happens. He dreams that he is in a different world one of magic and mystery. In this dream he finds a woman on the brink of death. This woman states that soon the world he is in now will collide with Jerome’s reality and form a whole new planet. One of which his laws of physics and their limits of magic knows no end. Upon hearing this, the dream fades and Jerome is woken up by his loud alarm clock by his bed. It reads 10:00 a.m. he sighs and rolls out of bed. He walks into his bathroom and prepares for another day of school oblivious of the dream he just had. He walks down stairs with his book bag in hand. Walking over to the couch he plops down and switches on the T.V. to get the weather. An urgent news flash comes on screen and he switches the channel. Only to find another urgent news flash on screen, deciding to see what the fuss is about he lets the reporter talk. The T.V. shows a white male reporter of average looks hysterically pointing at a circular image in the sky. He breathlessly states, “As you can see people this is unheard of it seems that there is another planet next to ours that has suddenly appeared out of no where!” Jerome drops the remote and instantly has a flash back of his vivid dream. He continues to stare at the T.V as the reporter goes on, not believing what he is hearing. “Could this be? Was his dream real?”

Keep in mind this summary is the basic overview, so there is more detail to the story.

here is one of the concepts for the main character. Its not totally finished so I will update it when it is.

Concept done by: Ysanau (deviantart.com)


The story is a good start. In fact I would have put this much earlier in the post. It's a little hard to read though as a huge block of text. Break it up into paragraphs. And some of the sentences don't make a lot of sense: "One of which his laws of physics and their limits of magic knows no end." I figured out what I think that means, but it's hard to read.

When I saw your post the other day, I had pretty much given up on it when I got this far down, so after a couple sentences I didn't even read the story. When I read it just now it's actually fairly interesting though.

I'd start with that story first. Shorten it a bit and break it into paragraphs. Then follow up with a description of the setting and the plot. You don't need a lot of details here, mostly just give us the broad strokes. If you have thought of a few details here and there you can put some in to catch interest.

Then go into game play. What is fun about your game? What is new and different? Describe that battle systems you have thought of. Show your new ideas for approaching an RPG. Remember that you are not trying to sell this game to players right now, you are trying to sell it to investors. You are looking for people to invest vast amounts of time, and you want to attract quality people. It's ok to share details that would spoil the game for a player. It's also ok if the details change by the time you actually ship.

Ok, so lets say you sold us the idea and now we are hooked. This is going to be a great project and we can't wait to get started. Now we come to the second issue you face. You need to show people how you reasonably expect to get this done.

I actually don't have any problem with people trying to recruit for an MMO or a console game. But the more ambitious your project is, the more work you will need to do to show how it is feasible.

Part of this is going to be about skills. If you can say "I have skill X" or "my team has people with skills Y and Z" then that says something about how likely you are to accomplish your goals. Showing previous work or even better work on the project can help here. Your concept art is a step in the right direction.

If your project involves something unusual and difficult for inde developers then you will have to address the issue specifically. And you will be judged by people on your response. For example: using someone else's IP, getting access to console dev tools and licenses, using expensive hardware, anything that would require a team of 50 in the professional world, etc. The experienced people, that would be most valuable to your team, will know these things are hard. And most potential members won't post questions, they'll just move on to the next post.

So to wrap this up. First sell the idea. If people aren't excited about making the game, they won't care if you can finish or not. Then show them why it will work, how you can pull it off. Try to identify concerns that people are likely to have and address them before they have them. Read through your post as if you are a person looking for a team to join. Pretend you know nothing else about the project than what is in the post. Then ask yourself if you would be excited about the project. Ask yourself what concerns you would have.

This is hard stuff. Selling people on an idea is not easy. You are going to have to market your ideas and yourself. And this won't stop once you have a team. You are going to have to keep marketing the game to other people. As an inde, players will automatically assume your game is not as good as whatever crap EA put out this week. You have to convince them otherwise, or you can have the best game in the world and no one will play it.

I hope this didn't come off as too harsh. I've just seen too many posts with no information in them recently in help wanted. I'm sure some of these people have interesting ideas, but they don't share them and they don't get any useful replies. This is probably better than the flames we used to have in there, but it's still sad.

Good luck on your project and I hope you find the people you need. We can always use more good RPGs.

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Thank you very much! This feedback has helped me tremendously! Some pointers I want to clarify though is:

1. We are not attempting to make this game for the console right now. I only stated our future goals were to make it for the console (later on down the road). After some extensive research and advice from people on here I understand how hard it is to make a console game (I know that all console systems require a dev kit). We are actually trying to make a PC demo.

2. I have been spell checking my information before posting. I am sorry if I may have missed a word or typed to fast and spelled it wrong.

3. I don't really see how this is a double post, since my last question (in this forum) was directed towards programmers. This post was directed towards everyone and pertained just to critiquing my help wanted add. If you still think this is a double post, then I am sorry for doing it. I am not on here to offend anyone. I just want to understand what way is correct and what way is not.

4. My team actually has the game mechanics completely mapped out. I just did not know if it was a good idea, to post my idea. I will make the corrections you have pointed out by tonight.

Thank you again for your information. If you or anyone else has any other information to tell then please do. It would be great if you could review my help wanted add after my corrections.

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Quote:
Original post by Natrone19
2. I have been spell checking my information before posting. I am sorry if I may have missed a word or typed to fast and spelled it wrong.


Grammar check is important too.

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