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LongInteger

[web] New to webdesign, how would i go about doing this?

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Hi there, im trying to design a site and im wondering . . . since everyone is saying frames are not the way to go, how would i do a site where the nav bar sticks and isnt loaded every single time i click a link on the site and a content page is the only thing that changes. what topics should i be looking at cos im coming up empty, i know xhtml and how to use what i think atm are simple style sheets. thanks

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If you aren't using frames, then each part of the web page will HAVE to be re-downloaded each time the page is refreshed (The browser's cache control plays a part in this, but you cannot be sure of any such thing while making a public website).

If you are using PHP to make the websites, you can simply save the contents of the menubar or any other static part of the website in a separate page and use PHP's include() function to include the file in each of your web pages. That way, if you want to edit the menubar, you can simply edit that separate file and the changes will be seen on every page that includes it.

If you are using HTML only, then you are left with just two choices, both which aren't good enough. One, is using a frameset. XHTML 1.0 has a FRAMESET DOCTYPE, so you can be assured that it isn't invalid. The second option is if you don't want to use frames, and that would be manually adding the HTML for the menubar in each HTML page, which is going to make the code confusing as well as difficult to maintain because you will have to edit each page to make any changes to the menu.

Edit: I'm sorry if I misinterpretted your question, I may have drifted a bit off-topic...

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both replys are good and god im not one of those dont first search google, then look for active forums, then use the faqs and then finally post here. The second poster thank you very much, i have just learnt to a beginning/intermediate book xhtml and well aware of the frameset option. the problem is i use dreamwaever for fast editing and when refresh, even thos i have o spacings in all the borders u can still move the damn frame.

Php as you say seems to be the answer, in the few hours since the post its looking quite powerful that thing, but an undertaking to get any god at it quick, the language looks as in depth as c++ . . .which im only reasonably ok at

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IMO, PHP is not all that difficult if you know the concepts of programming (i,e variables, functions, and a bit about classes).

I've done PHP for almost a year now, and learning C++ for the past 2 weeks, and I can definitely say that I found PHP child's play as compared to C++. And if you just want to use it for basic stuff right now like helping it to improve your website rather than create full fledged PHP web applications interacting with databases, then I think you can pick it up in less than a week's time.

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Quote:
Original post by LongInteger
Hi there, im trying to design a site and im wondering . . . since everyone is saying frames are not the way to go, how would i do a site where the nav bar sticks and isnt loaded every single time i click a link on the site and a content page is the only thing that changes.

what topics should i be looking at cos im coming up empty, i know xhtml and how to use what i think atm are simple style sheets.

thanks


If you're trying to save on bandwidth by not downloading the entire page all the time, then you can only do that with Frames or AJAX.


Otherwise if you're trying to save on maintenance by keeping the layout and content seperate, PHP etc will help with that.

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If you are looking to save badnwidth via AJAX, check this out.

Other than that, if you just want a static part of your website for easy managing purposes, don't use AJAX. AJAX should mainly be used for dynamic content on your web page without reloading the page, not for static content with reloading!

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Quote:
Original post by Sander
Frames are bad for usability (forward/nack buttons misbehave), accessibility (screen readers have trouble with them) and search robots (lower google ranking).


Not to mention there are issues when trying to bookmark/add-to-favourites a framed page.

AJAX suffers from similar usability issues, however I am aware of more workarounds for it than for frames. Still, if you have to refresh the majority of the page, it's probably not worth the trouble to make a usable, accessible AJAX request to do that. In most cases it will probably make more sense to refresh the entire page.

On the issue of saving bandwidth, one of the most important things is intelligent compression of pages being sent from the server (and yes I know IE sucks and has issues with gzip.) Also, I've become quite fond of sending xml to the client and having the client transform it via xslt to xhtml. This has the potential to save a lot of bandwidth as well. If the client doesn't support xslt, you can just transform it on the server and send out regular xhtml.

Howver, right now, as a beginner, you shouldn't really be concerned with bandwidth at all. Instead, start working only with HTML, and then CSS. Once you know how to use these effectively together you will be prepared to move on to effectively implementing more technology, like PHP.

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