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Adriac

Looking to set up a team of beginners

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To help us all learn I'm making an MMORPG called Fate of Athorok. It is a game with first person combat in an MMORPG. Through the project we can learn more about specific things we do and if the game turns out good we may even sell it in retail stores. I am a game designer, we could use a couple more. We need all the people and talent we can get to make it a success or even just to make it. Please post on here or PM me for more info or if youre interested in joining the team. We will learn and maybe make a successful game.

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Original post by Adriac
To help us all learn


It won't.

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I'm making an MMORPG


No, you aren't. Not with any measure of success.

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called Fate of Athorok. It is a game with first person combat in an MMORPG. Through the project we can learn more about specific things we do and if the game turns out good we may even sell it in retail stores.


Not going to happen. The game won't turn out at all, certainly not with this level of planning.

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I am a game designer,


No, you aren't. Not in a sense that *means* anything, anyway. A real designer would have a real plan. You know, a *design*?

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we could use a couple more. We need all the people and talent we can get to make it a success or even just to make it.


So you're looking for beginners, why, exactly?

Oh, and BTW, even if this seemed to be the tiniest bit legitimate, I would still have to tell you you're in the wrong forum. This kind of stuff goes in Help Wanted, where incidentally they have a template/checklist for the initial posts that would remind you of a *lot* of things you need to think about and *clearly* haven't.

Sorry.

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Although Zahlman put it a bit harshly, he is very right. I once saw the beauty in making the next best-selling MMORPG too, but quickly turned away from that after seeing how much time/planning it takes to even create a simple 2D networked shooter. It really won't hurt if you aim to start with a much smaller project, especially if you are looking to form a 'beginning' team. By immediately starting with such a huge project as an MMORPG it is very doubtful that you will learn anything other than how to take a lot of frustration.

It may not be what you wish to hear, but Zahlman's comments do benefit you in the long run ;)

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First off I do have a design, this is what I decided to start with as to not give the whole thing away right off the bat. Second I want beginners to help them learn. Third I think you're flaming MMORPGs, if you don't like em you don't havta tell the world. Also I came here because beginners are more likely to be here than the Help Wanted forum.

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Third I think you're flaming MMORPGs, if you don't like em you don't havta tell the world.


He's not flaming MMORPG's at all - you just missed his point. MMORPG's take lots of people, many years, and millions of dollars to write - the chance of a team of beginners making on is exactly nill. Start off making a space invaders clone, and then see how far you get. If your team actually manages to finish it then try something 3D and so on. Starting with an MMORPG is like saying "I want to learn to read so I'm going to start by reading acienct chinese texts on scrolls in dim light while someone is beating me over the heat with a baseball bat". Basically you won't learn anything :P

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First off I do have a design, this is what I decided to start with as to not give the whole thing away right off the bat.

Ideas are a dime a dozen. You don't lose anything by giving it away. On the other hand, it's hard enough to get people interested in your idea to begin with, so you are more likely to find people if you post very detailed information about the project.

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Why? Why does every beginner team want to do an mmorgp? I understand that some beginners may be ignorant of the complexity of one (heck, I used to think C++ had a drawimage command); but after 1.2592 x 10 ^ 29250 posts of beginner teams wanting to start an mmorpg, I'd think the word would get out...

But on the flip side, I'm sure that your design is good, Adriac, but only from a gameplay perspective. Do you know how to code C++? If so, think about how you'd code all of that, draw the art, and maintain some uber servers.

I'd recommend that instead, you try to form a beginner team to make something a bit more complicated than a space shooter; although theres nothing wrong with starting with one :). How about a simple top down shooter... oh wait, that is essentially a space shooter... ah well; you really should try something not as complex as a mmorpg.

Now I don't mean this with any spite, but if you think about it, I'm sure that you'd agree with us/me that a bunch of beginners coding an mmorpg is really just not feasible.

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Actually I know nothing of programming, I am looking to find something to teach me graphics programming but I primarily just like designing games. I would agree that a beginner team designing an MMO would be farfetched but look at it this way.

Group of people start off easy with some basic things like interface, maps, maybe some animation. They finish the game which turns out to be really nice with the gameplay elements all working right etc. Beta version comes and people like it, then we work on the MMO coding after the game is complete and more is learned during it.

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Mandatory link.

Read that, and the postmortems it links to.

Long story short, your dream MMORPG isn't going to happen. At least, not with a team of beginners working with each other over the internet. The only thing that this would result in is lots of discouraged beginners.

Zahlman speaks truth.

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contrary to the popular belief, mmo's dont really take thousands and thousands of dollars to make or teams of people. an mmorpg just defines a persistent world that is capable of supporting a large player base. there are tons of one-man mmorpgs out there, bare in mind the majority of them dont have graphics like mainstream ones, but they are still mmorpgs nontheless

the thing is to create a one-man mmo you need to do everything yourself, from the graphics to the programming, and to be able to do all that you would need to be more or less, obsessed and put everything before it.. and even then i suspect it would take roughly 2-3 years to complete (not 3d)

(edit)

you should check out mirage source and learn visual basic or c#

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may I say realmcrafter .

That has the cost of $55 for engine. More if you want to edit engine ( ~100 ). But it is possible for a one-man team.

[quote]It is a game with first person combat in an MMORPG.[quote]
Nope. You can't have a MMOFPS. You would need super strong servers.

But if you want approach it form c++, trust us forget it for like 5 years. You apperantely don't know c++, so... I recommend learning it if you do want to. And you want beginners to make it. That will never happen. If they can make MMOFPS, then they are not beginners.

Sorry.

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Original post by Adriac
Group of people start off easy with some basic things like interface, maps, maybe some animation. They finish the game which turns out to be really nice with the gameplay elements all working right etc. Beta version comes and people like it, then we work on the MMO coding after the game is complete and more is learned during it.


You're making a huge jump there, from basic things to finishing a game and having all gameplay elements working together like a charm. These basic things may take some time, especially if you want to understand how to do them well. But the insight required to create a fun game and the workload it takes to finish it is often measured on another scale entirely.

I've been a programmer for about 3+ years, and I'm now working on a simple mobile game (think 2D puzzle game). But that's taking several months already now, especially the last stage of getting the game past the quality assurance tests. This is mainly due to being unfamiliar with mobile development and such test processes, even though I have various years of programming experience.

Of course, you're not me, so perhaps you'll pick it up much faster. Nonetheless, there are just too many hidden pitfalls along the path of game-development, so just take one step at a time for now. MMORPG's are huge, complex undertakings, and you'll find that even simple platform games can get pretty complex, especially when you're just starting out. Do yourself a favor and learn in smaller, doable steps. I'm not bashing your idea or your intentions, I'm telling you from personal experience how easy it is to underestimate such projects. Because the only thing you'll learn from failure is how not to do it, and it's usually not an encouraging experience. :)

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Original post by Adriac
First off I do have a design, this is what I decided to start with as to not give the whole thing away right off the bat. Second I want beginners to help them learn. Third I think you're flaming MMORPGs, if you don't like em you don't havta tell the world. Also I came here because beginners are more likely to be here than the Help Wanted forum.


Zahlman wasn't responding negatively to your post due to any issues with MMORPGs per se, he was responding to your post because you're the fifty millionth clueless person to post something like this, and it's painfully obvious that you're out of your depth.

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