Idea for melee & hth combat
Here''s the gist: For an RPG, we''re essentially talking turn-based Tekken with many different fighters. 3D, with blocks, dodges, feints, and manuevering, but with action points representing costs for moves.
Details: No more standing around watching hit and miss animations until somebody dies! If you''re gonna have to fight endlessles, why not make it more interesting?
All the normal RPG conventions would apply: You''d hit based on skill. Move order would be based on initiative. But combat would be a lot more detailed.
Combat could potentially involve dozens of characters at once. You could interrupt attacks (block, grab, throw), and set up combos. Setting up combos would be akin to scripted moves, and run the same risk as in real-time fighting games: namely, that your strategy could be anticipated and countered.
The idea is to use this with an RPG to make combat more exciting. Think it''d work?
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Just waiting for the mothership...
Great, I''ve had thoughts on this before.
As the hits based on skill, make it more representative, for example the first time anybody attempts a spin-kick-fly-o-rama, they are going to end up on their butt, why not add that stuff in. As your character improves, the more likely you''ll land your blows effectively with out screwing up.
You''ll have a hard time fluking out a win against somebody way better than you if your missing hits and kicks all the time, gives you incentive tostay on your level.
As the hits based on skill, make it more representative, for example the first time anybody attempts a spin-kick-fly-o-rama, they are going to end up on their butt, why not add that stuff in. As your character improves, the more likely you''ll land your blows effectively with out screwing up.
You''ll have a hard time fluking out a win against somebody way better than you if your missing hits and kicks all the time, gives you incentive tostay on your level.
hehe great minds think alike... currently in development for my rpg... considering a possible realtime mode also for a Blade of Darkness style feel. would be great to have the option for either. 
Hmm...
I too have thought about this idea before, and I'm not quite sure what I think about it.
I think that it could be fun to watch if it was carried out independantly of the player.. but you could have an option to speed it up and just show you the most important parts of combat (ie. skip most of the animations).
Ie. If they are close enough to engage in hand to hand, you can click hand to hand and watch them fight. (Think of film: The Matrix).
You would be able to SEE the difference between character's skill levels!
At times you would be able to move your character around the area to gain tactical advantages, or click on different icons [for ease of use].
For example.
Throw : gives you a cursor to aim where you want to throw them.
Jump: ....
Takedown: (sweep ? headbutt?)
Edited by - Ketchaval on March 18, 2001 3:09:02 PM
I too have thought about this idea before, and I'm not quite sure what I think about it.
I think that it could be fun to watch if it was carried out independantly of the player.. but you could have an option to speed it up and just show you the most important parts of combat (ie. skip most of the animations).
Ie. If they are close enough to engage in hand to hand, you can click hand to hand and watch them fight. (Think of film: The Matrix).
You would be able to SEE the difference between character's skill levels!
At times you would be able to move your character around the area to gain tactical advantages, or click on different icons [for ease of use].
For example.
Throw : gives you a cursor to aim where you want to throw them.
Jump: ....
Takedown: (sweep ? headbutt?)
Edited by - Ketchaval on March 18, 2001 3:09:02 PM
I definitely think that if the balance between Ease of Use and Complexity was got right that this system could be a lot of fun!
Ie. It could be fun to have lots of moves [but maybe just the main options would do ie. punch kick sweep]
Yet, you would have to be careful to avoid making the fights really long and boring.. [ ie. ken blocks, ryu jumps back etc]. So many enemies could be quite easy to despatch.. just a few hit points.
You could get more environmental interaction into a turn-based system. Picking up scenery. etc.
Ie. It could be fun to have lots of moves [but maybe just the main options would do ie. punch kick sweep]
Yet, you would have to be careful to avoid making the fights really long and boring.. [ ie. ken blocks, ryu jumps back etc]. So many enemies could be quite easy to despatch.. just a few hit points.
You could get more environmental interaction into a turn-based system. Picking up scenery. etc.
Use of macros would be a good way to get around this obstacle (the long and boring fight potential .. i.e. Shamrock/Severn UFC superfight lol) Also having an adjustble speed and a fighting style dispostion may be useful also... In other words having the ability to setup a fight plan which may be aborted at anytime. Just some ideas based on experience 
For example you are fighting in an area where Ground-tactics are unlikely because of several opponents .. You adjust your fight plan accordingly and reduce the chances of going to the ground voluntarily to virtually nil. Then ... If you are grappled during the altercation, your grappling skills would come into play or you could intervene manually if you wanted 100% control. The use of macros in a piority situational ordering would be most effective In speeding general combat. Any thoughts?
For example you are fighting in an area where Ground-tactics are unlikely because of several opponents .. You adjust your fight plan accordingly and reduce the chances of going to the ground voluntarily to virtually nil. Then ... If you are grappled during the altercation, your grappling skills would come into play or you could intervene manually if you wanted 100% control. The use of macros in a piority situational ordering would be most effective In speeding general combat. Any thoughts?
I don''t know about this one. Ketchaval raises a very important point when he mentions Ease of Use vs. Complexity. I think this is a major concern, and I''m not sure whether you could get around it.
Also, I think that something like this would make tremendous demands on a fighting engine. I generally feel that the designer should challenge the game''s programmers, but this may be just too much. Is it possible to make a game engine which could handle the physics, graphics, multiplayer and other necessary considerations, and still run at a decent speed on lower-end computers?
Perhaps I''m not clear on the idea. But if you mean to use a fighting engine in an RPG, I think the typical 3D fighting engine would be insufficient.
It might be more feasible to use a 2D fighting or sidescrolling engine. I don''t like the idea of designing based on programming restrictions. But Mad Keith''s quote is appropriate here. The designer does need to appreciate the limitations, after all.
That being said, I think that if you could pull this off, it would be great. But you might also want to keep in mind that not all fighting game fans like RPGs. And not all RPG fans enjoy fighting games. These two genres make very different demands of the player. And despite the fact that I would love to play a game like this, not everyone would.
(By the way, has everyone checked the e-mail recently?)
~ Jonathon
Also, I think that something like this would make tremendous demands on a fighting engine. I generally feel that the designer should challenge the game''s programmers, but this may be just too much. Is it possible to make a game engine which could handle the physics, graphics, multiplayer and other necessary considerations, and still run at a decent speed on lower-end computers?
Perhaps I''m not clear on the idea. But if you mean to use a fighting engine in an RPG, I think the typical 3D fighting engine would be insufficient.
It might be more feasible to use a 2D fighting or sidescrolling engine. I don''t like the idea of designing based on programming restrictions. But Mad Keith''s quote is appropriate here. The designer does need to appreciate the limitations, after all.
That being said, I think that if you could pull this off, it would be great. But you might also want to keep in mind that not all fighting game fans like RPGs. And not all RPG fans enjoy fighting games. These two genres make very different demands of the player. And despite the fact that I would love to play a game like this, not everyone would.
(By the way, has everyone checked the e-mail recently?)
~ Jonathon
I think for something like this I wouldn''t care if Fighting Game fans liked it or not. Only RPG players (and fans of tactical strategy games like X-Com or Jagged Alliance, which are rich in options for ranged combat but usually lacking in hand to hand).
Fighting Game fans wouldn''t play this because it''d be WAAAAAY too slow.
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Just waiting for the mothership...
Fighting Game fans wouldn''t play this because it''d be WAAAAAY too slow.
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Just waiting for the mothership...
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