Why is all the new Microsoft technology C# junk?

r1tual · 2006-12-15T09:38:54

I thought ASP was maybe worthwhile to start learning. C# and VB are the only real supported languages. I thought the Windows Presentation Foundation and the rest of AVALON looked like it would be a step up from Winsock2 and WIN32. The only real supported languages are VB and C#. .NET FRAMEWORK 3.0, built for C# programmers. Why arent these things built for C++ programmers? Something about C# turns me off, so I have not tried to use any of these new technologies. They say C++\CLI is supported in some cases but documentation is NILL. And why C++/CLI and not C++? Are the CLI extensions necessary? I dont think so. At least from what I see. What gives and what is wrong with C++? Why was C# invented? And why does Microsoft like it so much? It makes me sick. And are there people out there that actually know C#? What planet do they come from?

For Beginners

Started by r1tual December 14, 2006 06:50 PM

85 comments, last by Sneftel 17 years, 4 months ago

Deranged

668

December 14, 2006 08:56 PM

Quote:Original post by r1tual
I see features advertised with .NET like being able to integrate .NET programs into webpages. Using them to connect to .NET passport for their fancy smancy "authentication". Using them to write programs that you dont need adminstrator privelages to run. Using them to write Secure programs. Network programs. BLAH BLAH the list goes on.

I have not seen ONE program that uses any of these .NET features.

I bet if I uninstalled .NET framework from my computer I would not see any interruption when I tried to run any sort of program anywhere or goto any webpage etc. on the NET (Other then if I browsed to hotmail.com or something).

I bet half the queries that come up on a search engine are probably to the tune of people talking about "C# sucks" and "How the hell do I use it" and "Why do we need to use C#" and "Just what benefit does C# give us can I just use C++ please".

Goto any C# developer community and in my opinion its more fun to watch grass grow.

You ever watch a Microsoft C# webcast? What a obfuscated and confusing mess they try to teach people. They wonder why noone uses C#. And I can bet money the C\C++ community is 10X larger at LEAST.

You just don't know when to quit do you? Your rating is falling, everyone who has replied has basically written you off as yet another idiotic noob. You've been completely wrong almost every point you've attempted to make. Through all of this, we have been on IRC making fun of you.

Quit while you're behind.

GenuineXP

262

December 14, 2006 08:58 PM

Quote:Original post by r1tual

You ever watch a Microsoft C# webcast? What a obfuscated and confusing mess they try to teach people. They wonder why noone uses C#. And I can bet money the C\C++ community is 10X larger at LEAST.

I'm not too sure about this, but I think I've read elsewhere that C# isn't as proprietary as most people think. (I mention this because you seem to dislike Microsoft and therefore must also dislike C# as well.)

Sure, Microsoft helped greatly to develop the language and created a library/platform to run it on (.NET/CLI), but language decisions now ride on a committee. Of course, MS is a part of this committee, but they do not control the language. (Someone please correct me if I'm wrong here.)

Promit

13,404

December 14, 2006 08:59 PM

Quote:Original post by Dragon88
When I said algorithms, I meant algorithms in the terms the computer sees them in. I have worked with assembly language quite a bit, so when I'm looking at a problem, my mind somewhat translates it into the terms a computer will see it in.

I'm not sure how I feel about that. I do feel that the low level nuts and bolts are important (I have invested a large amount of my time into performance engineering, after all), but I tend to feel that the high level stuff is just as important and probably more so.

Quote:With that said, I may very well be better off in a functional language, however I have examined both Haskell and ML, and find them both to be ugly beyond comprehension.

No argument here.

SlimDX | Ventspace Blog | Twitter | Diverse teams make better games. I am currently hiring capable C++ engine developers in Baltimore, MD.

r1tual

100

Author

December 14, 2006 09:01 PM

No I actually like Microsoft. I use Windows VIsta and Visual Studio 2005. I have used Microsoft products since DOS and WIN 3.1.

Game Institute student for life.

Cypher19

768

December 14, 2006 09:03 PM

Quote:Original post by r1tual
Why cant we have one universal programming language?

For the same reason we don't have crescent wrenches with hammers attached to the handle. It's much better to have one tool for a job than try to wield two at the same time when you're only really using one.

Deranged

668

December 14, 2006 09:05 PM

Quote:Original post by r1tual
No I actually like Microsoft. I use Windows VIsta and Visual Studio 2005. I have used Microsoft products since DOS and WIN 3.1.

That's not the point of this thread. The point of this thread is that you are wrong and unwilling to admit it. You said that nobody uses C#, you were shown to be wrong there. You said that it would be hard to pick up even with a knowledge of C++, proven wrong there too. Yet, you have given NO proof at ALL to give your side any ground.

You fail.

smr

2,468

December 14, 2006 09:06 PM

Quote:Original post by r1tual
I want to use these technolgoies now. It makes me want to throw my computer out the window knowing I have to sit down for 6 hours to wrack my brain around C#. 6 hours too long in my opinion.

God forbid you have to dedicate six whole hours to learning your "craft." What the hell are all of these people doing in college, anyway? I learned C++ template metaprogramming in three hours and even had time to take porn breaks while my code was compiling.

And if you'd give those sissy languages like C#, VB.NET or even classic VB a chance, maybe you'd discover that with the time you save not fudging with MFC, ATL and/or Windows API garbage, you'd make up those six hours on your first project.

MaulingMonkey

1,729

December 14, 2006 09:08 PM

Quote:Original post by r1tual
I bet if I uninstalled .NET framework from my computer I would not see any interruption when I tried to run any sort of program anywhere or goto any webpage etc. on the NET (Other then if I browsed to hotmail.com or something).

Ignoring Microsoft's products, I know neither my ATI Control Center (which I use to swap my dual monitors between modes depending on what I'm working on), nor Paint.NET (some freeware product unrelated to the Microsoft Paint except in name) would continue to work without .NET. Webpages using .NET will be relying mostly (entirely?) on server-side .NET, so having it installed on your computer isn't really relevant there.

Quote:I bet half the queries that come up on a search engine are probably to the tune of people talking about "C# sucks" and "How the hell do I use it" and "Why do we need to use C#" and "Just what benefit does C# give us can I just use C++ please".

Sure, if 95% of the queries that come up on a search engine for C++ are "lol fast in overexaggerated benchmark", "How do I quash this bug in my C++ program?", and rants about C++ sucking.

In more seriousness, the biggest time sink here on the general programming forums for me is replying to reoccuring bugs that many people don't even know how begin diagnosing in C++, whereas the C# equivilant would be throwing an exception which gives them enough information to figure it out themselves.

ssrun

157

December 14, 2006 09:17 PM

Could it be that if more people switched to C# or VB.Net then it will be less people who have the skills to really understand how an OS may work at the low level. That might mean less people hacking Windows therefore making Windows more "secure". It's just a thought I came up with as I also don't really find C++ that hard to work with. When it boils down, you gotta learn what you need to get the job done, if that means learn C# then so be it. If you only need to know C++ then by all means learn that.

My point is that knowing the syntax of a language doesn't make you a better programmer. I personally find that if you can right complex programs in C++ then you have very good programming logic but I'm a comp-sci student who likes to know the low level details so I try to avoid very high level languages unless I need to know it for work or something but not because of general interest.

Promit

13,404

December 14, 2006 09:19 PM

Quote:Original post by MaulingMonkey
In more seriousness, the biggest time sink here on the general programming forums for me is replying to reoccuring bugs that many people don't even know how begin diagnosing in C++, whereas the C# equivilant would be throwing an exception which gives them enough information to figure it out themselves.

Segmentation fault

SlimDX | Ventspace Blog | Twitter | Diverse teams make better games. I am currently hiring capable C++ engine developers in Baltimore, MD.

Why is all the new Microsoft technology C# junk?

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