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Help Wanted posts

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it bugs me to apply for a project that 'seems' interesting then being told they dont have a design document, and they only start planning the project WHEN they have a team, WTF?

This is orthogonal to the issue of MMOs, and it is a risk you take when applying to work on a hobbyist project. Besides, your logic isn't even accurate. A huge portion of project planning is based upon knowing your logical budget -- which isn't just money, it also includes the capabilities of the team. There's no point in planning for certain types of features if none of the programmers you've attracted would be able to implement them in time. So it's not realistic to expect people to have planned out everything up front.

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instead of posting after a certain amount of time, you can only post a help wanted IF you have some screen shots of work

This is a pointless and arbitrary restriction, just like ratings or post count threshold, and it's even easier to circumvent. Just accept the reality of the market you're working in -- mismanaged hobby teams are the norm.

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^^^

A design document of the actual game, what the game is about, not the technical specifications of the game features! Most projects I have asked about dont have a decent plan, they say, "oh yes, a landscape with a few soldier on it" lol

this place is a complete joke to me now.

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Original post by DarkMast3r
^^^

A design document of the actual game, what the game is about, not the technical specifications of the game features! Most projects I have asked about dont have a decent plan, they say, "oh yes, a landscape with a few soldier on it" lol

this place is a complete joke to me now.



You'll find topics of interest and those of non. Topics are made by a variety of designers, both new and old, and apparently alot of new game lead designers are fresh to the recruitment process, so cut them some slack. See it? Ignore it, if it's not to your interest.

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"Not every post in Help Wanted from a new account is a newbie MMORPG project. We have had people from existing, live, ambitious but doable projects come and solicit help on their first day. Some of these people have stayed and been productive members of the community, which probably wouldn't have happened if we did that kind of filtering."


This is exactly what happened to me, though I'm not sure if you could call me a productive member of the community. I think, really, all you have to do is take some time to make sure your post is well-thought and written properly.

One thing we did on an amateur game forum I used to post at... We'd have game progress/advertisement topics, where you'd post screenshots, story info, gameplay stff, etc... there was an "advanced" and "normal" forum and the mods decided which topic went where.

"Advanced" topics were just ones that looked good and were done correctly.

Something similar could be done here, though I don't know how well it'd actually work. Topics that appear to have promise or were just done well could be put in some sort of "better" forum. This would encourage people to use these good topics as an example.

Oooorrr, it just might make for a lot of arguing. But I thought I'd mention it!

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Original post by DarkMast3r
this place is a complete joke to me now.

I think that's how its beginning to look. The credibility of the Help Wanted forum takes a hit when it's full of virtual beginners shooting for a genre that is technically and logistically way beyond them.

Then again what can be done about it? this site is about indie game development, so everyone with an imagination should be allowed to try.

maybe split it into two Help Wanted forums: "MMORPG Help Wanted", and "Realistic Help Wanted" :).

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I've been reading these forums for almost a year now, but only recently finally got a membership.

I just wanted to add there are some good ideas about improving the Help Wanted forums. Quite honestly, I enjoy reading what people are trying to do and the ideas they come up with. It can be a bit monotonous sometimes (lot of the same), and some sort of filter would help.

I'm a beginner myself when it comes to development, with no experience. But I am currently working on my own small, first project with a few other members of my team. Using these forums to find help has been great for us.

It would be nice to have some sort of format/template system in place. Sometimes I like to find what the seasoned vets are working on and follow their projects but that can be hard to find the way the current forum works. Being able to filter by experience, genre, team/studio, and paid/unpaid projects would be awesome.

I think this is place is quite incredible in what it provides though, and would not want to see them limit the flow of people into the community, even if they are only 1-monthers. I think a filter/template system for that forum would help a lot though.

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I've worked on a couple of Help Wanted things, and really enjoyed it. It's a good way to get some experience in your area, and an even better way to get used to working with different people with different styles and methods of communicating what they want of you. (Like the real world!)

As far as requiring a group to have screenshots of some sort - No! That's not all the Help Wanted forum should be doing. It should damn well be there to help a group of talented - and ambitious - folks start up a game!

It's also wrong to require a design document. Ownership is a big part of getting a team to work - and stay - together. Yes, you can try to sell your fully-fleshed-out idea to the board, but what's wrong with having something less than a design doc? It's a squad RTS with dragons, unicorns, and vampires. Wanna join up? That, combined with the rest of Kaz's posting template (It's in C++, 2D isometric, non-profit non-commercial...), should be all an aspiring team is required to provide at the start.

There are things I would like to see improved, of course - some on the part of GameDev staff, and some on the part of its community:

Don't trash the new kids (too much).
So the gameplay is too ambitious! Maybe at least a couple of them will learn new skills and figure out how to work together. Maybe they'll keep at it and improve. Sure, point out that their setup won't be able to hand fifty, much less five hundred players, but it isn't necessary to point out (especially over and over and over again) that they are (IYHO) bound to fail miserably.

Labels, and sorting. Assuming this were implemented in the next version of the fora (some day - no rush), it could be an effective way of sorting through Help Wanted threads.

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MMO projects posted in HW as of today will be required to tag thier thread title with "[MMO]" so that those of you not interested will be better able to avoid them.

Expect some further changes over the next day or two.


...and Patrick, if you're still reading this thread I havn't forgotten your guide, I'll get back to you soon.

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Quote:
Original post by Kazgoroth
MMO projects posted in HW as of today will be required to tag thier thread title with "[MMO]" so that those of you not interested will be better able to avoid them.


Balancing out 9/11's karma, eh?

I may start lurking that forum again :)

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Quote:
Original post by Kazgoroth
MMO projects posted in HW as of today will be required to tag their thread title with "[MMO]" so that those of you not interested will be better able to avoid them.
Just [MMO]? Not [Amazing MMO]?

I wonder how many people will mis-spell MMO...

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