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What are your thoughts about C#? Is it a potential threat to Java? Do you use it? Why (not)? Is it a "good" language? What are its shortcomings? Or is it just another clever MS-strategy to control the web...? Or is it the future? ;-)

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The only reason C# exists is because MS can''t use Java now. Way to drop the ball on that one MS.

Threat to Java....hardly...a lot of people use Java now...and would be the language I would use instead of C# for the only fact is that its existance is because MS tries to control everything even someting that someone else invents.

I look at C# as the .WMA to .MP3''s....why the hell is it there in the first place when something already works and is pretty standard.



Jenison
''There is no reason to have math part of the curriculum in schools. Why should we have to know 2x = 3y - 5. We have computers now." - Rosie O''Donnle

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A standard that only applies to one platform isn''t much of a standard.

MS will have to write interpreters for all the other platforms out there because no one else will. Think Suns going to write one for Solaris. doubtful.

And even if they do, MS will only be defeating themselves, because it will give support for other platforms.

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C# is the evolutionary step from C -> C++ -> C# ... There are many complaints about the complexities of C++ ( no not just pointers but the API set for shit like Hash Tables, Link Lists, and network connection APIs ) simply dont exist for C++. The STL for C++ tried to remedy this problem but compared to the simplicity and readability of other languages ( like java ) C++ is really hard to learn and takes alot of code to get the same stuff done. unless you have been using C++ for years you may feel differently.. But I am talking about the new generatations learning C++. ( After all its about getting the job done and not spending endless hours trying to make something work."

Yes, Microsoft basically STOLE Java''s very readable syntax to no end... C# looks exactly like Java down to having a garbage collector. I havent really looked into the language much but hopefully it will be usful in making games with support of Direct X and all the other stuff that C++ uses... with the readability of a nice syntax ( like sadly yes Java. )

To sum it up... M$ made C# because it lost the only battle it EVER lost and that was with Sun''s desire to keep everything standardized. Remeber J++? Wonder why they no longer support J++.. because they lost that court battle in 2000 where M$ was trying to make their OWN standards of JAVA. ( CAN YOU BELIEVE THAT!... they tried to snake their way in... really mean thing to do dont you think? ( M$ had their own views on how the language should be designed ) Actually the more I think about the more Microsoft seems is a TYRANT, TYCOON, MONOPOLISTIC shit hole of a company... I say this because, "Yes M$ has made computing a more global and more essessable thing to people. "A desktop on every home type thing." But, when they have an idea they...

#1 Steal it, modify to how THEY want it to work with complete disregard to other companies standards ( Even tho may be VERY good standards) refuse to use.

#2 Invent something new them selves ( This is rare. ) But again do not standarize it for all... its only for THEIR benefit.

In light of if Java is standardize it tries to be in respect to ALL platforms and does a pretty good job. Remember the Mac?

So, this leads to what will happen when the M$ appeals are over in like 1 1/2 yrs. Will they split the company and put an end ( well some what ) to Bill gates and his fucken desire to be complete ruler. ( hmm never thought there could be such a thing as a NERD hitler. ) The death camps are abound but you cant see them, anymore then you can see all the ILLEGAL warez floating around the net. From the FBI''s point of view... aye? in other words the courts see a well to do guy in thick glasses with a smart Grin that is sincere in his Company goals but the judge is 50-60 year old man that grew up at a time when the computers where reserved for the super nerds and where 10 stories told. Do you think him and the jury ( perhaps the same deal as the judge.) think they know ANYTHING about computing and what REALLY goes on and needs to be done? Nope... they dont.

Get my point? You may need to read this again if you missed something... I just spilled a lot of things out just now.. and learned some new things I had never thought of before. (I used to support MicroSoft... now I am a spy that uses its benefits but at heart feel like Gates is a fucken Pud.

spacemadness

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Having looked at C#, i can say that the language itself looks promising© While Microsoft has submitted the spec for C# as a standard, I wouldn''t hold by breath on anyone using it outside of windows© That said, C# steals -- er©© borrows lots of nice features from java ¥like garbage collection, so you never have to write delete again¤© At the same time, it provides for "unsafe" code blocks, where you can do things that C++, but not java would allow© Overall, it looks like a good compromise between the two languages© Of course we won''t really know until it ships and we can see how the final product performs© I''m sure it will find its place among the tools for windows programming, just as visual basic has© Of course if you want to target other platforms, I''d stick with C++ or java©

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quote:
Original post by superpeter
even java developed so many year the performance of java != c || c++, so, how you consider the performance of c#?


1. C# is compiled, Java is interpreted (using the term lightly, because when JVM''s use dynamic compilation, it ain''t interpreted anymore).

2. (This is what I heard from a Microsoft rep.) Primitive types are kept on the stack instead of the heap, unless they are actually being used as objects. This one little tweak alone (supposedly)provides better-than-Java performance.
(Of course, the MS rep could have just been blowing steam ... can anybody verify this?)



~~~~~~~~~~
Martee
http://www.csc.uvic.ca/~mdill

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As far as I know C# is compiled into bytecode just like Java and has a virtual machine too...

I doubt MS will support .net outside from Windows... Why should they bother? Their goal is to make a MS standard for all ASP...

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Everyone is talking about how M$ is stealing things like garbage collection from Java. Have you ever thought about that garbage collection existed LONG before Java was ever created, in languages like Lisp?

Just my 2 cents...

Greets,
Henrik

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Exactly. And C# also looks like Pascal, Visual Basic, etc. It''s not just a Java clone. There are many features that make it quite different. Of course, I completely agree that it was created to compete with Java. But I don''t think it''s so simple as a Java ripoff. There are things in C# that I wish were in C++.

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It''s a language. You want to use it, go ahead. But it seems there are more advantages to Java than C#. Still, it is suggested that American English-speaking kids learn Spanish in school, ya know (*wink*, *wink*).

In other words, learn as many languages as YOU want. C#, even with its many disadvantages, CAN be on that list if you want.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
it looks like a very good language, clearly superior to java. Unfortunately it won''t replace C++ for game programming so we still have to learn C++. C# really is a great language though

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