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how to construct that game?

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hi ,guys all. i am conceiving a 2d-game those days,there is sth like this: i will use the paintlib (http://www.paintlib.de/paintlib/)to convert some pngs to jpegs, for i think that that kind should be nicer coz of its graphics quality, and as for the map editor, i find one, that is mappy, which is (http://www.tilemap.co.uk/mappy.php)a map editor both for 2d and 3d.have any guys gotten any better tools to convert pngs to jpegs, or any better tools to edit 2d map? one question more: in my conceivation, i am puzzled by the collobration of client part and server part.the games i played usually face one big problem: people usually have to await the check of the server part to make sure that the message in the client part is properly sent. if not then it needs the server part's adjustment. in one of my played games, i have the feeling that, when the player perform a certain skill,following another, then the effect that behaves will be like watching a powerpoint-like pic.another case in point is (in one of my played game) the way of people walks, when we send the order that we will move to place a, then move to place b,successively, then the funny thing will come, it will first move to place a, and then move to b, while, actually when the player send the last order, then it will actually execute the order to walk to place b, not place a, that's the big problem. to sum up. i donot know the exact work should be distributed among the client and server part. if too much thing is placed in the client part, thoug it may omit the check of the server part,the security can not be guarranted, while if not, each action in the client should be performed after the check of the server part, then it may bring a lot of unnecessary checkout which will the murder of network's slow pace or such. any solution to that very question? and if one of u guy donot understand what i am saying, tell me, i will say once more, thx,guys all. regards, bswc.

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I did a quick search about what I assume you're looking for. I have no knowledge about server/client load myself, but perhaps these topics can help you:

http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=437769
http://unreal.epicgames.com/Network.htm
http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=432101
http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=464077

I'm not sure of the relevancy of them to your specific problem (you might try top-down first), but hopefully they'll give some insight.

Also, I hope you don't mind but I reworded your question (hopefully for some more response):

Quote:

I am creating a 2-d game:
I will use PaintLib (http://www.paintlib.de/paintlib/)to convert some PNG's to JPEG's, because I think that my game will benefit from the improved quality.

As for the map editor, I have found one called Mappy (http://www.tilemap.co.uk/mappy.php) which is a map editor both for 2d and 3d.

Does anyone have any recommendations about the above, or similar software?

-

Also, as I design my game I am puzzled by client/server collaboration. In my experience lag has been a huge issue with client/server architecture. I have seen this affect performance both graphically as well as on the path-finding side.

In summary, does anyone have any suggestions or resources as far as the load distribution between client and server go? I want my game to be secure, but not slow.

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The only reason that you should pick .jpg over .png would be filesize. The .png format keeps all detail and supports transparancy, while the .jpg format is often smaller, but of lower quality and without transparancy support.

For converting a lot of images, try IrfanView's batch convert mode. There's no need to write your own tool if there's one available already. ;) And if you decide to go for .png, try PngOptimizer, to decrease their filesize a bit more.


As for your server-client story, you've got that right: the server should only do as much as necessary. Fancy effects like bullet ricochets can safely be done on the client, because they don't effect the gameplay. Figure out what needs to be secure, and what doesn't absolutely need to be. Of course, if you're working with very slow connections, then nothing will stop the game from lagging behind.

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sorry for the late reply.
Gallivan, thx for the url sources,and correcting me as well.

and from UReal network. i get to know that UnReal applied a generalized client-server model, the server is still authoritative over the evolution of the game state, while the client also keeps a subset of the game state, and in this way, the client can predict the game flow by executing the same code in the server.

and it means there are double game states which run both on the client and the server. but i donot know how to keep a subset of the game state just the same code as the server , also do some predictions in the client locally? and does the game state here mean the game logic or such,i donot know the exactly meaning of that? how to get the game state in the client?

also as for the load between client and server, my plan to use pathfinding this way: when we send the keystrokes in the client to the server, we also send the corresponding the command to the server part, and then the server part only makes some checkouts, when it is valid, then let's pass, and when it is invalid, then make necessary adjustments,any faults on that, does it mean the security will have a discount?

also my plan to use skills this way:
put the skills in a stack-like container,and when the player performs two actions successively, then the latter skill will be executed, when one skill is performed, then the time will be also sent there, and the server part also have to make the checkouts, to make sure the skills which is the latest to be executed.any fault on that?

and the main idea of that is as above, imo,it will improve load distribution situation between client and server a bit, though the bandwidth also takes too much.

thx Captain P and for providing such a nice tool information for me.
as for the png over jpg, i have not thought that far,and
Quote:
The only reason that you should pick .jpg over .png would be filesize.
,yeah, u are right, my original plan is that. but i will change it coz of the tool info u provided to me.:)

and also one more question: how guys all organize the resources in the games? store the dailogue/map/window resources in a png/jpg/bmp or such, or classify the dialogue/map/window resources into several categories, like button controls,and other controls, and background ,etc?

and my idea here is to store the resources in a png/jpg/bmp or such, and load the resources in a certain format one category by one, i donot know what's the performance,and cost of that,(but i have tested on hge animation, and it does save a lot of resource
capacity).
any other nicer method to org the resources in the games?

thx really.
regards,
bswc.

[Edited by - bswc on October 5, 2007 10:57:36 AM]

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I store my art assets in different folders, categorized into subfolders. Menu backgrounds go into textures\menus\, explosion sounds go into sounds\effects\, etc. For me they're easier to manage that way. Also, what several games use are archive files: all art assets are packed into a single archive file, and loaded from there. I'm not aware of any library that can do this for you, but I'm positive that there are some around.

As for the game, it sounds a bit like you're trying to bite off more than you can chew now. If you lack experience with networking and art management, shouldn't you develop a few small(er) games first, gradually gaining insight in these area's? If you've created a few small multiplayer games, it's easier to tell how much traffic you can handle, which will make it easier to design your game around that.

So, what's the scope of your game idea? What sort of game is it? :)

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Quote:

I store my art assets in different folders, categorized into subfolders. Menu backgrounds go into textures\menus\, explosion sounds go into sounds\effects\, etc. For me they're easier to manage that way. Also, what several games use are archive files: all art assets are packed into a single archive file, and loaded from there. I'm not aware of any library that can do this for you, but I'm positive that there are some around.

yup, your advice here is right. however, not that point i mention i mean that suppose that there is a window named window01 with text button controls, slider button controls, and in this way, can it be stored in file folders like textures\textbutton, textures\sliderbutton, or just stored in a textures\window01?
Quote:

So, what's the scope of your game idea? What sort of game is it? :)

the game belongs to the sort of small MMORPG, and i dislike the boring and dull fighting monsters, and upgrading levels MMORPG life. i am attracted by those old beautiful days that console rpgs have brought, the scene there is great.
And I wanna bring back the old console RPG favor to the current MMORPG, though u may think that MMORPG derives from the old console RPG. There is a big gap between them.:) that's how the game idea comes into being.
And I will add the new features in my game:

The combat system:
1 the player can fight the monsters with “miss”, that is, no hurt, and this can happen on monsters too.
2 the player can fight the monsters successively, they can even perform “combo” skills just like the Japanese game(The King Of Fighters 97 )
3 the player will be classified into 2 categories: one is User A, the other is User B, usually User A can get stable bonus point , while User B can get unstable bonus point, but one thing is sure that both User A and User B share the same bonus point range.

The quest system:
1 just one main quest, one main task, that’s, all players are advised to complete it, while the side quest can be useful when the player’s resources is in short.
2 the quest system should be tight and pushed the game proceeding advance.

The equipment system:
1 the higher level the player is, the more loss endurance the equipment will receive. And of course he will pay more to repair it.
2 when the player’s equipment reaches a certain level, a very dangerous level, then the level will be reduced, and compensate the player with something else, which can drive him to go on the game with another incentives.
3 also as I said above, there are two kinds of users, such as User A, and User B. and as for User A, the endurance loss in the equipment can be less than User B, who is in the same equipment level of course.

The race system:
To simplify the game at the very beginning, it will include 4 categories: the human, the evil, the immortal, and finally a race which enjoys the highest priority. And when the player reaches to the highest priority, then the player will have a chance to reborn to another race, and while, of course, he will be compensated by a certain title. And also the player who is with the highest priority can develop himself more quickly than the ordinary players.

The four characteristics in my game will include:
1 various, that is, the atmosphere in the game is should be tricky, but not easy to grasp.
2 console rpg favor.
3 incentives, and every player can find something interests him and they know the player has to go on with the game,
4 close to the reality, it means that often the nature law can be quoted here.
And I start to write a game design doc, but I have considered this so far. And I have to dive into the game further to learn more about what I want

As for me, I have graduated last year, and I have studied c++ programming as the main developing language. And in the game company, I use c++ in the client to develop sth for half an year, and then I am shifted to the server part., and there I spent another half a year on mud programming, which is developed for the server. And I now am a tester in the testing department. And I wanna go back to the development field, so I ‘d like to develop sth really of my own.

And my idea on that is: just finish it one bit by bit, and take baby-step plans and designs on the game. Also my partner will be responsible for the server part and the visual arts, and I am responsible for the client part.
I really hope I can do it.:)
regards,
bswc.

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It's up to you how you organize your assets. Experiment with it to see what works best for you. There's no single best way, so you'll need to make a decision there and move on.

As for small MMORPG, that would be a MORPG. Massive isn't small per definition. Anyway, sounds like you already have some experience in this area, so why exactly are you asking these questions? Didn't you encounter these issues at your job? I'm sure they know more about this in your company than I can tell you.

As for taking on such a large project and hoping you can finish it, I've found out that that doesn't work - at least not for me. I only stay motivated for a few months, a year perhaps, but after that I can't bring it up to continue a project anymore. That's why I'm doing smaller games now. This varies from person to person, but I believe it's important to know how strongly motivated you are, as well as how capable you are, before starting such a project. It's only normal: you wouldn't start building a house if you weren't sure you had the money, you would check your bank account first, right?

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