Grinning and bearing it - Permanent injury

Started by
49 comments, last by tonyg 15 years, 6 months ago
At any time, the player has a handful of choices, and will generally choose the path that offers the fewest frustrations.

The player may:
- continue playing
- revert (either starting a new game, or load a savegame)
- ditch the game and do something else.

Any kind of permanent disadvantage will discourage the player from the first option. A certain school of game designers then respond by making #2 even *more* painful* (remove the ability to save/load. Make you watch a 20 minute cutscene! Force you to delete your current character if you wish to start over".
And what they forget is that this just encourages the player to go for #3. You've made it doubtful that #1 will pay off, you're doing everything you can to punish the player for #2, so.... they go off to play another game.

So, why should I as a player choose to continue my game once I get permanently crippled?

Quote:However, I am now thinking, wouldn't it be cool if the hero (when he escapes) emerged limping, battered, bruised and with a broken body, by the skin of his teeth, so to speak? For this scenario to exist

Would it? How come? Would it be cool in gameplay terms? Would it feel more satisfying than escaping intact?
Remember, you're not writing a novel or making a movie. And your users are not spectators who want to know what happens next, they're cast in the role as the guy whose life just got a hell of a lot harder because he can no longer use his leg, is blind, and has only two functioning fingers left on his right hand.

It might be cool to watch a movie where the hero "emerged limping, battered, bruised and with a broken body, by the skin of his teeth". But how do you think the hero himself would feel about it? Would he think "Hey, that was awesome, a real kick. Getting crippled was totally worth it"? Does the hero himself feel it's a particularly good outcome? Wouldn't he jump at the opportunity to redo his escape if given the chance?
Advertisement
Quote:Hey, that was awesome, a real kick. Getting crippled was totally worth it"? Does the hero himself feel it's a particularly good outcome?


I would imagine the hero is quite happy he survived, as the alternative was death in the Pit. I would imagine, to extend this a little further, the player is happy too, as he completed the game.

He may well wish that he wasn't crippled and so the player may reload his save, I can definitely see that. And no, I'm not trying to make reloading difficult, the whole time I'e been talking about quicksaves and quickloads - it doesn't get any easier than that.

So Im thinking, if the reward for sticking with the injury was good enough, maybe the player would think, OK, I can cope with that and I'll carry on; which for me would make such a system worth implementing. It's not about *forcing* the player to do anything other than make a *choice* - continue or reload.
“If you try and please everyone, you won’t please anyone.”
Quote:Original post by Jon Alma
Reaching the end of the game with a bruised and battered hero dragging himself over the finish line will give the player a huge sense of achievement. Having to drag the hero through the last 20 levels, movement reduced (leg missing), unable to fight (arm gone) might get a bit annoying.


Exactly.

I think 'the entire game' is far too long to be playing with a crippled character; there might be a tremendous sense of achievement from doing it, but the vast majority of people will get fed up before they get that far. Why not break it down into smaller chunks?

If the player can be cured by the surgeon, he'll get that sense of achievement every time he fights his way out of a dungeon to get patched up again. No need to force him to struggle through the entire game with twin peg legs, hook hands and an eyepatch looking like some kind of cartoon pirate before he gets that sense of accomplishment.

You could make the availability of surgeons contingent on difficulty level. So the really hardcore players could, if they so wanted, play the entire game with permanent damage. But at least you wouldn't be turning away the less hardcore as well.

That could work I think. My game has a single dungeon - the Pit, which is quite large - and escaping it is the goal of the game.

A very large experience bonus for fighting with a severe injury (something like 300%) but the option to find a surgeon and get your arm stitched back on (which is in your backpack, providing you've not thrown it away) or something like that.

I also considered having a needle and thread the hero could use with his severed fingers to sew them back on too at one point.

*Edit*

Another thing occurs to me, I could actually limit the permanent injuries to just limb removals and some of the other nasty ones, like brain damage*, and have the system only allow the hero to lose an arm and no other limbs. That might also work.

*Not sure how I'll implement that one yet, but I have some fun ideas with random gibberish dialog ;-)

*Second edit*

I could also make permanent injuries rare on the hero.
“If you try and please everyone, you won’t please anyone.”
Consider how the fifth time a character breaks his leg will be different from the first time. The first time is a Dramatic Event. The fifth time is a Movement Speed Multiplier Condition. I'd be tempted to work it into a multilinear level design. Jump out of the fifth floor window into a dumpster to escape the cops? Fine, but don't expect to just jog away.
I also think it's important that severed limbs be usable as weapons [grin]
I have that in already, its perfectly acceptable in my game to use your own arm as a weapon against an opponent; the game has quite a dark tone to it. It wont be the best weapon by any stretch but could be satisfying to the player.

Im now backtracking and going back to my original point.

I think I should probably either include permanent injury, or not. A player can lose one limb and losing another is a game over condition. That includes breakages too.
“If you try and please everyone, you won’t please anyone.”
Quote:Original post by kingy
So essentially, as long as the player can quicksave and quickload at any point, permanent injuries are generally seen as being ok.

Actually, that's the opposite of what I was saying. If you intend to apply long term negative afflictions on the player for short term mistakes, you can't provide an opportunity to undo the short term mistakes. Any sane person would do so. Providing a positive bonus for incurring mistakes in order to fix this issue is a horrible counter. It would be a really weird game if I must purposely wander into specific danger to obtain the effects I want on my character. Immersion goes right out the window, along with my character as he jumps to break his legs.

You also can't make these permanent changes negatively influence the gameplay. Especially if the game is decent in length. No slow limping or similar annoying gimmicks.

Finally, if you're going with a non-linear, open-ended environment, I wouldn't make anything that modifies gameplay in a choiceless manner permanent. Scars, replacement limbs, or cybernetics are okay, though. They show that the player has been through hell without hindering future endeavors.
For a role playing game, where the goal is character growth, it would be a horrible idea. It directly contradicts the player's goal of playing, interfering with the basic reward of the game.

I can see this working if the primary focus of the game is survival and not character growth. If the game is a series of scenarios that challenge the player to shepherd the character through tough odds to safety, this could be a very interesting game play choice. I am reminded of the popularity of television shows like Survivorman - enduring is the challenge.

Oregon Trail? :)
Same for me. As soon as I received a permanent injury, I would reload.

To say it a bit more drastic, you could as well let the game crash, display a game over screen or automatically load the last quicksave as soon as that happens.


Some players might accept this scenario if "replacements" were available (eg. when you lose your arm, you get a prosthesis, maybe with an integrated cannon, crossbow, chainsaw, whatever). It could also be presented as part of the story, eg. it has to happen in one of the boss battles.

But as far as I am concerned, I don't like this idea one bit. No matter the bonus, my hero comes out intact or not at all ;)

Professional C++ and .NET developer trying to break into indie game development.
Follow my progress: http://blog.nuclex-games.com/ or Twitter - Topics: Ogre3D, Blender, game architecture tips & code snippets.

This topic is closed to new replies.

Advertisement