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w00

programming mmorpg

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w00    122
Hey, i want to build my own basic mmorpg game. I would like to start with building my own engine. I've als been looking for a few good books but the only book that really seems to be good is: 3D Game Engine Programming This book really seems to go into the programming part of game engines and not just some theories of how it could be done. I really just want to be busy creating and programming instead of reading alot of information i really don't need. Also another thing, i'm not really sure in what language i should do this. I mean, i want to use C++, thats for sure, but what library? OpenGL or DirectX..?? For some reason i tend to go with OpenGL, but more and more games seem to be made with DirectX. I don't want to go the platform independant way, so... Well anyway, basically my question is, is the book i mentioned good to start with? I've read the OpenGL Super Bible, but i don't care if i have to start over with DirectX. That is, if i have to go with DirectX... So what are your thoughts about this??

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Gage64    1235
Required reading. The title may put you off, but you should read it anyway. This FAQ also has some pointers.

I'm not familiar with the book you mentioned, but you should read the reviews about it on Amazon as well as on this site (in the Books section).

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JimmyDeemo    156
Ok. That’s quit a big task you have put out for yourself there. Write an engine and an mmo.

I would first look at realistically what your capacity for programming. If you really intend to do what you suggested, your pretty much going to have to learn (to an advanced extent no less) pretty much every aspect of games programming (AI,Graphics,Networking etc.).

One question i would as is what do you really want to do? You could start on a MMO with an already built engine?

More importantly i would ask how good a programmer you are? Is this your first dip into games programming?

You post is indicative of a lot of first posts in the sense that it suggest a task which is so large one single book cannot take you through what you want to do.

Would it not be better to start of small? With a simpler game idea?

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w00    122
Well, i was just painting the bigger picture here of what eventually my goal is. And since every game is based on an engine i thought it might be best to start with that.

Although i have been reading some things about engines which indeed seems to be complex to start with.

Maybe it's better for me to start with an existing engine, see how that works and maybe later move on with creating my own engine.

Ofcourse my question now is, what would be a good engine for me to start with? I don't really like Torque cause the learning curve seems to be low, although it's meant for MMORPGs. But i'm thinking about using Kaneva...

But i would really like to hear about your experience about engines and what you think is best for me.

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Antheus    2409
Start here.

Quote:
3D Game Engine Programming


While some form of client is required, it is not the center-piece of online games. First problem you need to solve is networking.

In the example above, client's game loop remains unchanged whether it's a text client or next-gen graphics engine. The only difference is that when reading input, you also read networked input. Later you may add features to mask latency, but in the beginning, just simple interpolation will do fine.

Focus on the (M)ultiplayer and (O)nline parts, once you get that working reliably, you can start considering the (M)assive.

It's very important to not start with client, since adding networking to that is typically much harder than developing server, and then designing client around that.

Networking forum has a list of some engines that may be useful.

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Drew_Benton    1861
I personally thing that, if you want to be able to make a mmorpg yourself, you first have to understand how a mmorpg works. I don't mean from a theoretical approach, but rather a "hands on" intense studying of an existing mmorpg to see how it was done. In turn, once you understand one implementation of one, you can base yours on those approaches and improve. The more games you study, the more real world data you have that will give you new perspectives on how they are implemented.

I'd say looking at a mmorpg emulator projects would be an invaluable learning experience as well. An emulator in essence is pure mmorpg coding; all of the game assets, design, etc... is already done. In a way, you are just coding the server based on whatever client you are supporting. If you understand how to write an emulator, you have a good idea of how to write your own mmorpg architecture. You can simply do a Google search for "mmorpg dev" and will find the most popular sites currently that have resources relating to this.

However, that does not mean you can't get up and running with simple stuff, but it just will be a long a wandering path without understanding all of the basics firsthand. hplus0603 has a very nice article on setting up a simple mmorpg using python that you should check out. Of course, if you are not well versed in Python, might be of limited use.

All that assumes you take the "I will program one from scratch" approach, which is fine by all means, but time consuming. If you do it all yourself, then you won't be focusing on your original intents. That is why you might want to consider taking existing libraries, tying them together, and working from that framework. If you do manage to get a simple system up and running and it works good, then you are ready to do things yourself.

You should understand though mmorpg development covers many domains, each of which are things people dedicate years to learning. Databases, Networks, Security, those things you will come up with simple solutions for, but there is a lot of work and learning to do.

The last aspect of the whole ordeal to consider is that that the hardest obstacle to overcome is that of getting a team. It's an incredible amount of work to do by yourself, and it can get quite draining. Having others to work with you that you can develop and learn together makes it a far more enjoyable process. Finding people to work with and trust is very tricky nowadays.

Best of luck!

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jyk    2094
Quote:
And since every game is based on an engine...
Hm, what gives you that idea? Although it may not always be advisable, it's certainly possible to build a game from the ground up without basing it on an existing engine. Or perhaps you meant something else?

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w00    122
Thanks all for the info. I did some more research and i do think it's a good idea to start with that book i mentioned in my first post.

I know that i won't be able to create a MMO if i finish that book, i'll probably be far from able to create one by myself, but atleast i have some knowledge to start with. After that i'll just read other books and perhaps tutorials and i think that eventually the puzzle pieces will fit together.

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cclyde    184
"instead of reading alot of information i really don't need."

This is mistake #1. You are not in a position to judge what you will and will not need to make an MMO, and I can guarantee that a 3D engine is not all you need. In fact, it is a very small part of what you need. Don't get stuck in "3D limbo" where you learn a bunch of 3D technologies and techniques, yet never learn how to really program, and are thus nearly worthless. I've seen so many people go through this, and end up with only a half baked directX wrapper.

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