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Super-high color depth

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I can imagine 32 bit color will be around for a while. But at some point, probably on high-end workstations first, there''s got to be some improvement. I pluged the numbers in my calc for 64 bits, and came up with over 281 trillion colors at 16.16.16.16 and over 18 million trillion colors at 21.22.21. Are there any plans by any of the vid card makers, or are there no plans whatever?

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Actually there is plenty of use for color depths above 32bit. Workstations have been doing it for years. I have an old issue of Byte magazine (1989) which covers all sorts of hardware. There''s talk in there of machines with 96 bits per pixel color (1989!!!).

The reason is, although we cannot distinguish above the 16M colors (we can actually distinguish less than that - n64s output in 21bit color I believe). Have you ever blended a _LOT_ of scene elements together? You''ll notice it in 16bit earlier, but you will notice it in 32bit as well - it gets rounding errors.

So output at lower bit depths is fine. Calculation at higher bit depths is becoming more and more essential. It will take a while before fill rate on video cards comes to a point where programmers put in all those passes and we start going ''ewwwwww...look at the banding''. That day will come.

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I already do go, ewwww banding. Any extremely noticeable banding has got to be a fault in your hardware/software setup, or extreme laziness on the programmers part. I''m sorry if I sound harsh, but banding is something not to be taken lightly. Read my pamphlet, Banding and You. It delves into banding and how it will be the end of mankind. Hitler delved in banding, see where it got him! Dead in a pine box, and hated by nearly everyone!. eheh

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ok, for a LOT of multi passes, maybe it will take 64 bit for the processing, but there, imagine how much processing power it will requiere to do that!!!!!!! but i have to admit that probably a day will come that it will be like that! after all, someone once said that 64KB of memory should be enough forever!!!!

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quote:
Original post by cyberg
ok, for a LOT of multi passes, maybe it will take 64 bit for the processing, but there, imagine how much processing power it will requiere to do that!!!!!!!


In the absolute worst case, only twice as much processing power, which is 1.5 years of computer technology advancement according to Moore''s Law.
Perhaps we''d see 64bit colour values with 4 16-bit floats instead of ints, now THERE would be a nice improvement.



People might not remember what you said, or what you did, but they will always remember how you made them feel.
Mad Keith the V.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Given modern hardware, it''s not really the processing power we have to worry about so much as the already limited memory bandwidth

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Without breaking NDAs, all I can say is: watch DirectX and consumer graphics hardware (ie. coming to a store near you) - although initially still using the same maximum amount of space (hmm do we really need those unused 8 bits in the frame buffer ?, what if....)

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Guest Anonymous Poster



Any extremely noticeable banding has got to be a fault in your hardware/software setup, or extreme laziness on the programmers part. I''m sorry if I sound harsh, but banding is something not to be taken lightly.


Hehe, I guess that means Carmack is a horrible programmer, either that or there''s something seriously wrong with the GF3s running Doom 3 .

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Guest Anonymous Poster
does S1CA say that an RGB (11.11.10) frame-buffer produces less banding than an RGBA (8.8.8.8) one?

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Anonymous: I said nothing about banding...

...but I will comment, I do believe it would help - more range, particularly on colours the eye picks up on most varieties of (i.e. greenish colours) has to be a good thing. [compare the outputs of a card with a lowe precision RAMDAC to one with a good one, there is a difference]

The other big advantage is it helps to reduce precision errors earlier on in the pixel pipeline.

Theres still a case for error diffusion/dithering of your source graphics if they''re susceptible to banding though.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Banding can be a problem with 32 bit displays, esp. when you have a large area of one colour that you try to light, you will see very noticeable bands then.

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(was anonymous S1CA asker)
Was the D/A the real limiting factor in consumer video-cards?
(Beginning with only 16 colors a on the C64)
Or was it just the small amount of fast palette RAM
(today bandwidth)

I always thought that 8-bit converters were never a problem
(for each color channel)

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Besides all of the visible stuff.... I''d love to be able to select more than 2 ^ 32 diffrent objects over the backbuffer without having to draw them multiple times.. har har har...
cya,
Phil


Visit Rarebyte!
and no!, there are NO kangaroos in Austria (I got this questions a few times over in the states

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I thought of another reason. Remember back in the days of 256 colors? Video games sometimes used palette animation, changing the color palette to animate the screen? What if there was a palette of all colors presently availible in 32 bit mode, and you could have registers listed in 64 bits. This way, you could have 3 palette entrys for, say, bluish purple. By changing one register, certain purples would change color, but the others wouldn''t. The only problem I can think of is trying to keep track of all those colors.

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quote:
Original post by Chronoslade
The human eye can only see aprox. 32 million colors so whats the point for more.

"There is humor in everything depending on which prespective you look from."


Actually its more like 7 million.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by Chronoslade
The human eye can only see aprox. 32 million colors so whats the point for more.



The problem comes with rounding errors, and banding when using large amounts of one colour. Read the replies above.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by Chronoslade
The human eye can only see aprox. 32 million colors so whats the point for more.



The problem comes with rounding errors, and banding when using large amounts of one colour. Read the replies above and carmacks finger.

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quote:
Original post by Chronoslade
The human eye can only see aprox. 32 million colors so whats the point for more.



The problem comes with rounding errors, and banding when using large amounts of one colour. Read the replies above and carmacks finger.

EDIT: sorry about the triple post everyone...


Edited by - python_regious on June 28, 2001 11:34:41 AM

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