Quote:Original post by PokerFlat
Those that own it would not be the target.

If I was an investor/shareholder, ignoring 100% (well actually probably more like 90% since some would dig a remake) of your entire existing market is not something that I'd invest in. The PS2 game is only a couple years old. The people buying PS3s for the most part owned PS2s. If they didn't buy the game (which was critically acclaimed) then, they probably won't buy it now without a serious marketing investment.

Plus, developing for next-gen systems requires a huge investment. It's not as trivial as you make it sound. Do you have any idea how long it would take to remake that world for a next-gen platform? That's a full development cycle for the artists (save for maybe a bit of concepting since it's been done for the first game, but you're not saving anything from a sequel).

I guess the argument I'm making, is that from a business standpoint, a sequel is a much more viable option, as its intended audience INCLUDES the 100% of the people that bought the first game, and adds the new market you're talking about (plus new players would be intrigued and might buy the original).

Quote:Original post by Driv3MeFar
The PS2 and PS3 architectures are massively different, so the cost of such a "refresh" wouldn't be that much less than that of developing a new title, yet it would probably have to be sold for a lot less to be attractive to consumers. Also, SOTC, while well received critically, was a commercial flop. All in all, it doesn't make good business sense.

Time is also money. Earlier I mentioned a mid-market for lack of a better term. What I'm getting at is that the team making the next release won't be done until 2010 from what I've heard. So if it took only a couple years to refactor the PS2 title and work began when PS3 was released then the game would be available now and until the sequel is, released which is possibly still two years away. So you also provide a nice lead into the sequel, which for many probably won't be a sequel as it will be their first time playing.

Actually I'm starting to like this idea more rather than less, even after the trend in this thread that the problem's just not cost-effective.

By the time the sequel's out it will have been a long period of time between the two releases. To me it's good business sense to leverage whataver you can in those duldrums between releases. You keep your old fan base interested (even if they're not buying) and you initiate some new fans. And when the sequel's released you have more fans ready to buy that sequel.


But it all pivots on just how much work is involved. But if Sony considered the effort into their marketing budget it might not seem so far-fetched.

It was attempted with a game called Chrono Trigger for the SNES console, to upgrade the graphics from low-res 2d into nice 3d. Unfortunately, it was an unofficial attempt, and it got shut down, but they did seem to be making very impressive progress. Just check out the trailer.

http://www.opcoder.com/projects/chrono/

Chronicles of riddick: escape from butchers bay is being re-released for the 360 with updated graphics, art and a new chapter of story. Like an expansion + original revamped. I finished the first one on pc and I might get this one aswell because its a great game.

Though some interesting points have been made (and certainly apply to other games), the real reason this wont happen to Ico and Shadow of the Colossus isn't any of the ones previously mentioned, unless I overlooked it. The real reason these games wont have sequels or revamps on higher gen systems is because they were designed to be at the graphical cutting edge at the time. The reason they produced both games was because they had the knowhow to create games that set the industry's standard for years to come. Now the methods they used to generate the displays you see are either outdated, or commonly used. An update would require a complete rewrite of the entire graphics engine, and it would be far more profitable and wise to simply make a new game with the new graphics. As mentioned earlier, people won't pay a decent ammount of money for a remake that doesn't add much in terms of content. It may appease graphics-slaves, but not the gaming market in general. Furthermore, games are now constantly pushing the edge, and there is no easy way to make a standard setting game anymore.

There's a blog (more of a postmortem) from the creators about the creation of Shadow of the Colossus (graphics, anyway) and it includes a mention of this. I don't remember the name of it, but it's easy to find on google.

I think that, at this point, the PS2 is still to modern; reach farther back. The way I see it, the best - albeit possibly dangerous - point to "refresh" an IP is at the point of 2D/3D conversion. Look at franchises such as Metroid, Bionic Commando, Prince of Persia, and so forth. They have already jumped the gap in the technological sense, which is really the first step.

After that point, it is more a matter of re-imagining a predefined archetype, than repeating the same content. If you take a game - no matter what that game may be - and break it down into its base elements, what you are left with is a (hopefully) tried and true shell, that is simply waiting to be filled with content; allowing players to re-experience the original game's structure, without having to risk alienating your core audience to the same extent as you would with a direct update.

Quote:Original post by shurcool
It was attempted with a game called Chrono Trigger for the SNES console, to upgrade the graphics from low-res 2d into nice 3d. Unfortunately, it was an unofficial attempt, and it got shut down, but they did seem to be making very impressive progress. Just check out the trailer.

http://www.opcoder.com/projects/chrono/

According to wikipedia the game did get a make-over but it was official. So then my idea's not far-fetched in all cases.

Quote:Original post by RivieraKid
Chronicles of riddick: escape from butchers bay is being re-released for the 360 with updated graphics, art and a new chapter of story. Like an expansion + original revamped. I finished the first one on pc and I might get this one aswell because its a great game.

Cool, a little more support toward the idea.

Quote:Original post by dashurc

Quote:Original post by PokerFlat
Those that own it would not be the target.

If I was an investor/shareholder, ignoring 100% (well actually probably more like 90% since some would dig a remake) of your entire existing market is not something that I'd invest in. The PS2 game is only a couple years old. The people buying PS3s for the most part owned PS2s. If they didn't buy the game (which was critically acclaimed) then, they probably won't buy it now without a serious marketing investment.

Not ignoring, just not targeting. There's a difference. I disagree that people buying PS3 now also owned PS2. And I think that people that didn't try it out but knew about it would be tempted to try it out as the game has had good word-of-mouth.

Quote:Original post by dashurc
Plus, developing for next-gen systems requires a huge investment. It's not as trivial as you make it sound. Do you have any idea how long it would take to remake that world for a next-gen platform? That's a full development cycle for the artists (save for maybe a bit of concepting since it's been done for the first game, but you're not saving anything from a sequel).

Not sure where I made it sound like development for multi-core consoles is trivial. I think everyone knows it's not trivial. It's kicking people's butts.

The point that the "concepting" (that a real word?) is already done is part of my argument for doing this. You can farm this out to lower paid workers in Korea or Vietnam, etc.
So you are saving.

Quote:Original post by dashurc
I guess the argument I'm making, is that from a business standpoint, a sequel is a much more viable option, as its intended audience INCLUDES the 100% of the people that bought the first game, and adds the new market you're talking about (plus new players would be intrigued and might buy the original).

All good points, except for the last one, I'll get to that but first....
I agree that a sequel is preferred over this mid-market release, or makeover. But I thought that coming into this. It's implied really.

The last point, that about buying the original, would likely mean they'd buy a used copy
and Sony don't care about the used market since they get no money so that's not a selling point of this idea anyway.

I still like the idea, it may just need more thought and consideration for it to start happening. There's a potential for a mid-market industry I think. If you had PS2 experience and PS3 experience and solve some of the hard problems up front you may be able to recoup that time spent on the hard problems by applying it to converting other titles.
Once you get a pipeline then you need less highly skilled people on the projects.

Maybe I am trivializing it but hard work doesn't scare everyone away from money.