Quote:Original post by Kodexx

Quote:Original post by stimarco

Quote:Original post by Tom Sloper
Or wrote:
>What do I need to learn to make an MMO?

Assuming you mean to do the programming yourself, you should get a Computer Science degree, and make mods in your spare time.

>By the time I wish to create my game, game development may have advanced, and I might of been left behind.

Hogwash.

What he said.

There is nothing about game programming that is particularly special or unique. Games are just simulations of mathematical models. It's the design of that model which makes it a game and not, say, a military flight simulator or a financial forecasting application. The programming doesn't change all that much.

Programming is just translation. Take a Comp. Sci. degree. That'll teach you how to program.

Finally: Complex games are built by teams, not individuals. The cults of personality seen in the entertainment industries are a poor indicator of skill, talent or worth; they just tell you who has the best PR people. Even the greatest movie directors would be nothing without good editors, screenwriters, cinematographers and lighting technicians.

(Incidentally, I've seen behind the scenes of JAGEX and Runescape. They use some of the worst tools I've ever seen, and the engine is no great shakes either.)

Im intrested in knowing what tools they use at Jagex.. care to tell us?

Agreed.

JAGEX uses an engine that they developed in-house along with a scripting language they've developed. You won't be able to get what they use.

Here's my suggestions for you, and you should take them and run with them.

1. Buy a book on programming, pick a language that will accomplish what you want to do. (Java for web development, C++/XNA for desktop, etc).
2. Buy a second book on a grapics API.
3. Program some basic games, start out with a pong game.
4. After you get some basic arcade games running, move on to something else, like an RPG of your own. Write the whole engine, and script in the quests and things of that sort.
5. Buy a book on networking with your language, and read read read. To make an MMO, you need to know networking inside and out.
6. Spend forever working on your MMO.

When I was younger, I dreamed of working on an MMO, just like you. I am only a senior in high school, but I've been taking initiative and teaching myself programming because my school doesn't offer it. When I played EQ2 and WoW, I wanted to be a GM sooo bad. It always seemed cool, they had all of the cool powers, they had all of the fun. Well, now that I am friends with people in the game development industry (some in MMOs), it isn't as fun. They hardly ever get to play the game that they are working on.

I suggest you take my advice. By the time you are knowledgeable enough to make an MMO, you won't want to, trust me. You will want to make other games that are fun :)

Hope you accept what I said instead of bashing it as not being the response you wanted to hear.

Quote:Yes, I admit that I may decide that MMOs are boring or some other adjective later on in life, but I somewhat doubt it. I just love the idea of another world that you can access from your PC, in which you meet other people and do things just like real life, with the difference of the wonderful landscapes and the things you couldn't do in real life. Though perhaps my views will change in the future, I would be proud to maintain one of those worlds, along with a group of people.

As for those kids that you mention, alot of those kids think that making games is easy. There is a handful of kids out there who are serious about game development, and I am one of them. I know that it will take work to eventually come to the level of the MMO developer, and I'm willing to do that work. All I'm doing now is trying to get a head-start on that work. I am trying to further my education myself, seeing as school isn't helping...

All in all, I really couldn't care less what you think. I believe that if I believe, I can succeed in this industry. I'm going to start out small, like Andrew Gower. As I said, I've been inspired by Gower, and I think it's too late to go back on that.

If this seems to be your attitude, why are you posting? What do you want from us, and exactly what are you expecting us to tell you? Some magic words that will make you into a great video game programmer by your pure willpower?

Think again, and if you want to be respected, stop being arrogant.

I'm not try to be mean or anything, but please accept what these people are trying to tell you; what they are saying is not trying to put you down and tell you that you cannot accomplish what you want, but they're merely telling you the truth, which you seem to perceive as muddled. You completely fit the stereotype of the 12-18 year old who knows little to nothing about programming but wants to create an mmo, a feat that requires -very- significant amounts of knowledge, and perhaps that's why you're also being seen as arrogant. At least take the advice these people are trying to help you with.

[Edited by - alex74447 on January 2, 2009 9:21:32 PM]

This thread is silly.

" made my first computer game when I was 5 or 6 I believe, a pathetic little maze game that I created using the program Game Maker."
-Orechalcos

"I am learning from it, I have built a racing game, though there is a problem with the compiling."
-Orechalcos

"Anyway, that isn't my point. My point is, I want to learn at least some of the things I need to have for an MMO by the time I reach university, but I don't know what I need to learn. Also, my life goal is create an MMO like WoW or EverQuest, not like RuneScape."
-Orechalcos
BATTLE OPERANDI -> SUMMATION!

Ok, so the only game it seems you've completed was made with game maker.

You created a non-functioning mess of code in Java based on a beginner book.

You have decided that the next logical step in your programming career is to begin working on an MMO that will eventually become the next WoW or EverQuest.

You don't seem to like the idea of using a game maker equivalent for an MMO and you have decided to come to an online programming forum and post in the beginner section beseeching a bunch of ornery programmers for advice. Fine, here it is and don't complain. I didn't come into your house and bang your head against the wall without being invited to.

BATTLE OPERANDI -> REAL AND HELPFUL ADVICE

"I know that it will take work to eventually come to the level of the MMO developer, and I'm willing to do that work."
-Orechalcos

I do not believe that you do. There is nothing wrong with that, but let's give you a nice helping of reality check and get you on a path that may actually lead to completing your goal.

You lack the basic skills and man power to complete a task of epic proportion at this stage in your life. There is absolutely -NOTHING- wrong with that. You like games, that's great. Make some. Get that racing game to compile and run. Make versions of Pong and Tetris. Re-make your old maze game in a real programming language and polish it up so that you're happy with it.

Learn about data structures and object oriented programming (you're using java but I can guarantee you are not using it properly and you will not for a couple years). Learn about sorting and searching algorithms and implement them.

Most importantly set attainable and real goals with a deadline that you can honestly meet. Be generous and give yourself time. You are young and the game industry will always need new people to fill the shoes of those who retire or quit and new companies and teams within companies crop up all the time. It will still have openings when you grow older. Quality casual games will always be appealing and can be done by one or two people on a limited budget. Digital distribution is such that indie programmers can now profit from their single-man-team creations.

Be fair -and- honest with yourself and your abilities. You admit you're young, you don't have to give up on your dreams, you should not. But you should definitely target real and concrete goals instead of chasing the ambiguous and epic project that you are proposing that will definitely end in failure if you attempt it within the next 3 years. I can guarantee you this in absolute terms.

Target lots of smaller games and finish them and you will know success. You can use that success to climb to the level you need to and gather the manpower and skills required to eventually work on an MMO with success.

For now, focus on your marks and do game projects on the side. Seek a university that has a good coop program that works with a game company to hire students and see what their entrance requirements are. Focus on spending your high school career getting into that university.