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vader88

My First Big Game

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I would just like to introduce myself here as I have had a great interest in making games(as a hobby). I do not have much game making experience so I am sure I will need assistance here in the future. I am going to be finishing a degree in computer science soon, so I know programming rather well. I have done some little things such as Tetris in VB and a small AI example in actionscript. Anyway, I would like to start making a simple 3d MMO. I know, another noob who wants to make it big from making the best MMO ever. I can assure you that is not me. I just want to do it for fun. Yeah, I think i might actually be implying that this would be fun to me. Since this will be more of a hobby than an actual game I want to keep it somewhat easy. I don't plan on building my own engine or anything. I plan on using C++ as the language. I think possibly Ogre3d for the 3d graphics and RakNet for networking. Are these good for beginning a project like this? What else might I need? So I guess I would like to know if anyone has any suggestions for me and a good development path to follow. I have been researching as much as possible but it's always good to get more info.

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Are these good for beginning a project like this?
Well, their popularity suggests they aren't bad choices. Ultimately, though, its you as a programmer who has to recognize their suitability. After all, you are the one writing the code.

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What else might I need?
Knowledge. Experience. Dedication and diligence. A lot of time.

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So I guess I would like to know if anyone has any suggestions for me and a good development path to follow.
Reconsider what you are trying to do.

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Thanks for your input. I kind of figured that going for the more popular libraries would be better as they would have more documentation and such. I believe I have the knowledge and I definitely have the dedication.

I am curious why you think I should reconsider what I am trying to do. Like I said, it's just as a hobby. If it ends up a crappy game or if it doesn't even end up working out, than at least I should have learned something trying.

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He thinks you should reconsider because you mentioned the word MMO.

The first M stands for massive. MASSIVE teams made up of a bunch of different disciplines work for YEARS to make said games. Even if you had the technical know-how to build it yourself (not to mention the ridiculous amount of time you would need to work on it), you probably don't have the resources (i.e. money) to maintain an infrastructure required to support a MASSIVE amount of users.

With that said, good luck if you go forward with it, and if you reconsider, try dropping the first M from that acronym and build a game where a few people can join a session and game together, which is much more reasonable and cost-effective for a hobbyist.

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I am curious why you think I should reconsider what I am trying to do. Like I said, it's just as a hobby. If it ends up a crappy game or if it doesn't even end up working out, than at least I should have learned something trying.
Of course. There's nothing wrong in trying. Taking on a challenging project is an excellent learning experience. However, there's a difference between taking on a challenging project and one that demands a level of expertise much higher than you are at. The former is a good learning experience. The latter is an exercise in frustration.

Your first post indicates a base level of programming to build on. But you're first big project is a massive multiplayer game. Shouldn't you at least have one polished multiplayer game before you attempt to take on the challenges of an MMO? Not even that, but how about an extensive single player game? Neither of those are by any means small projects. They are far more doable and there's significant value in completing a project versus just attempting one.

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Original post by vader88
I am curious why you think I should reconsider what I am trying to do. Like I said, it's just as a hobby. If it ends up a crappy game or if it doesn't even end up working out, than at least I should have learned something trying.


Just because of the fact that you should aim lower for your first game, that way you can gain the experience, and tools you will need to build something near an MMO. You learn by your mistakes and the more little projects you make, the more little mistakes you make, hence the more you learn, and the more knowledge you can take with you to create your MMO.

You could program smaller games, chat programs, for a year or w.e, and then with that knowledge go in and try and make your MMO, wit a much better chance of completing it, rather than going in blindly, most likely failing so much that you have to keep re doing it, or giving up, and have your first accomplishment be a roughly coded sloppy mmorpg 5 years from now...

thats just my opinion..

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Ok, I understand what you guys are saying. I guess maybe I presented the idea wrong. I didn't necessarily mean massive when I said an MMO game. I just meant the elements of it. Even if it is only me and some friends or whatever. Something like up to 30 people concurrently maybe. But it would be partly an MMO in that it is a persistent universe. Does this sound more reasonable or am I still shooting way over my head?

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As I think about it some more, I think I will start by making a single player RPG to learn more. Thanks for the help. I am sure I will be back with questions at some point.

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Original post by vader88
Ok, I understand what you guys are saying. I guess maybe I presented the idea wrong. I didn't necessarily mean massive when I said an MMO game. I just meant the elements of it. Even if it is only me and some friends or whatever. Something like up to 30 people concurrently maybe. But it would be partly an MMO in that it is a persistent universe. Does this sound more reasonable or am I still shooting way over my head?

Way over your head from reading this "I have done some little things such as Tetris in VB and a small AI example in actionscript" IMO.
I'm not saying it's not possible since you are obviously smart enough and quick enough of a learner to get a CS degree.
It's just that even completing a non-networked RPG game with 3D graphics is quite a bit of work and a learning process if you haven't already tried. Actually, there are entire books written on it!
Now that I remember Ron Penton did a whole book 700+ pages on one and that didn't even include any graphics just text and the networking code!



[Edited by - daviangel on January 9, 2009 3:24:17 AM]

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Original post by vader88
Ok, I understand what you guys are saying. I guess maybe I presented the idea wrong. I didn't necessarily mean massive when I said an MMO game. I just meant the elements of it. Even if it is only me and some friends or whatever. Something like up to 30 people concurrently maybe. But it would be partly an MMO in that it is a persistent universe. Does this sound more reasonable or am I still shooting way over my head?


Why do you have to introduce the network component to this thing? Why not make a basic FPS or something first to get a handle on how to work in 3d?

Trying to learn (just a few things to list):
3d techniques
an api for the above
networking
an api for the above
gameplay programming
gui interfaces

all at the same time is recipe for failure. I suggest tackling something like a simple FPS where you can incrementally get something up and running without having to focus on scalability issues for networking and multiplayer as you work on the more simple tasks of getting a camera moving in a 3d world.

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