Edited by - bishop_pass on June 27, 2001 12:47:45 AM
Elements of Creativity
Author
What are they? Can you put your findger on them?
Analogy: The process of being able to take one concept and change it into another concept in a different spectrum while retaining certain analogous elements.
Common sense knowledge: Drawing from the mundane and simple, things which we take for granted, and using this knowledge to reason about the consequences of an idea and to provide background details for an idea.
Experience: Personal real life experiences provide elements which can be used to build new ideas and concepts.
Anybody care to elaborate on the above or enumerate any others?
Edited by - bishop_pass on June 27, 2001 12:47:45 AM
Edited by - bishop_pass on June 27, 2001 12:47:45 AM
Hi bishop pass. Your email about the large format pictures was very helpful by the way, thank you. 
Anyway, creativity:
Inductive reasoning: You see 3 pictures of various mountains, from which you form a generic concept "hypothetical mountain"
Agency: Now you can decide to generate a mountain of your own.
Aesthetic Opinions: You can''t create a mountain unless you can decide what size, shape, color, etc. you want it to be.
I think that''s the basics. But to get art you need predictive psychology (ability to madel what another person will think of your ctreation)
Anyway, creativity:
Inductive reasoning: You see 3 pictures of various mountains, from which you form a generic concept "hypothetical mountain"
Agency: Now you can decide to generate a mountain of your own.
Aesthetic Opinions: You can''t create a mountain unless you can decide what size, shape, color, etc. you want it to be.
I think that''s the basics. But to get art you need predictive psychology (ability to madel what another person will think of your ctreation)
Author
quote:Original post by sunandshadow
Hi bishop pass. Your email about the large format pictures was very helpful by the way, thank you.
You are very welcome, sunandshadow.
quote:
I think that''s the basics. But to get art you need predictive psychology (ability to madel what another person will think of your creation)
That is an interesting point. And valid. So creativity involves a conceptual understanding of the creator''s audience.
Your comment about seeing 3 mountains from which you develop an understanding of what mountains are reminds me of the Platonic concept of ''forms''. The physical objects we interact with on the worldly plane are actual imperfect manifestations of their ideal form. So, when you see a chair it is actually only a representation of what a chair actually is. Sounds a bit silly I know but it''s a rather interesting concept when you think about it.
One vital element to creativity is being able to identify what is universal in all things. In understanding the universal, you can find a language of words, context, objects, and ideas that speaks to an audience. They may not always understand why it is meaningful to them, but you will manage to touch them in some way.
Just my 2 cents.
One vital element to creativity is being able to identify what is universal in all things. In understanding the universal, you can find a language of words, context, objects, and ideas that speaks to an audience. They may not always understand why it is meaningful to them, but you will manage to touch them in some way.
Just my 2 cents.
Hmm, I thought ideal forms were aristotle''s, but it''s been a long time since thet philosophy class...
Anyway, the important distinction is that ideal forms supposedly really existid in some heavenly space somewhere, where human minds could know about them. I think, on the other hand, that every person has an innate ability to manufacture these ideals, plus some innate biases about which curves and angles and color combinations are attractive, and every person makes their own set of these ideal that other people don''t really have access to, and no two people have exactly the same ideal.
Anyway, the important distinction is that ideal forms supposedly really existid in some heavenly space somewhere, where human minds could know about them. I think, on the other hand, that every person has an innate ability to manufacture these ideals, plus some innate biases about which curves and angles and color combinations are attractive, and every person makes their own set of these ideal that other people don''t really have access to, and no two people have exactly the same ideal.
Well, I believe it was Plato who introduced the concept, but considering Aristotle was his student there''s strong likelihood that they each had some ideas on the matter.
While I don''t disagree (fundamentally) with your last statement, I do think that what is actually of significance is that even though we may not have the same ''ideal'' of a particular object, event, etc., we can still recognize enough of our own ideal in other people''s that these things remain meaningful. Hence the value of calling on ''shared experience'' in storytelling -- being able to draw upon our own experiences (or those experience vicariously through imagination) to find a language of ideas and experience that speaks to other people and draws them into a story. (I know this discussion is on creativity and not storytelling, but it is a forum about writing after all).
R.
While I don''t disagree (fundamentally) with your last statement, I do think that what is actually of significance is that even though we may not have the same ''ideal'' of a particular object, event, etc., we can still recognize enough of our own ideal in other people''s that these things remain meaningful. Hence the value of calling on ''shared experience'' in storytelling -- being able to draw upon our own experiences (or those experience vicariously through imagination) to find a language of ideas and experience that speaks to other people and draws them into a story. (I know this discussion is on creativity and not storytelling, but it is a forum about writing after all).
R.
I don''t see much point to intellectual analysis on a non-intellectual activity. I mean, figuring out what environmental conditions are conducive to creativity is one thing, but trying to break creativity down into discrete pieces seems to me like trying to capture sunlight in a shoebox.
So why not spend the effort exercising your creativity instead of talking about it? I offer Scott McCloud''s 24-hour Comics challenge, seen here
Go for it. And there''s an option to do a play if you''re not visually minded.
JSwing
Whoops. There''s supposed to be a ''puts on flame retardant underwear'' in the top line of the prev post - that''s what I get for not loggin in. D''oh!
JSwing
JSwing
I would say originality plays a big part in creativity. Being able to use things in a different way than they were intended is also creative. Could creativity be defined as a change from the norm?
The problem with your statment JSwing is your assumptions ... you say "why talk about this when you could be doing something instead" ... but this IS doing something ... having fun engaging your brain to think about things you normaly just accept or ignore. And the reason we do it is not really just to find the answers, but to actually enjoy the experience of thinking and discussing ... which is a lot easier for me to do to relex on my 15 minute breaks, than creating a comic.
My father once asked me "What is more important, the questions or the answers" .. to which we both agree that it is the questions. This is one of those forever interesting questions that is fun for the sake of asking ...
"Is the world Analog or Digital?" This one also came from my dad ... and we went round and round when we had the occasion to talk ... for the next few months ... until we finally decidied ... well ... I guess I should let you think first.
Shared Experience is the foundation upon which all other human connections rest ... including language, art, everyhing ... But the only universal forms that it really proves exist are the similar pathways and behaviors of human brains ... and only in the statistical sense ... we don''t each think the same thing .. but through careful testing when we learned the word .. we are close enough to get by. There is a wide range between the thoughts and behaviors of different humans, therefore most of our core language is either extremely vague (love, hard), or very exact and demonstraitable (iron, 6 feet tall). We can all agree that we like sex .. but primarily for 3 reasons: 1 - we are human and evolution has ensured we are built that way (it didn''t ententionally make us that way, but those who like sex breed more - and over millinia the statistical effect is quite considerable) ... 2 - we each mean something subtly different by ''like'' (even from usage to usage) ... 3 - we each think different things are ''sex''.
Last but not least ... why do you consider creativity to be different than intelect? In my experience as a Dungeon Master, Programmer, Writer, Game Player, Reader, Dreamer, Lover, Human, Drinker, Thinker ... I have come to view creativity as a highly intelectual activity ... calling upon very large amounts of intelectual analysis ... much more so than doing math or phisics problems ... think about it ... the author streches him imagination to invision something different .. analyses and modifies it to make it more attractive ... disects it to understand what it makes him .. and will make his readers .. feel ... searches for sections that detract from the experience of reading .. or take away from the "authintic" feel of the characters ... revises and revises ... etc ... and of all of these processes .. the ones that seperates a great writer from a lazy drifter are NOT lack of non-intelectual things .. but lack of the intelectual aspects of imagination, creativity, determination, etc ...
So ... I feel these ideas are related directly to the topic ... I feel that the elements are creativity are the sum total of your intelect ... and their combined application ... deciding to combine human reaction to mathematics (geometric patterns) and the effects of sound upon the brain creates the field of music, etc.
Good Luck
My father once asked me "What is more important, the questions or the answers" .. to which we both agree that it is the questions. This is one of those forever interesting questions that is fun for the sake of asking ...
"Is the world Analog or Digital?" This one also came from my dad ... and we went round and round when we had the occasion to talk ... for the next few months ... until we finally decidied ... well ... I guess I should let you think first.
Shared Experience is the foundation upon which all other human connections rest ... including language, art, everyhing ... But the only universal forms that it really proves exist are the similar pathways and behaviors of human brains ... and only in the statistical sense ... we don''t each think the same thing .. but through careful testing when we learned the word .. we are close enough to get by. There is a wide range between the thoughts and behaviors of different humans, therefore most of our core language is either extremely vague (love, hard), or very exact and demonstraitable (iron, 6 feet tall). We can all agree that we like sex .. but primarily for 3 reasons: 1 - we are human and evolution has ensured we are built that way (it didn''t ententionally make us that way, but those who like sex breed more - and over millinia the statistical effect is quite considerable) ... 2 - we each mean something subtly different by ''like'' (even from usage to usage) ... 3 - we each think different things are ''sex''.
Last but not least ... why do you consider creativity to be different than intelect? In my experience as a Dungeon Master, Programmer, Writer, Game Player, Reader, Dreamer, Lover, Human, Drinker, Thinker ... I have come to view creativity as a highly intelectual activity ... calling upon very large amounts of intelectual analysis ... much more so than doing math or phisics problems ... think about it ... the author streches him imagination to invision something different .. analyses and modifies it to make it more attractive ... disects it to understand what it makes him .. and will make his readers .. feel ... searches for sections that detract from the experience of reading .. or take away from the "authintic" feel of the characters ... revises and revises ... etc ... and of all of these processes .. the ones that seperates a great writer from a lazy drifter are NOT lack of non-intelectual things .. but lack of the intelectual aspects of imagination, creativity, determination, etc ...
So ... I feel these ideas are related directly to the topic ... I feel that the elements are creativity are the sum total of your intelect ... and their combined application ... deciding to combine human reaction to mathematics (geometric patterns) and the effects of sound upon the brain creates the field of music, etc.
Good Luck
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