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Siegfried

Do you ever play "real" games?

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Siegfried    122
Do you ever play real games, modern games. From what ive seen of your ideas for games I would have thought that we were in 1990. Have you not played the brilliant opperation flashpoint or Hidden and Dangerous? If you have why do u all want to make these crappy old style 2d RPGs with wizards, goblins and that shit. Why not try something new, we have the technology and many of you havre the skill. Now what i mean by a modern game is not Final Fantasy 8 or diablo 2 because they are old ideas, in an old style. Programmers, Artists, Designers, you do on the whole lack any new inspiration, just forget RPGs and try something new.

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Andrew Russell    1394
Uh, this dosn''t look like flame bait?

Answer to your question:

Because this is what we feel like doing. Generaly RPG is any kind of interactive world with charctisation and development (depending on your view point). The reason that we like this kind of game style is:

A) because, no it hasn''t really been done well, there are lots of klick''n''kills

B) RPGs cover a wide range of things that are posible, it is hard to create somthing with a similar feel to RPG, without being an RPG

Personaly, I have been trying to make an RPG that has both really good graphics, and self generated story (entirly non-liner). Some people think I am mad because I am not only straying away from standard (Diablo II) RPGs, but it would be really hard to make. Well I don''t care because I have set it as a chalange. I am sure if you had seen more stuff on this forum, you would see that, while we do make lots of RPGs, most of them have a huge ammount of innovation which is a massive credit to their creator (you know who you are, guys, you rock )

Anyways, your question has been answered, I will leave it up to MKV weather or not to close this most obvious flame bait thread.

ANDREW RUSSELL STUDIOS

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Siegfried    122
Sigh..... This is how to make a good game

1. Think of a great film
2. Think why you enjoyed the film
3. Try and put the great aspects of the film into a game (without the game baring too much relevance to the film)
4. Take good aspects from other films and bobs ur uncle.... a great game!!!


For example if I was making a game I would incorperate the atmosphere of the helicopter attack in Apochalypse Now, that would be fun...

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SkyRat    122
How nice from you to share your secret.
I''m sure no one has ever thought of that before.
Now that everybody knows how to make l33t r0x0r games everyone here will make only games you like, because you obviously have the best style.

Once again thank you



Humanity''s first sin was faith; the first virtue was doubt

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granat    122
Why don´t me make something like Operation Flashpoint....

Hmm...let me think...Well...we are amateurs...we code games in our sparetime...

Most of us simply don´t have the technical knowledge to make a game like Operation Flashpoint...And it would require good artists as well....Many of us have no artists at all...

But let me ask...What are YOU doing ? It must be something very cool !!!

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BobyDimitrov    122
SkyRat, if that wasn''t sarcasm, I don''t know that iw was...

And Siegfried, games are not movies. Read some posts from the past.

Boby Dimitrov
boby@shararagames.com
Sharara Games Team

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Cyberdrek    100
quote:
Original post by Siegfried
Do you ever play real games, modern games. From what ive seen of your ideas for games I would have thought that we were in 1990. Have you not played the brilliant opperation flashpoint or Hidden and Dangerous? If you have why do u all want to make these crappy old style 2d RPGs with wizards, goblins and that shit. Why not try something new, we have the technology and many of you havre the skill. Now what i mean by a modern game is not Final Fantasy 8 or diablo 2 because they are old ideas, in an old style. Programmers, Artists, Designers, you do on the whole lack any new inspiration, just forget RPGs and try something new.



Haven''t you ever heard about not saying anything if you don''t have anything good to say. People don''t really care about what you have to say. If we like RPGs or 3D shooters or what ever, Let them do it and if you think you''ve got something with your idea, why don''t you make it????







"And that''s the bottom line cause I said so!"

Cyberdrek
Headhunter Soft
A division of DLC Multimedia

Resist Windows XP''s Invasive Production Activation Technology!

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bishop_pass    109
You are right Siegfried. Now I see that all of my discussion related to situation creation, graph partitioning of knowledge bases, abductive reasoning, resolution refutation, characters which have belief systems and hypothesize about world states, planning using situation calculus, calculation of drainage basin networks for erosion simulation and caching the results of form factors from terrain patches to skydome patches are all of the archaic methods of games of the early ''90s.

And no, I have never played a real game. I have only played fake ones. My favorite fake game was Zork I by Infocom. And what is Operation Flashpoint? I honestly have never heard of it. But then again, I generally don''t pay too much attention to the current crop of games. A failure of mine no doubt. Instead, I am wrapped up in games of a more ''real'' nature, like climbing fourteen thousand foot peaks, building a business, exploring my corner of the world, and in general learning from it, so I may draw inspiration and knowledge from it to develop new ideas for games of tomorrow.

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Yes, in fact just last night I beat down my father in a game of chess. And I do so love a game of Scrabble. Oh, wait, you''re not talking *REAL* real games, you''re talking the latest crop of mindless drivel that has been coming out recently for my PC. Yes, I play quite alot of that too, mindless drivel games are pretty fun. But they really do lack the style of, say, Space Quest.

-Ryan "Run_The_Shadows"
-Run_The_Shadows@excite.com
"Doubt Everything. Find your own light." -Dying words of Gautama
//BLATANT PLUG
My manic new web journal! Warning: Some ''adult'' language used, not suitable for anyone without a sense of deep-thought and cynicism

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Blue*Omega    150
Sorry, I didn''t read all the posts, so someone may have covered this already but...

The very essence of a game is that there IS NO RIGHT WAY! These games are meant to be flexible and everchanging. There is no recipe book in which is says:


To make a game:

1/2 cup blockbuster movie
3 tsp intelligent script (optional)
5 lb. flashy eye candy
2 cups swords and sorcery
pinch of giant monsters that can only be defated by _______
Sprinkle liberally with underdressed, over endowed women.

instructions:
throw ingredients into a large bowl, mix well, randomly pull out ideas, insert $6 billion into production machine, relase to clueless public. ^_^


Sorry again, didn''t mean to go off on that. But the point is, even if all games, or evan all succseful games, seem to follow a pattern, it doesn''t mean that that''s the right way to make a game. Point in case: Black & White.

Oh well, enough of my bitching. Have fun flaming me.

-----------------------------

Vash the Stampede

"Love & Peace!"

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Caffeine    122
"Yeah. I was reading some of this shit by this tolkein guy, he had the technology to write about REAL stuff like in rainbow six, but no it was all goblins and shit.

Dude, goblins are gay."

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Kylotan    9860
So... this person says RPGs are not original, and not new... and then advocates ripping off all his ideas from films. I think that says it all about this argument.

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Wavinator    2017
quote:
Original post by Siegfried
Do you ever play real games, modern games. From what ive seen of your ideas for games I would have thought that we were in 1990.


Try again.

If you want to persuade people to follow a direction, blustering and accusation aren''t the best methods of persuasion.

If you want to change topics on this board, post something new yourself.

btw, as far as movies go, I posted a thread about scripted action sequences a few months ago which you can find (if you''re so inclined) using the search.

--------------------
Just waiting for the mothership...

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Siegfried    122
ehem...

does anyone climb mount everest without talking to experts?

does anyone write novels if they have read none?

does anyone make a cake having never eaten or seen one?

does anyone make a game without playing one?

If J. S. Bach had never heard any music he would never have become a great composer!

Play some great games!
ie. Opperation Flashpoint
Codename Eagle
Half Life
Age of Kings
Tropico
Hidden and Dangerous

all very ispired and profound games.

PS Fidel Castro is great

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MuteAngel    122
quote:
Original post by Siegfried
ehem...

does anyone climb mount everest without talking to experts?

does anyone write novels if they have read none?

does anyone make a cake having never eaten or seen one?

does anyone make a game without playing one?

If J. S. Bach had never heard any music he would never have become a great composer!




Well.. I guess some are making great RPG because they play great RPG. So your argument is kind of pointless...

If you like that kind of game so much, and think that everything else is "shit", why don''t you just make the next killer game? Try and come with something original, design it, program it, create the visuals and the music/SFK, etc. Then come back here and tell me what to do, I''ll listen.

Wish you luck...

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Ronin_54    122
Siegfried, let us expand that little list of yours:

Play some great games!
ie. Baldurs Gate (1&2)
Fallout (1&2)
Icewind Dale
Planescape Torment

And soon:
Neverwinter Nights
Arcanum
Torm

Now, should I also bore you with sales numbers? RPG''s are still alive these days,

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I''m sorry, but that last comment of your Siegfried really fired me up.
I vote that this thread be closed on grounds that Siegfried is not contributing to any intelligent discussion, and instead is simply trolling and baiting.

-Ryan "Run_The_Shadows"
-Run_The_Shadows@excite.com
"Doubt Everything. Find your own light." -Dying words of Gautama
//BLATANT PLUG
My manic new web journal! Warning: Some ''adult'' language used, not suitable for anyone without a sense of deep-thought and cynicism

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granat    122
Sure...close it...He is an idiot !

(I´m no fan of RPG´s myself but I don´t imply that people who play them suck or anything)...



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Outworlder    100
quote:
Original post by Siegfried
Sigh..... This is how to make a good game

1. Think of a great film
2. Think why you enjoyed the film
3. Try and put the great aspects of the film into a game (without the game baring too much relevance to the film)
4. Take good aspects from other films and bobs ur uncle.... a great game!!!


For example if I was making a game I would incorperate the atmosphere of the helicopter attack in Apochalypse Now, that would be fun...



Does anyone remember Acclaim? Movie licenses, shitty games. Enough said.



Gaiomard Dragon
-===(UDIC)===-

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Dauntless    314
Why does a game have to be modern to be good? IF you dislike the "fantastical" (whether it be fantasy or sci-fi), that''s all well and good for your personal tastes, but in no way diminishes the worthiness of other genres.

I personally happen to like "realistic" game settings the most, and loved Hidden and Dangerous, Rainbow Six, and can''t wait for MOH: Allied Assault, and H&D2. I''m also an avid WWII flight sim junkie and I liked Flashpoint as well (when it doesn''t crash on me). But if you think about it, what about all the other great time periods that game designers never cover?

How about a Civil War FPS (think it''s stupid? Imagine the skill necessary it would take to be able to shoot and reload in a game like that....imagine taking your shot knowing it will take a minute to reload while your enemy is advancing on you). How about playing a Trench Raider in WWI (these guys would sneak across the no man''s land at night and slit a few throats...). How about a Western FPS (maybe play one of Chief Joseph''s Nez Perce braves armed with a Henry rifle....they were better armed than our Cavalry). Or what about playing an English foot soldier in any of their Colonial wars (Zulu Dawn or Boer War anyone?). How about playing an American Marine in the early 1900''s (Filipino Insurrection jungle fighting or Boxer Rebellion float your boat?)? Shoot, why not have a pseudo Rune/Blade of Darkness/FPS of boarding parties of the 16-18th centuries (fend off pirate boarding parties, then go cutlass to cutlass)?

At first glance these ideas may seem silly...why play something with one shot muzzle loaders, or lever action repeaters? But how many people have REALLY sat down and thought about what the gameplay would be like? Frankly, I''d be just as interested in buying a "historical" shooter as anything else just because it would be different.

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Kylotan    9860
quote:
Original post by Siegfried
Yeah but they''re still crap

play some good games


And with that nugget of genius, this is obviously flame-bait and I''m closing it, by popular demand. (Hope MKV doesn''t mind: don''t think he''s seen this thread. He can always reopen it ) Those of you who were moving onto valid points, feel free to repost in a new thread.

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