The problem I have with PKers is that they usually kill without a good reason to do so. At least, not a reason that works inside the context of the game. Perhaps a good reason to kill in the context of the game would be making alignment a key component of the character. If the game allows characters to be evil, let's say, then there should be real consequences of choosing that alignment. The game should have good creatures that won't attack good players, but will go out of their way to attack evil characters. The good creatures should dynamically gang up on marauding evil parties - in other words not just waiting around for someone to attack them. Instead, the creatures work together to hunt down characters of opposing alignments. Especially if the parties contain higher-level characters.

And if we are going to implement something that will make going to town difficult, you better make sure that the players have a real good reason to go to town in the first place. I mean, if I'm a level 100 wizard, do I have a need to go to town at all anymore? If not, I can kill at will in the wilderness.

Cya,
Dave

To use UO as an example, towns are crucial for supplies. Period. Wizards need reagents. Period.

However, someone could have a lackey to go into town for them. However, once it became known that the lackey worked for this wizard, he would be in bad shape.

I personally think taking over a town would be okay. However, it would take a lot of strength, many deaths, and it would take even more strength to HOLD a city. Don't you think that once the guards in other cities heard about the deaths of their friends, they would come down and form an attack force?

*****
The main problem with today's CRPGs is that the developers use stupid, unrealistic hacks to solve problems that are solved automatically in the real world but they can't figure out how to in the game world. The answer is more realism. Social realism in this case, since social outcasts in today's games are rampant.
*****

- Splat

Well, if it's stupid, unrealistic hacks you're worried about, why not simply make it very easy to die? I know, I know...the issue is that the player will *hate* the experience. But it does *alleviate* the PK problem very handily

I have very few illusions about such a game becoming a 'hit', so to speak, but you just never know...Players might flock to your game because they can immediately find and kill the scuzzbag who just wasted their character.
The danger is then that the world degenerates into a-feudin' and a-fightin'. But at least the player is empowered to a-feud and a-fight. Heck, you might even see some character development taking place.

Anyway,
now I KNOW I'm dreaming.

signing off,
mikey

Ok, I know this is a revolutionary idea, but why not make all the characters in the game the same "level"? In fact, abolish levels! Allow everyone in the game to create a fully realistic character at the beginning of the game with whatever skills and attributes they want. That warrior may be really strong and good at fighting, but he is may also be an idiot that could be outsmarted by an intelligent farmer. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses, and their are no level 50 people beating on helpless level 1 guys. And not to pick on Everquest, but that game SUCKS until you get to AT LEAST level 10 or so. What is the fun of hardly being able to go anywhere because you'll die for the first two weeks of the game?
Now some of you may be thinking, what is the fun of having a character that is complete when you start the game? Well, first of all, their are always quests to go on, cities to trade in, and taverns to have a little social fun. The players could improve their skills to an extent (but perhaps at the cost of other skills). Like a warrior could go to a Wizard's Guild and eventually completely convert his character into a Wizard! No need to start the whole game over!
Also, allow everyone to do anything they want - like in real life. Yes I know their are jerks out there who will just go around killing other people. But, as in real life, bounty hunters, soldiers, or guards (real players or NPCs) could hunt the vile scum to extinction, thereby balancing the game. Or a player could initiate a vote to "boot" offending players (as in Starsiege: Tribes).
Ok, I've rambled on enough. That is my vision for the future of RPGs.

I think it all comes down to how relistic you want to get in your world. In the real world there are hundread of murders a day ,and ppl get away with it. Also guards be super powerful is generaly unrelistic(unless there like royal guards ect). Remember police/guards take money, and ppl that want to do there job(not all of thoose ppl are super powerful bad boys in real life). Also what about assasians? Instead of them directly killing someone they poison the city well and hundreads die.

It all comes down to its your world you make the rules. How about when you die you die time to start a new character. Also please forgive the grammer,and spelling in this msg(its 1am and i don't feel very well.)

I was taking a shower and I had an ideia to have more control over killing (not finish with it, as it part of the game).

A "shame" factor could be added for each player. If a higher level player tries to kill a newbie (and I mean a guy with level 255 trying to kill a level 1 guy), a dice is throwed and the level 1 guy could kill the 255 guy with one hit

In the other hand, if a level 1 guy tries to kill a 255 guy, this feature is disabled, so newbie backstabing is not allowed

A very good feature and not used in MANY games was included in Diablo. If you keep killing all creatures in the 1rst dungeon level, and restarting the game, you could'nt rise up after level 11 (exp). The exp you gain per killing becomes smaller as your level keeps going up.

It's a very good way to discourage newbie killing, as the killer would get no advantage and takes the risk of dying with one strike.

The same could be implemented with levels, for exemple, if the attacker has >20 levels above the attacked. He would get no experience and have the risk to die.

So what do you think ?

I like the rumors/charisma thing, as well as the idea of graded experience.
What about the whole different strokes for different folks cliche? Some obviously want a totally chaotic society, where might makes right, others want strict laws (read coded rules). If you designed from the beginning the ability to have variants based on this (and other argued game features) then you could better implement different shards(UO induced obviously) with different standards.
Some ingenious fellow, not me, could fit this onto each shard (diffent locations behaving differently). This would make it easy to have conquered (evil) towns, where the roles are switched somewhat.
This could be dynamically implemented by GM's and programmers. Again, it would, IMHO, be better to have designed this from the start.
But I think a fame attribute is VERY important. Asheron's Call has a good idea on this.
As far as the rumors idea goes, this would be a good start to limit abuse of game structure faults. (e.g. Ten UO "Great Lords" killing others, newbie or not, by tricking the criminal flag feature). In the example, many would see this happen, but would just have to continue on in frustration as these char's reaped the benefits of having "good" chars.
I have seen some well played evil chars out there, and I thought it added a much needed edge to the game. However, if a bunch of punks that play 24/7 go around rampaging just because they get off on frustrating others, then a rumor idea, might make it much harder do this and still be seen as a good character by the gaming world at large.
After all, if you only get a chance to play about 2-8 hours a week, you still wan't to play and have fun. The game wouldn't sell to many in this case, if it didn't protect them.
However, as stated above, many like a full dog-kill-dog world (or area) and they could have it!

btw, I agree that too much reality can be bad... after all this is an escape. Would anyone here make a game called Life Sucks, where your char spends his life driving in horrible traffic to work, is given past due deadlines that he/she is now responsible for, only to be chased by (player or NPC) rampaging IRS officials, and bill collectors?