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Kada

Java applets the thing we need?

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Hello Gamedev! I have a small development team that is experienced in C++, some Java (will need to hit the books and relearn it), PHP, and SQL. We are trying to create a web game that is capable of these three things: -We need the game to be graphical, and run in a normal game loop without the need to reload the web page -Need the browser to be able to communicate to a server -Need that server to be able to connect to a database Requirements are pretty simple; The issue we are having is trying to determine whether we should go with Java Applets, or if this is not capable of meeting our three requirements. Gamedev has been fantastic in the past in providing me information regarding OpenGL, so I am confident we will again have great luck posting here. On behalf of myself and the rest of the team, we thank you and wish you Happy Coding! I should add that if Java is infact what you all recommend, please inform us if you know any "go to" sites for Java Applet game programming that you know of that we should check out. Good chance I'll end up finding the pages on my own during our research, but it wouldn't hurt. Thanks again

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When developing applications that are supposed to be embedded in a webbrowser, Java and Flash are the only realistic options to begin with, and while C++ programmers (like me) tend to like flaming on java lacking `foundamentals`, Java is still way superiour to Flash when it comes to `real` programming.

The only `problem` with java applets is that - the way i see it - only few people actually have java virtual machines installed, as over the last 5~10 years nearly all java applets in the web became replaced by either flash ones, javascript,ajax or were completely removed.

You can find tutorials on java (applet) programming on http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/

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Thanks for the reply.

To be honest, my team has mixed skills for the job.

The three of us are well versed in C++, along with SDL/OpenGL/Socket Programming, and have a background in PHP->SQL connectivity.

For Java, we understand that it is closer to "real programming", and that using multiple files and OOP will be a lot easier than trying to learn from scratch how to make games using Flash, with the difficult symbol library and it's multi-layered timeline (ahh, scared to learn that. It's cryptic). But like you said, a lot of people are ready to play a flash game, whereas they may be turned off by being required to download Java.

Either way, we'll have to spend time reading documentation and tutorials. Just haven't decided yet if Flash is the better option.

I'll leave the floor open for discussion. Hopefully you guys can help!

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Quote:
Original post by Kada
For Java, we understand that it is closer to "real programming", and that using multiple files and OOP will be a lot easier than trying to learn from scratch how to make games using Flash, with the difficult symbol library and it's multi-layered timeline (ahh, scared to learn that. It's cryptic). But like you said, a lot of people are ready to play a flash game, whereas they may be turned off by being required to download Java.
Have you considered Adobe Flex? Basically a coding environment for ActionScript to produce Flash executables. It gives you a traditional coding environment, and gets away from all the graphical stuff inherent in the Flash IDE.

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There's haXe, too - it can be compiled to Flash, C++, PHP, javascript and Neko. I've been using it for quite some time now to develop Flash games with and it's pretty solid as a replacement for Actionscript. Works well with FlashDevelop and the Flex SDK.

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Topic Creator Here:

I wanted to post this to show you guys.

Apparently I was wrong about Flash, since I only have experience with Old versions of Flash and ActionScript 2.0.

AS3 focuses on object-oriented principles, similar to "real programming", and enables the user to make programs and games on ONE FRAME and ONE LAYER. To people who used AS2, you will know that this is a HUGE difference.

Here is a kick*** tutorial I found, which I am going to sit down and spend a lot of time on.

http://gamedev.michaeljameswilliams.com/2008/09/17/avoider-game-tutorial-1/

As it did to me, this may change your perspective on Flash when trying to decide between Java Applets and Flash, as my development team did.

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Just to add my 2 cents in, I'm a C++ console / PC game developer by profession and have tried both actionscript and java applets for web games.

Java applets are cool cause you can get to OpenGL (if you really try hard!) but applets are soooo problematic it isnt even worth it.

Actionscript and its cousins seem to be the web game language FTW (:

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Hi check out this discussion, which is on a similar topic:

here
With Java in a browser, you have two options:
- Applets
- Java Web Start

Applets are proven to be problematic, so Java Web Start has been introduced as an alternative.

Note that games such as Runescape have been running as an applet for years - so I assume it works on enough people's PCs to justify using it.

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Flash/AS3 is a great language for browser based game development. It has a good API for 2D graphics. The language is quite close to Java in syntax and features.

Downsides to Flash:
It is interpreted and has poor performance in anything that requires lots of computation. 3D really stretches Flash's capabilities, especially on older machines. Flash 10 boosted performance, but it will always lag way behind native code.
Networking only supports TCP/IP.
No multi-threading.

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