Sign in to follow this  
D4n1s

Probably a strange question.

Recommended Posts

I had this kind of strange question while creating a 3d model... Why its so easy to create a really good 3d model and there are games with worst 3d models. I am wondering why do 3d game developers don't use good 3d models, its because of memory? its because of hardware nonsupport or what?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I think the simple answer is that graphics cards in general can only render so many polygons at a time. This restricts the detail of game models. Memory is also a factor.

I wouldn't say it is really easy to create great models either although I'm not an artist! :p

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There is much, much more to putting a 3D model into a game than just creating the model. It also has to be textured, "rigged" (i.e. given a "skeleton" to define how the parts of the model can move relative to each other), and then animations created using that rigging. Finally it has to be programmed to use the animations, and possibly to adapt the animations to everything else that's going on in the game physics (e.g. collision).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
And of course texturing doesn't mean just putting an image onto it. In addition to the usual diffuse map(s), you'll need specularity maps, reflectivity maps, bump maps, maybe even subsurface maps. You'll need to make sure your model has clean and non-degenerated tangents everywhere for normal mapping. You might need convex envelopes for collision and physics. You might need facial animation data matched to the model. If you want to use the new DX11/OGL4 hardware tesselation engine, you need additional parametric data defined all over the model.

And of course it is certainly not easy to create a really good looking 3D model. In fact, digital artists able to create really high quality 3D models are a pretty rare species, and usually cost a shitload of money. So either the OP is an amazingly talented artist, or our definitions of "really good 3d model" differ significantly :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I am referring to MMORPGs mostly. Like wow which has really low poly models.
And strategy games mostly. But lets say... If I create a game with really really
really really really complicated 3d models with thousands of polys, is there any
possibility to not be able to even run it? If yes what prevents me? Graphics card
memory? And what I can do to be able to play it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote:
Original post by D4n1s
I am referring to MMORPGs mostly. Like wow which has really low poly models.
And strategy games mostly.

These type of games have high unit counts, which multiplies the number of polygons the hardware has to handle.

Quote:
But lets say... If I create a game with really really
really really really complicated 3d models with thousands of polys, is there any
possibility to not be able to even run it? If yes what prevents me? Graphics card
memory? And what I can do to be able to play it?

It would probably run, but with unsatisfactory performance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
graphics card memory would be the main problem... cpu usage would skyrocket as well.

WoW has low poly models but it has a huge world, which most likely is preloaded to a good point. Not to mention, Blizzard is very very big and good on making their games compatible to as many systems as possible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote:
Original post by D4n1s
I am referring to MMORPGs mostly. Like wow which has really low poly models.
And strategy games mostly. But lets say... If I create a game with really really
really really really complicated 3d models with thousands of polys, is there any
possibility to not be able to even run it? If yes what prevents me? Graphics card
memory? And what I can do to be able to play it?


Memory isn't a huge issue for model detail (Texture detail have a much larger impact) , the polygon count however greatly affects render time, more polygons means that the model takes longer to render and thus you get a lower framerate.

The more models you have on screen at the same time the lower their detail has to be for things to run smoothly, the use of other effects like textures, lighting, shadows etc also forces you to reduce model detail.

If you mainly target "hardcore" gamers you can push things alot harder than if you target the broad mainstream since they are more likely to have high end hardware.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote:
If you mainly target "hardcore" gamers you can push things alot harder than if you target the broad mainstream since they are more likely to have high end hardware.


But note that hardcore gamers have this high end hardware partly in order to get good performance, and they are much more likely to notice, or even be annoyed by poor FPS than casual players. So don't push too hard :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I am not really into to hardcore games but now that I am thinkin of it better,
in the trailers that they use 3d models and in 3d anim movies that than became
a game they don't use the same models. You can almost notice that in every game
the trailer is the 10% of the actual game graphics. But I have still
noticed Call of Duty MW2 that had these amazing graphics, effects, it was
really stunning... and I am just wondering what stops ppl from creating that
good games? I mean they done it with COD MW2 what seems to be the problem?
I am thinkin that it could be due to greed. Game developers want to
target a big range of computers and thats why they adjust their game to this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
with no doubt the program will run, but thousands of polygons on a model will lower framerate, and if there are enough, the frame rate will drop well below 1 fps. now, some platfoms shutdown games and applications that are not responding or using way to much memory, so what you use your polygons on, is up to you.



with the game im developeing, i can have about 50,000 polygons being accesed by a function and the framerate wont drop. thats probably because i set it to 30 anyway, but as i said, its up to you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote:
Original post by D4n1s
I am not really into to hardcore games but now that I am thinkin of it better,
in the trailers that they use 3d models and in 3d anim movies that than became
a game they don't use the same models. You can almost notice that in every game
the trailer is the 10% of the actual game graphics. But I have still
noticed Call of Duty MW2 that had these amazing graphics, effects, it was
really stunning... and I am just wondering what stops ppl from creating that
good games? I mean they done it with COD MW2 what seems to be the problem?
I am thinkin that it could be due to greed. Game developers want to
target a big range of computers and thats why they adjust their game to this.


Targeting a broad range of hardware isn't just greed, all developers want their software to be used, If people can't afford the hardware required by your software noone will use it, Even people who give their software away for free wants as many as possible to use their software.

MW2 graphics isn't that special, its a new game and looks on par with most other new games in the same genre, it doesn't really push the limits of what could be done, (It targets fairly old hardware such as the PS3 and xbox360 aswell as older PCs)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote:
Original post by D4n1s
I am not really into to hardcore games but now that I am thinkin of it better,
in the trailers that they use 3d models and in 3d anim movies that than became
a game they don't use the same models. You can almost notice that in every game
the trailer is the 10% of the actual game graphics.


This is the same reason you saw most JRPG games on the 1st generation consoles come with pre-rendered cutscenes: the designers wanted great visuals for the really intense story sequences, but the hardware couldn't handle that, so they pre-rendered the video. Since pre-rendering can take as long as you want (as opposed to real-time rendering of game assets every frame), they can use incredibly high-detail models for the movie sequences. A great example is the cutscenes in Warcraft III: the floor in the throne room of Lordaeron was made from individually modeled stones, which "clogged up [their] render farm for weeks" (quoted from the Art of Warcraft book).

It shouldn't surprise you then that the in-game models can't be created with the same level of detail.

Quote:
But I have still
noticed Call of Duty MW2 that had these amazing graphics, effects, it was
really stunning... and I am just wondering what stops ppl from creating that
good games? I mean they done it with COD MW2 what seems to be the problem?
I am thinkin that it could be due to greed. Game developers want to
target a big range of computers and thats why they adjust their game to this.


What you're talking about is a zero-sum situation: MW2 is drawing fewer models with higher polygon counts, while games like WoW are drawing many more models with lower polygon counts. Abstractly: 5*100 == 100*5.

There's only so much hardware to use for your graphics, and if you start to get into the programming aspect of graphics, you'll see just how much has to be done 30-60 times per second to create these visuals. You'll also discover how much energy goes into creating the illusion of a seamless world, high populations, long view distances, and so on. For example, many FPS games with high model detail will limit your viewable area with the level layout (blind corners, indoor areas, etc). Just because a team of dozens of programmers or artists makes it look easy, doesn't mean it is easy. Your vision and requirements dictate how you'll spend your graphics resources on a game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this