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"All In One" game engines

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hi,

i'm new here and i already noticed the sticky topic and the fact that lots of people are searching for game engines. but i'm getting lost googling and going through all the topics so i decided asking.
i'm new to game development but i'm familiar with programming with a bit of C, VB and some modding.
i wanna start building a 3D game and i'm looking for those "all in one" game engines because it seems to me like a comfortable way to start out with. in most cases with these engines, whole of the learning material is organized in the same one place so thats one of my considerations.
what i have in mind is an action/role playing game like fallout 3, fable 2/3, kotor, gothic and etc... (i know those games are state of the art, but that was for genre example only!).
so far i managed to fine some "all in one" engines, but i'm sure there are some more that i cant find, and also maybe you guys can recommend some from experience.

the engines i found so far:
XNA
torque
visual3d
C4

if you can, please post the ones you know and an opinion (if you have one). after i'll have the whole "list" i'll check em' out one by one and try to compare and decide.

Thank you!

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Shiva
Unity
Blender Game Engine (I'm not really familiar with its capabilities though)

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ok, so i spent some time checking out those engines on the engine database.
but i couldn't really figure our which engines are "All-In-One" type engines and which are not. in an "All-In-One" engine, all the resources for creating a game are included in the engine application. for example, there is no need for an external 3d modeling program like "3d max" or "maya", the is already a tool in the program.
one engine that i know for sure that is "All-In-One" is "torque", but before i start working with it, i would like to know what other engines like this are there.
so if you know of some, please post them.

thanks..

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It has been a while since I have taken a close look at what engines are available, but I doubt you will find many (if any) that include editors to create every type of asset.

A few will include editors to place and modify shapes, sounds, textures etc., but it's generally expected that these will be imported from a specialised program rather than created from scratch using built-in tools.

You can narrow down your search at DevMaster.Net by using the advanced options and selecting both boxes in the "Tools & Editors" section, but as with most sites of this type the information can be outdated.

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Original post by MidoBan
ok, so i spent some time checking out those engines on the engine database.
but i couldn't really figure our which engines are "All-In-One" type engines and which are not. in an "All-In-One" engine, all the resources for creating a game are included in the engine application. for example, there is no need for an external 3d modeling program like "3d max" or "maya", the is already a tool in the program.
one engine that i know for sure that is "All-In-One" is "torque", but before i start working with it, i would like to know what other engines like this are there.
so if you know of some, please post them.

thanks..


I don't think a game engine is necessary to integrate a modeling tool, if we treat a game engine as car engine, the modeling tool is just like the machine which is used to making the wheels of the car.

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Original post by g-force game engine
Quote:
Original post by MidoBan
ok, so i spent some time checking out those engines on the engine database.
but i couldn't really figure our which engines are "All-In-One" type engines and which are not. in an "All-In-One" engine, all the resources for creating a game are included in the engine application. for example, there is no need for an external 3d modeling program like "3d max" or "maya", the is already a tool in the program.
one engine that i know for sure that is "All-In-One" is "torque", but before i start working with it, i would like to know what other engines like this are there.
so if you know of some, please post them.

thanks..


I don't think a game engine is necessary to integrate a modeling tool, if we treat a game engine as car engine, the modeling tool is just like the machine which is used to making the wheels of the car.


well, i think you're right.. but i'm really a beginner. and instead of learning a bunch of programs, i think it'll be much easier if all the tools will be integrated together in one program. i only want this as a first experience to game development learning..

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Quote:
Original post by MidoBan
Quote:
Original post by g-force game engine
Quote:
Original post by MidoBan
ok, so i spent some time checking out those engines on the engine database.
but i couldn't really figure our which engines are "All-In-One" type engines and which are not. in an "All-In-One" engine, all the resources for creating a game are included in the engine application. for example, there is no need for an external 3d modeling program like "3d max" or "maya", the is already a tool in the program.
one engine that i know for sure that is "All-In-One" is "torque", but before i start working with it, i would like to know what other engines like this are there.
so if you know of some, please post them.

thanks..


I don't think a game engine is necessary to integrate a modeling tool, if we treat a game engine as car engine, the modeling tool is just like the machine which is used to making the wheels of the car.


well, i think you're right.. but i'm really a beginner. and instead of learning a bunch of programs, i think it'll be much easier if all the tools will be integrated together in one program. i only want this as a first experience to game development learning..



if you are a beginner, try to make an easy and small game all by yourself is a good choice.

if a game engine integrates too many things or functions, the result of which are too complicated, hard to learn and hard to use.

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I don't know of any game engine that is an 'all in one' game engine, and incorporates tools for developing all the necessary assets (models, sounds, 2-d art, etc., etc.). And, although I obviously can't say for sure, I'd be willing to bet there is no such engine. (I haven't used Torque, but I highly doubt that it's actually an 'all in one' engine as you describe.)

Sometimes engines will come with tool suites for developing assets such as levels and so on, but I can't really imagine why an engine would incorporate, say, a full-fledged modeling tool, since there are already many of those available.

Again, I could be wrong, but I suspect that you may have to adjust your expectations a bit, as I doubt you're going to find anything like what you describe.

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Original post by jyk
I don't know of any game engine that is an 'all in one' game engine, and incorporates tools for developing all the necessary assets (models, sounds, 2-d art, etc., etc.). And, although I obviously can't say for sure, I'd be willing to bet there is no such engine. (I haven't used Torque, but I highly doubt that it's actually an 'all in one' engine as you describe.)

Sometimes engines will come with tool suites for developing assets such as levels and so on, but I can't really imagine why an engine would incorporate, say, a full-fledged modeling tool, since there are already many of those available.

Again, I could be wrong, but I suspect that you may have to adjust your expectations a bit, as I doubt you're going to find anything like what you describe.


isn't Torque a kind of "standalone" game development suit?

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I don't think Toque comes with modelling software or texture software, and reeeally doubt if it did it would be anywhere near the level of 3D Studio or Photoshop...or even Blender or GIMP.

As for sound, you'll pretty much never find one that incorporates a sufficient sound mixing studio. I always get the feeling programmers try and do whatever they need for sound and run away screaming to drown themselves in various alcoholic substances and forget the experience ^^

I doubt you'll find a 100% all-in-one, especially a free one.

Probably has something to do with if you tell an artist "Here, and you have to use this program which will either lack the features you want, or simply have cleverly concealed them by placing them in the last place you'll expect to look" they will probably lynch you.

As for other engines, well I know the Irricht Engine also has an "irrEdit" tool for 3D world editing and lightmap generation.

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isn't Torque a kind of "standalone" game development suit?
I just took a quick look at the Torque 3D website, and saw no mention of integrated general-purpose tools for modeling, pixel art, sound editing, or anything of that sort. So unless it's there and I missed it, no, it doesn't meet your definition of 'all in one game engine'.

[Edited by - jyk on July 17, 2010 2:20:08 PM]

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ok.. thank you, i guess i didn't have a good understanding on how those stuff work. i just looked at the game engines in a straightforward way: "application to make games".
i see its not that simple.
so if we got this far already, my "checklist" should be:

- 3d modeling program (does world, character, and objects design are usually in the same program?)

- photoshop (for stuff like textures design?)

- audio program

- game engine program

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Torque and similar Software Development Kits (SDK's) include tools to edit existing 3D models, but not to create them.

Gamestudio/A7 includes tools for creating static landscapes and buildings, but you would still need an external program to create your own animated models.

This is actually a good thing, as you would only need to learn how to use one of the more popular 3D modelling programs, rather than a different one for each engine.

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so if we got this far already, my "checklist" should be:

- 3d modeling program (does world, character, and objects design are usually in the same program?)

- photoshop (for stuff like textures design?)

- audio program

- game engine program
Yeah, that's a bit more realistic.

You might not necessarily need *all* of those tools (for example, if all of your sounds are taken from existing sound libraries, you may not need to use any sort of audio program), but you'll most likely need to use at least some external programs for the purpose of content creation.

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Original post by MidoBan
the engines i found so far:
XNA
torque
visual3d
C4


XNA Game Studio is not an engine. It's a small framework that allows you to target Windows, Xbox360, Zune(deprecated), and Windows Phone 7. It's a great framework, but you will have to know C#, graphics programming techniques, and enough programming techniques to put together the structure of the game software.

Torque, and anything made by their company is broken, undocumented junk sold to suckers who don't know any better. People have been complaining about the same issues for a decade now, and they never fix or improve anything, they just release a new version of the product to sucker in more buyers.

Unity3D is more of a fully featured engine. It's easy to use, has great tutorials, and has widespread use. You can import your art assets and then script their custom behavior.

The difference between Unity and XNA is that:

XNA gives you the tools to access the graphics, sound, and input capabilities, and leaves you there. The basic template project sets up a blank window with some basic functionality thrown in, but from there, you are on your own. This is a good thing for those who know what to do with that. You are free to invent anything you need, and to make it function any way you want.

Unity is a program that already exist. when you start a new Unity project, you have a copy of the Unity.exe and you just supply it with content, and scripts to direct it. It's main datatype is a SCENE. You create scene objects in the editor, then populate them with content. The Unity Engine already knows how to load up and render scenes, and then just runs the scripts you provide it to direct the action.

That's the difference between a game and an engine. Both are great ways to make a game, but there is a slight difference. The framework will require you to do all the groundwork to invent the basic concepts of your program and how they function. And engine will already have that in place, and you just have to add in your content and modify it to suit your game.

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Original post by Daaark
Quote:
Original post by MidoBan
the engines i found so far:
XNA
torque
visual3d
C4


XNA Game Studio is not an engine. It's a small framework that allows you to target Windows, Xbox360, Zune(deprecated), and Windows Phone 7. It's a great framework, but you will have to know C#, graphics programming techniques, and enough programming techniques to put together the structure of the game software.

Torque, and anything made by their company is broken, undocumented junk sold to suckers who don't know any better. People have been complaining about the same issues for a decade now, and they never fix or improve anything, they just release a new version of the product to sucker in more buyers.

Unity3D is more of a fully featured engine. It's easy to use, has great tutorials, and has widespread use. You can import your art assets and then script their custom behavior.

The difference between Unity and XNA is that:

XNA gives you the tools to access the graphics, sound, and input capabilities, and leaves you there. The basic template project sets up a blank window with some basic functionality thrown in, but from there, you are on your own. This is a good thing for those who know what to do with that. You are free to invent anything you need, and to make it function any way you want.

Unity is a program that already exist. when you start a new Unity project, you have a copy of the Unity.exe and you just supply it with content, and scripts to direct it. It's main datatype is a SCENE. You create scene objects in the editor, then populate them with content. The Unity Engine already knows how to load up and render scenes, and then just runs the scripts you provide it to direct the action.

That's the difference between a game and an engine. Both are great ways to make a game, but there is a slight difference. The framework will require you to do all the groundwork to invent the basic concepts of your program and how they function. And engine will already have that in place, and you just have to add in your content and modify it to suit your game.


Great explanation! thank you..
It really helps me understand what i wanna start with and how to decide.
As a matter a fact i already started to mess around with unity, looks like a decent program.

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