• Announcements

    • khawk

      Download the Game Design and Indie Game Marketing Freebook   07/19/17

      GameDev.net and CRC Press have teamed up to bring a free ebook of content curated from top titles published by CRC Press. The freebook, Practices of Game Design & Indie Game Marketing, includes chapters from The Art of Game Design: A Book of Lenses, A Practical Guide to Indie Game Marketing, and An Architectural Approach to Level Design. The GameDev.net FreeBook is relevant to game designers, developers, and those interested in learning more about the challenges in game development. We know game development can be a tough discipline and business, so we picked several chapters from CRC Press titles that we thought would be of interest to you, the GameDev.net audience, in your journey to design, develop, and market your next game. The free ebook is available through CRC Press by clicking here. The Curated Books The Art of Game Design: A Book of Lenses, Second Edition, by Jesse Schell Presents 100+ sets of questions, or different lenses, for viewing a game’s design, encompassing diverse fields such as psychology, architecture, music, film, software engineering, theme park design, mathematics, anthropology, and more. Written by one of the world's top game designers, this book describes the deepest and most fundamental principles of game design, demonstrating how tactics used in board, card, and athletic games also work in video games. It provides practical instruction on creating world-class games that will be played again and again. View it here. A Practical Guide to Indie Game Marketing, by Joel Dreskin Marketing is an essential but too frequently overlooked or minimized component of the release plan for indie games. A Practical Guide to Indie Game Marketing provides you with the tools needed to build visibility and sell your indie games. With special focus on those developers with small budgets and limited staff and resources, this book is packed with tangible recommendations and techniques that you can put to use immediately. As a seasoned professional of the indie game arena, author Joel Dreskin gives you insight into practical, real-world experiences of marketing numerous successful games and also provides stories of the failures. View it here. An Architectural Approach to Level Design This is one of the first books to integrate architectural and spatial design theory with the field of level design. The book presents architectural techniques and theories for level designers to use in their own work. It connects architecture and level design in different ways that address the practical elements of how designers construct space and the experiential elements of how and why humans interact with this space. Throughout the text, readers learn skills for spatial layout, evoking emotion through gamespaces, and creating better levels through architectural theory. View it here. Learn more and download the ebook by clicking here. Did you know? GameDev.net and CRC Press also recently teamed up to bring GDNet+ Members up to a 20% discount on all CRC Press books. Learn more about this and other benefits here.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Alpha_ProgDes

New Tech for the win!

45 posts in this topic

[url="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110227/ap_on_bi_ge/us_growing_fuel"]Greenery makes diesel fuel[/url]

[url="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/8296338/Invisibility-cloak-enters-the-real-world.html"]Rocks can make you invisible[/url]

[url="http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2011-02/21/worlds-largest-antimatter-container"]Look, ma! I can contain antimatter with no hands![/url]

Obviously these things may not make it on a large scale. But that it can even be done on a small scale is impressive. The future for Star Trek looks bright indeed.... in another 100 years.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Interesting reads :)

There are conspiracy theories that renewable energy is not further developed than it is because there are powerful vested interests in the current fossil fuel business, and therefore against renewable energies. I wonder if the "greenery to diesel" tech would suffer from something similar?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Oh, what a great idea. Fields that naturally give off toxic, and flammable, fluids,...

I can see someone really thought that one through before starting work. Just think of how fun it will be if they spill and get into the wild.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='forsandifs' timestamp='1298851873' post='4779899']
There are conspiracy theories that renewable energy is not further developed than it is because there are powerful vested interests in the current fossil fuel business, and therefore against renewable energies.[/quote]That's not a conspiracy theory, it's common knowledge -- e.g. lots of alternative energy inventions are patent-horded by those "powerful vested interests"...
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1298857341' post='4779924']
Oh, what a great idea. Fields that naturally give off toxic, and flammable, fluids,...

I can see someone really thought that one through before starting work. Just think of how fun it will be if they spill and get into the wild.
[/quote]

How is this any more risky than a well that could throw burning liquid from underground everywhere?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1298857341' post='4779924']
Oh, what a great idea. Fields that naturally give off toxic, and flammable, fluids,...

I can see someone really thought that one through before starting work. Just think of how fun it will be if they spill and get into the wild.
[/quote]

Actually, when you put it that way... good point :P Not just because of the risk of burning. Its also a question of ethics and upsetting of the natural balance I think. Normally one associates greenery with healthy environment. If these things got out into the wild and spread far and wide, thus invalidating that association, that would be quite disturbing.

[quote name='Hodgman' timestamp='1298858302' post='4779925']That's not a conspiracy theory, it's common knowledge -- e.g. lots of alternative energy inventions are patent-horded by those "powerful vested interests"...
[/quote]

Didn't realise it is provable. But now you mention it I suppose its not too difficult.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='szecs' timestamp='1298893568' post='4780040']
One full tank (car tank thingy) of biodiesel = 1 year of food for a human. (seen on TV)
[/quote]

Is this the famous "Food for Oil" program?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='szecs' timestamp='1298893568' post='4780040']
One full tank (car tank thingy) of biodiesel = 1 year of food for a human. (seen on TV)
[/quote]

that depends a lot on what it's being made out of, whether it's already being used for something else, and where it's being grown.

It doesn't appear to need farm land, which is also the case for algal deisel, but it's also 4 times as efficient in its estimation. 15,000 barrels of diesel fuel, with no need to be further refined mind you, per year per acre is pretty huge. An acre isn't that enormous. It could be easily housed on top of medium sized buildings.

I also doubt they would create the organism to survive outside a very specific set of circumstances, so I don't think it will be ravaging our forests turning them all into gasoline.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='owl' timestamp='1298898494' post='4780062']
[quote name='szecs' timestamp='1298893568' post='4780040']
One full tank (car tank thingy) of biodiesel = 1 year of food for a human. (seen on TV)
[/quote]

Is this the famous "Food for Oil" program?
[/quote]

It's the famous um.... food... hunger whatever program on the famous um... Discovery or Nat Geo Channel. Or something like that on one of those....
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I was hoping to see a video of the paper clip disappear. Or at least time lapse if it's a slow process. I want to see how invisible it really is.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='way2lazy2care' timestamp='1298861508' post='4779946']
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1298857341' post='4779924']
Oh, what a great idea. Fields that naturally give off toxic, and flammable, fluids,...

I can see someone really thought that one through before starting work. Just think of how fun it will be if they spill and get into the wild.
[/quote]

How is this any more risky than a well that could throw burning liquid from underground everywhere?
[/quote]

Small bits of oil that get missed during a clean up don't spread across ecosystems and reproduce, and they don't transmute into new, potentially more hazardous lifeforms.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1299005752' post='4780624']
Small bits of oil that get missed during a clean up don't spread across ecosystems and reproduce, and they don't transmute into new, potentially more hazardous lifeforms.
[/quote]
You are assuming that its capable of living in non-controlled natural habitats though.

How many of the planets ecosystems can support a lifeform that requires 80 degree nutrient rich non-saline water and full sunlight?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='way2lazy2care' timestamp='1299007567' post='4780636']
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1299005752' post='4780624']
Small bits of oil that get missed during a clean up don't spread across ecosystems and reproduce, and they don't transmute into new, potentially more hazardous lifeforms.
[/quote]
You are assuming that its capable of living in non-controlled natural habitats though.

How many of the planets ecosystems can support a lifeform that requires 80 degree nutrient rich non-saline water and full sunlight?
[/quote]

I don't know. But how many ecosystems can support such a lifeform after it has been exposed to the ecosystem in question, and does what all life does best, and adapts to it?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well, energy-reed (or whatever its name is) is one of the toughest and most aggressive plants.
It's like playing with The Giant Hogweed (end of teh wordl as we no it)...
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1299005752' post='4780624']
Small bits of oil that get missed during a clean up don't spread across ecosystems and reproduce, and they don't transmute into new, potentially more hazardous lifeforms.
[/quote]

If you're worried about those modified bacteria spreading, you seriously have bigger fish to fry. Using genetically modified bacteria to produce specific molecules is a completely normal part of modern pharmaceutical production. I don't see why those diesel-producing bacteria should be any more or less dangerous than this other technology which has already been in widespread use for a very long time.

Note that of course it's reasonable to worry about unwanted spread of such things - but to reject the development outright because of it is just as stupid as being totally careless about it.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote]Using genetically modified bacteria to produce specific molecules is a completely normal part of modern pharmaceutical production.[/quote]
Sure, but that's in a factory, whereas I assume wide-scale production of this stuff would occur in much less controlled environments.

There are also several problems with bioethanol as fuel for (older) gasoline motors:
1) about 10% of current models can sustain serious damage after a single tankful (corroding aluminum, dissolving gaskets)
2) it only has 2/3 the energy density of gasoline => 1..1.9% less mileage, worse acceleration, higher engine RPMs and increased wear
3) There don't seem to be any long-term studies of the effects on current cars - they're less vulnerable to the corrosion and gasket issues, but who knows what else. The differences in additives and volatilization might also be relevant, but I'm definitely out of my depth here. Anyway, it seems foolish to lean on the bioethanol crutch (with unknown side effects) rather than focusing on true alternatives to fossil fuels.

Sources:
[url="http://www.focus.de/auto/news/oeko-kraftstoff-e10-deutlicher-mehrverbrauch_aid_601141.html"]http://www.focus.de/...aid_601141.html[/url]
[url="http://www.oldtimer-tv.com/oldtimer/DE/news/index.php?Seite=111"]http://www.oldtimer-...x.php?Seite=111[/url]
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Jan Wassenberg' timestamp='1299335346' post='4782057']
[quote]Using genetically modified bacteria to produce specific molecules is a completely normal part of modern pharmaceutical production.[/quote]
Sure, but that's in a factory, whereas I assume wide-scale production of this stuff would occur in much less controlled environments.

There are also several problems with bioethanol as fuel for (older) gasoline motors:
1) about 10% of current models can sustain serious damage after a single tankful (corroding aluminum, dissolving gaskets)
2) it only has 2/3 the energy density of gasoline => 1..1.9% less mileage, worse acceleration, higher engine RPMs and increased wear
3) There don't seem to be any long-term studies of the effects on current cars - they're less vulnerable to the corrosion and gasket issues, but who knows what else. The differences in additives and volatilization might also be relevant, but I'm definitely out of my depth here. Anyway, it seems foolish to lean on the bioethanol crutch (with unknown side effects) rather than focusing on true alternatives to fossil fuels.

Sources:
[url="http://www.focus.de/auto/news/oeko-kraftstoff-e10-deutlicher-mehrverbrauch_aid_601141.html"]http://www.focus.de/...aid_601141.html[/url]
[url="http://www.oldtimer-tv.com/oldtimer/DE/news/index.php?Seite=111"]http://www.oldtimer-...x.php?Seite=111[/url]
[/quote]

Well you know that we already grow genetically alltered plants all over the world producing our food? I really think people have to step away from the view keep everything as it is. You know maybe we could change the place into something better someday. Of course polluting the atmosphere is not helping there^^
Anyway the problem you described there with bioethanol is probably not a problem with this way of producing it. normally bio ethanol is created by destroying plants and using the biomass to produce the alcohol. But here the ethanol is produced directly inside the plant during photosynthesis so its actually a clean product and they can make just like the real stuff. Its like putting together the molecules by hand^^yeah not really...

Btw: alternative to fossil fuels...this could actually work pretty good. imagine a powerplant burning this fuel to create energy and the CO2 is directly used again by the bakteria to produce new fuel......only energy source needed would be the sun.of course i dunno how much energy they can actually convert and if this power plant would be more efficent as a solarpower plant. But if it would work and even if it produced less energy then the solorpanels it would definetly be cheaper i guess.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Jan Wassenberg' timestamp='1299335346' post='4782057']
[quote]Using genetically modified bacteria to produce specific molecules is a completely normal part of modern pharmaceutical production.[/quote]
Sure, but that's in a factory, whereas I assume wide-scale production of this stuff would occur in much less controlled environments.

There are also several problems with bioethanol as fuel for (older) gasoline motors:
1) about 10% of current models can sustain serious damage after a single tankful (corroding aluminum, dissolving gaskets)
2) it only has 2/3 the energy density of gasoline => 1..1.9% less mileage, worse acceleration, higher engine RPMs and increased wear
3) There don't seem to be any long-term studies of the effects on current cars - they're less vulnerable to the corrosion and gasket issues, but who knows what else. The differences in additives and volatilization might also be relevant, but I'm definitely out of my depth here. Anyway, it seems foolish to lean on the bioethanol crutch (with unknown side effects) rather than focusing on true alternatives to fossil fuels.

Sources:
[url="http://www.focus.de/auto/news/oeko-kraftstoff-e10-deutlicher-mehrverbrauch_aid_601141.html"]http://www.focus.de/...aid_601141.html[/url]
[url="http://www.oldtimer-tv.com/oldtimer/DE/news/index.php?Seite=111"]http://www.oldtimer-...x.php?Seite=111[/url]
[/quote]
The organism they created can create ethanol OR diesel fuel. It is not just ethanol. That's part of the reason it's such a significant discovery.

Link in the OP.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote]Well you know that we already grow genetically alltered plants all over the world producing our food?[/quote]
You say that as if it might be surprising (large majorities of consumers in Europe are aware of and opposed to GM food, at least until the consequences are better understood) or a good thing.
Let's see what the National Research Council's "Committee on Identifying and Assessing Unintended Effects of Genetically Engineered Foods on Human Health" ([url="http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=10977"]http://www.nap.edu/c...record_id=10977[/url]) has to say about this:
[quote]All evidence evaluated to date indicates that unexpected and unintended compositional changes arise with all forms of genetic modification, including genetic engineering.

There is a need, in the committee’s judgment, for a broad research and technology development agenda to improve methods for predicting, identifying, and assessing unintended health effects from the genetic modification of food.[/quote]
So which unintended and unforeseen consequences have arisen in the intervening years?
[url="http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=12432"]http://www.globalres...xt=va&aid=12432[/url]
Oops, looks like it can negatively impact soil microbes and quality.

Another retrospective from the Board on Agriculture and Natural Resources ([url="http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=12804"]http://www.nap.edu/c...record_id=12804[/url]) says:

[quote]The first generation of genetically engineered (GE) crops has mostly delivered effective pest control for a few major crops because farmers producing these crops spend a lot of time and money on the task, because the firms developing the new seed technologies saw considerable profit potential in doing so, and because adding the traits was relatively straightforward [..]. The first generation of GE crops continues a reliance on pesticide technology—in-plant toxins or resistance to herbicides—to mitigate pest problems primarily in corn, cotton, and soybean. Thus, the application of genetic-engineering technology to crops has not developed novel means of pest control, such as developing plant mechanisms to resist pest damage[/quote]
So our savior that will supposedly secure the future of agriculture and feed mankind is a new pesticide ("Roundup" := glyphosate) that can be used because plants have been engineered to resist its effects.

[quote]However, glyphosate is often applied in higher doses and with greater frequency than the herbicides it replaced. [..]
Ten species have evolved resistance to glyphosate independently in glyphosate-resistant crops over 14 years in the United States (from 1996 to 2010) (Heap, 2010). [..] the nearly exclusive reliance on glyphosate for weed control, a practice accelerated by the widespread introduction of glyphosate-resistant crop varieties, has caused substantial changes in weed communities.[/quote]
What a big surprise, the quick and easy chemical solution works for a short time and then loses its effectiveness. When will people learn that there is no silver bullet?!

[quote]Among the known social facts associated with the dissemination of GE crops are the continued consolidation of the seed industry and its integration with the chemical industry. Another is the change in relationships between farmers and their seed suppliers. Testimony to the committee suggested that farmers of major crops have fewer opportunities to purchase non-GE seed of the best-yielding cultivars even when a GE trait is not perceived to be required in a particular cropping situation.[/quote]
And there we have one of the apparent driving forces behind GM - corporate greed.
I would be a lot more confident in the technology if it were at least extensively tested before commercialization, which probably necessitates the public sector. Fortunately, China is starting to invest heavily there, so maybe we will see improvements actually aimed at feeding people instead of profits.

[quote] I really think people have to step away from the view keep everything as it is.[/quote]
Straw man argument.

[quote]But here the ethanol is produced directly inside the plant during photosynthesis so its actually a clean product and they can make just like the real stuff.[/quote]
The problems listed in my previous post apply to pure ethanol, regardless of its source.
I'm not sure whether this bioethanol counts as such, since the article mentions problems separating it from water.

[quote]The organism they created can create ethanol OR diesel fuel. It is not just ethanol. That's part of the reason it's such a significant discovery.[/quote]
Yep, I saw that in the article, but it also mentions "Jaguars and jet engines". Granted, there are apparently Diesel-fueled Jaguars, but jet engine is still a stretch despite the existence of multi-fuel tank turbines.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Jan Wassenberg' timestamp='1299420589' post='4782409']
[quote]The organism they created can create ethanol OR diesel fuel. It is not just ethanol. That's part of the reason it's such a significant discovery.[/quote]
Yep, I saw that in the article, but it also mentions "Jaguars and jet engines". Granted, there are apparently Diesel-fueled Jaguars, but jet engine is still a stretch despite the existence of multi-fuel tank turbines.
[/quote]
That's the point. It can create ethanol or any number of hydro-carbon based fuels. Why is a jet engine a stretch? Jet fuel is pretty much really high quality diesel fuel with additives. If you can already make diesel it makes sense that that could be made into jet fuel.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote]Why is a jet engine a stretch? Jet fuel is pretty much really high quality diesel fuel with additives.[/quote]
The operative words are "high quality". Unlike multi-fuel tank engines, which will run on nearly anything, aircraft fuel systems are much more finicky. For example, Wikipedia tells me there must not be more than 30 parts per million water in jet fuel, which seems quite low. It remains to be seen whether this process can deliver that, especially since they're already having trouble separating fuel from water at all.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Jan Wassenberg' timestamp='1299436662' post='4782498']
[quote]Why is a jet engine a stretch? Jet fuel is pretty much really high quality diesel fuel with additives.[/quote]
The operative words are "high quality". Unlike multi-fuel tank engines, which will run on nearly anything, aircraft fuel systems are much more finicky. For example, Wikipedia tells me there must not be more than 30 parts per million water in jet fuel, which seems quite low. It remains to be seen whether this process can deliver that, especially since they're already having trouble separating fuel from water at all.
[/quote]

If they can make diesel fuel cheaply, they can refine it the same way they refine diesel fuel today. It is not a different product. It is the same product made a different way.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Prefect' timestamp='1299052731' post='4780895']
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1299005752' post='4780624']
Small bits of oil that get missed during a clean up don't spread across ecosystems and reproduce, and they don't transmute into new, potentially more hazardous lifeforms.
[/quote]

If you're worried about those modified bacteria spreading, you seriously have bigger fish to fry. Using genetically modified bacteria to produce specific molecules is a completely normal part of modern pharmaceutical production. I don't see why those diesel-producing bacteria should be any more or less dangerous than this other technology which has already been in widespread use for a very long time.

Note that of course it's reasonable to worry about unwanted spread of such things - but to reject the development outright because of it is just as stupid as being totally careless about it.
[/quote]

The difference is that of scale. Pharmaceutical applications are generally carried out in highly controlled manners, in contained zones. They are (suppose) to have protocols in place to deal with accidental leaks and the like.

The application we are talking about here is one of massive [i]fields[/i] of the stuff to get suitable energy collection. This means that not only is there far greater chances of containment breach, but there is also less ability to put backup safeties in place.

I also question whether this is actually any better than direct solar collection in total energy efficiency, and environmental protection. (That is to say, if the same amount of energy used to build and maintain the fields could instead be used to produce enough hydrogen for fuel cells to provide energy equal to or greater than the diesel produced, then it is likely better to go the fuel cell route.)
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1299450316' post='4782575']
[quote name='Prefect' timestamp='1299052731' post='4780895']
[quote name='Luckless' timestamp='1299005752' post='4780624']
Small bits of oil that get missed during a clean up don't spread across ecosystems and reproduce, and they don't transmute into new, potentially more hazardous lifeforms.
[/quote]

If you're worried about those modified bacteria spreading, you seriously have bigger fish to fry. Using genetically modified bacteria to produce specific molecules is a completely normal part of modern pharmaceutical production. I don't see why those diesel-producing bacteria should be any more or less dangerous than this other technology which has already been in widespread use for a very long time.

Note that of course it's reasonable to worry about unwanted spread of such things - but to reject the development outright because of it is just as stupid as being totally careless about it.
[/quote]

The difference is that of scale. Pharmaceutical applications are generally carried out in highly controlled manners, in contained zones. They are (suppose) to have protocols in place to deal with accidental leaks and the like.

The application we are talking about here is one of massive [i]fields[/i] of the stuff to get suitable energy collection. This means that not only is there far greater chances of containment breach, but there is also less ability to put backup safeties in place.

I also question whether this is actually any better than direct solar collection in total energy efficiency, and environmental protection. (That is to say, if the same amount of energy used to build and maintain the fields could instead be used to produce enough hydrogen for fuel cells to provide energy equal to or greater than the diesel produced, then it is likely better to go the fuel cell route.)
[/quote]

any day now corn could mutate into flesh eating plants. We should stop growing corn for this reason.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0