It's very simple. The middle east is the modern day Colosseum, USA are the Roman lanistas, Israel are the gladiators and the Arabs are the filthy criminals who are supposed to die.

I do think it is a double stranded for the most part. Although I really didn't buy Iran's story when they said the wanted Nuclear power for "peaceful Proposes".

I'd like to point out though that Jordan and Israel do not get along and historically have not been peaceful with one another. Jordan was one of Israels enemies in the Six Day war. Israel has a right to be paranoid, but in this case Jordan deserves to have Nuclear power I think.

There are double standards, have been since the creation of Israel. Now it's getting harder for Israel to label everyone who opposes them as terrorists it will be interesting to see what happens. The double standards are in the news reports. What about Sabra and Chatilla? It's not talked about much. What about all the UN resolutions Israel has broken, what about the illegal settlements?
Nuclear weapons aren't for peaceful purposes, they are for killing many many people, and as a result they become a political bargaining chip that can create a favourable peace for the side with those weapons. Now it's perhaps time the region wasn't so polarised by Israel and the US, the region may be able to move forward to better pastures.
But Israel will find it difficult not being the one dictating how this happens. There against the Palestinians being a soverign nation, and perhaps need brutal dictatorships in order to carry on with there own brutal policies, interesting times ahead.

There are double standards, have been since the creation of Israel. Now it's getting harder for Israel to label everyone who opposes them as terrorists it will be interesting to see what happens. The double standards are in the news reports. What about Sabra and Chatilla? It's not talked about much. What about all the UN resolutions Israel has broken, what about the illegal settlements?
Nuclear weapons aren't for peaceful purposes, they are for killing many many people, and as a result they become a political bargaining chip that can create a favourable peace for the side with those weapons. Now it's perhaps time the region wasn't so polarised by Israel and the US, the region may be able to move forward to better pastures.
But Israel will find it difficult not being the one dictating how this happens. There against the Palestinians being a soverign nation, and perhaps need brutal dictatorships in order to carry on with there own brutal policies, interesting times ahead.

I going to have to say a little about this. Israel's policies aren't brutal, there just over reactive, they certainly aren't dictators. With what has happened to them it's understandable why they have gotten to the point where they are now. They do not oppose the creation of a sovereign Palestinian nation, because of racism, religious hatred etc. They are opposed to it because they are already a small country, and their afraid of Palestine slowly chipping away their territory, as they already have done. Also if Palestine becomes sovereign they will be able to have there own standing army and such. I can only imagine how much fighting would result if that happened.

Israel and Palestine really should just morph into one nation. That would be the most peaceful solution in the long run. Of course the chances of that happening are slim to none.

[quote name='Discount_Flunky' timestamp='1317299305' post='4867166']...

Oh man, I actually laughed out loud half way through that!
I'm not "taking sides" with the Palestinians here, but... who has been teaching you history?

--With what has happened to them it's understandable why they have gotten to the point where they are now--
By the same token, I assume this also applies to the Palestinians? Including the ones who were forced from their homes during the creation of Israel within their land? Both sides have been through hell at each other's hands, but it's pretty hard to argue that the Palestinian side hasn't been worse off.

--They do not oppose the creation of a sovereign Palestinian nation--
Except that they're taking every effort to stop the Palestinians from seeking recognition as a sovereign nation...

--They are opposed to it because they are already a small country, and their afraid of Palestine slowly chipping away their territory, as they already have done.--
That's where I LOLed.
Here's the original lines of the part of Palestine that Israel was created within: http://en.wikipedia....estine_1947.png
Here's the current lines: http://upload.wikime...tlements%29.png
N.B. that the majority of the green area is occupied by Israeli forces, with the Palestinian residents living under martial law and apartheid. It's being chipped away at constantly by new settlements.

--Israel and Palestine really should just morph into one nation--
You know that's where the conflict started from right? The zionists wanted their own state just for Jews, and a civil war broke out, which has never really ended.
[/quote]

You really didn't address half of what I said in fact you miss quoted me a few times. He called Israel a brutal dictatorship. 1. This a lie. 2. It means he is on the side of the Palestinians, a neutral person would not have said that.

When I said "With what has happened to them it's understandable why they have gotten to the point where they are now" I was referring to their entire history. The Jews are the most hated people who have ever existed. It's easier to make a list of the nations who haven't tried to wipe them off the face of the earth. They didn't just appear out of some Tarsus gate somewhere and start slaughtering hundreds of "innocent" Palestinians. Fist they were persecuted all over Europe and then six million of them where killed in the Holocaust. After that happened (and this is the most important part) Britain felt sorry for them and forced the Palestinians out of their homes so that the Jews could have back their ancient ancestral home. It wasn't the Jews, it was the British. That's the part that everyone forgets.


I clearly did not deny that they are opposing Palestine becoming a sovereign nation as you miss quoted me saying.

Yes the Jews land did start small, but then Palestine and Israel fought a war. Guess what, Israel won, that's the way it is. It also doesn't matter how much they used to have. They only care about what they have now, and their land is the main reason they oppose Palestine's sovereignty.

Your last point doesn't even address what I said at all. You said them trying to join together caused it, then you said the Zionist caused it all in the same sentence. That's a compelelty redundant statement. Also how does them failing to come together then change the fact that it's a good Idea now?

When I said "With what has happened to them it's understandable why they have gotten to the point where they are now" I was referring to their entire history. The Jews are the most hated people who have ever existed. It's easier to make a list of the nations who haven't tried to wipe them off the face of the earth. They didn't just appear out of some Tarsus gate somewhere and start slaughtering hundreds of "innocent" Palestinians. Fist they were persecuted all over Europe and then six million of them where killed in the Holocaust. After that happened (and this is the most important part) Britain felt sorry for them and forced the Palestinians out of their homes so that the Jews could have back their ancient ancestral home. It wasn't the Jews, it was the British. That's the part that everyone forgets.

I clearly did not deny that they are opposing Palestine becoming a sovereign nation as you miss quoted me saying.

Yes the Jews land did start small, but then Palestine and Israel fought a war. Guess what, Israel won, that's the way it is. It also doesn't matter how much they used to have. They only care about what they have now, and their land is the main reason they oppose Palestine's sovereignty.

On the creation of the current middle east nations. A big problem with the middle east is because of the way many countries had their boundaries set post-wwII. They were split generally geographically rather than culturally, and a lot of middle east conflict stems from that.

Though there is a lot to be said for the fact that the palestinians repeatedly either start wars and lose or join wars on the eventual losing side resulting in their continued loss of land. I cannot really say Israel has been any more out of line than the Palestinians have been. Neither side is willing to bend, so one of them has to break eventually or they have to change their outlook, which won't happen. It's a shitstorm in which both sides are in the wrong and neither side is willing to admit it.