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Serapth

Flash is dead baby, it's dead.(*)

31 posts in this topic

Ah, the 'HTML5' crowd... it's like Applets all over again... 'surely this tech will be the answer to everything!'

"Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it..."
*chuckles*
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[quote name='return0' timestamp='1321139460' post='4883305']
Flash dying would be a terrible thing for thor whate web.
[/quote]
for what, flash games? lmao..
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The biggest games company in the world is a flash games shop, and youtube is powered by flash?
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It's a terrible thing because the Adobe Flash player is a reasonably powerful multi-platform virtual machine / execution environment, that is installed on 92% to 98% of PCs. That's a nice thing to have around.

There is more heterogeneity between platforms on which users are running software than ever before. In the old days you could just write your application to Windows and not worry about it i.e. those linux kids don't pay for software anyway so who cares about them. Those days are over. If you want to write an application that anyone is going to use, you have to think a lot about what platforms to target. Given that that is the truth, it's a strange thing that there's not really a "write once, run anywhere"-type platform that one can target and make a reasonable trade-off between what you can do (or can't do) on the platform and the size of user base of the platform.

Basically, "write once, run anywhere" is a god that failed. If someone was paying me money to write a mobile app tomorrow, I don't see any real options to writing two versions: I'd factor out the the common functionality into a separate module written in C++ and then buy the O'Reiley book on Objective-C and do a native app front end for iOS and a native app front end for android -- in *exactly* the same way that I would have handled the Windows and Macintosh dichotomy in 1994 if I was writing a desktop application and had to support Macs.

This is crazy. Especially given that everyone's been yapping about various virtual machine thingies for the past 15 years. Client-side Java never took off for whatever reason. C#/.Net is Win32 for people who don't like C++ -- not really cross platform. Flash, on the other hand, Flash *actually did* succeed; it took off in the way that client-side Java was supposed to. However, now Apple has killed it because it didn't want Adobe to have too much power in Apple universe, which was a callous and greedy move imho. So, you know, now the new thing is Html5 + Javascript, and we'll see how this one goes. Although doesn't it seem to anyone else like a step backwards?
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[quote name='jwezorek' timestamp='1321388060' post='4884284']
It's a terrible thing because the Adobe Flash player is a reasonably powerful multi-platform virtual machine / execution environment, that is installed on 92% to 98% of PCs. That's a nice thing to have around.[/quote]
And if that execution environment weren't cumbersome, buggy and riddled with security vulnerabilities, I'd agree. But it's not developers that want Flash to go away: it's the users.

Nor has Flash necessarily been a good user experience on all the platforms it supported. There have been a lot of complaints about Flash player on Linux and mobile phones.
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[quote name='Slavik81' timestamp='1321668108' post='4885493']
[quote name='jwezorek' timestamp='1321388060' post='4884284']
It's a terrible thing because the Adobe Flash player is a reasonably powerful multi-platform virtual machine / execution environment, that is installed on 92% to 98% of PCs. That's a nice thing to have around.[/quote]
And if that execution environment weren't cumbersome, buggy and riddled with security vulnerabilities, I'd agree. But it's not developers that want Flash to go away: it's the users.

Nor has Flash necessarily been a good user experience on all the platforms it supported. There have been a lot of complaints about Flash player on Linux and mobile phones.
[/quote]

I don't know much about Flash security vulnerabilities so can't really comment other than to say the standard thing, that malware writers target the Flash player because of its huge installed base so it's not surprising that lots of issues turn up. But in terms of it being cumbersome to develop in -- I mean, come on, what could be more cumbersome than writing a large application in Javascript? Also swf's are binary so someone could always write a compiler from a language that isn't AS3 to .swf. But javascript is [i]literally[/i] interpreted right? ... if it was to serve as the output of some compiler/IDE that output would have to be ascii -- to me that's just weird.
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[quote name='jwezorek' timestamp='1321730092' post='4885684']
But javascript is [i]literally[/i] interpreted right? ... if it was to serve as the output of some compiler/IDE that output would have to be ascii -- to me that's just weird.
[/quote]

Javascript is not interpreted (anymore), but it is compiled at runtime, so the backend of any compiler (take haXe JS backend for instance) is ascii yes.
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