I hung out in the Game Design section a lot over the last 4 months, and I noticed most of the time good suggestions or advice are given, but newcomers see it as "trolling tear-down". A lot of newcomers come to these forums with very strong beliefs, and are actually looking for people to agree with their beliefs.

E.g. zero programming skills, never made a game before but want to make the next Grand Theft Auto or Starcraft after writing a 200 page game design document and selling it to tripe A companies.

E.g. have some programming skills, but want to spend years "studying" game design or learning to write technical software from scratch, which would allow them to make their very first game a blockbuster.

If anyone suggests that their plan might not be feasible, the newcomer gets awfully defensive and start claiming that they're being trolled or that their "dream" is being attacked. Usually, the thread degenerates into a big argument as more outrageous claims and beliefs are stated by the newcomer.

Great post OP, I would not call myself inexperienced since I worked on a lot of game projects (School and personal), but I always consider myself a beginner no matter what because I'm constantly learning new things.

Here's a funny story. When I was in high school I was not exactly the greatest student (Mostly lazy). I remember taking an optional computer course in grade 10 which exposed us to a bit of VB programming. The teacher unfortunately was not that interested in teaching the course and he never really was a people's person, regardless, I barely passed the course. 2 years later I tried to take the second part of this course which apparently was a bit more advanced, but this time around I had the motivation and seeing how I had the pre-req, I was eligible. The first day of classes I walked in, the same teacher came up to me and asked me to leave his class because I was "not good enough" and I will "never do anything in the computer industry", he went on to say that he refuses to teach me even though it was his job and I had the eligibility. Whatever the case was I had to take a different course and that was that, but all I remember was that his words were heart breaking at the time that I actually wanted to stay away from programming in general.

Fast forward a few years after high school, working to save money, and what not, I eventually ended up going to college for Computer Science, how did that happen? Don't ask, but it was almost by luck (Initially what I had wanted was Computer Engineering). Today I'm happy to say that I work as a Software Developer for a living and have 5 years of experience under my belt in the industry, I have so much passion for what I do that I'm so thankful every day on how it worked out the way it did.

The morale of the story is, if you want it bad and you work your butt off, you will get there. It's not easy, but don't let anyone get in your way if you want it. Even if you think you're a slow learner or not good enough in subjects like math and what not, keep working hard and you'll get there.

I've lurked here for a long time, and have been a Senior Programmer/Systems analyst for 15 years. Occasionally I see a beginning game programmer, full of dreams and desires end up having those dreams crushed by those who would have them believe they are naive, too inexperienced, and stupid for not being able to see it. While I appreciate those who are trying to educate about the realities of the gaming industry, and encourage as they do it, I think it is taken too far by a select few. These few use their knowledge to appear superior to their peers, and really have little motive for "helping" beyond that. My message is not for them. (It wouldn't do any good if it was.)

I genuinely haven't seen any of this behaviour that you speak of. I've seen people being dealt a healthy dose of reality, sure, but it's always been in a patient and respectful way and I agree with levelling with beginners like that. It's best for the recipient in the long run to be made aware of when they are over reaching unrealistically as their time would be better spent mastering the precursor steps to such lofty goals. Patting people on the back and cheering hem on their way to a near-certain failure is irresponsible. Of course, the balance has to be met, but I certainly haven't seen any.many ego trips or bullying behaviour, and certainly not in such volumes as to be problematic.

[quote name='Black-Rook' timestamp='1345790441' post='4972904']
My post is voicing an opinion. "I don't believe anyone should belittle a new programmer", I never said anyone did this on the GameDev forums. Yes, I've seen this in the past many years ago, however since then, stricter rules and enforcement have been put into place.

Your opinion is fine. I guess I'm just trying to say what Serapth said... I don't get why this is a 4 page discussion on this site if it's not a problem. Hence, I feel like it's a "witch hunt" to kill a beast that doesn't exist here.
[/quote]

This problem does exist, maybe not on this forum but in life. I suppose it's a message for those who are trying and may run into such beasts. The message is not to give up if you really want to do it.

I guess I should give my motivations for posting this. I have not personally been the victim of this, but I know a 12 year old boy who received two private messages on this forum in response to his posting that drove him to tears, and it took me several weeks to get him to give GameDev another try. I do believe the messages were reported, and proper action taken, but the damage had already been done. In addition to that, I've seen it happen elsewhere as well. I think the message is needed here, which is why I posted it. And remember, my message wasn't to the people who are DOING this, it's to the people that are the victims. I'm not saying "stop being mean!". I'm saying "if it happens to you, don't let them discourage you. Do your study, learn your craft, and win.".

Hopefully that adds some clarification to both my motives and my audience. Again, thank you to all who are commenting. And to those who the post inspired, I'm glad. Once you get where you're going, be sure to come back and inspire someone else. =]

Lance...

I guess I should give my motivations for posting this. I have not personally been the victim of this, but I know a 12 year old boy who received two private messages on this forum in response to his posting that drove him to tears, and it took me several weeks to get him to give GameDev another try.

Don't you have to be at least 13 to join the forums? I seem to remember waiting until I was 13 before I signed up because I was under the impression that this was the case. Did that rule change?