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fligex

Experienced programmer, where do I start?

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I wouldn't start with an MMO. Unless it's a pretty simple 2D affair, the sheer amount of resources required make it out of reach for most. Pick a popular MMO and look at the list of people who made it. Then clone yourself that many times, send several of your clones off to school to become gifted artists(3D, character, background), designers, sound editors, musicians... I think you get the idea.

Having said that, I think a small team could write a fun MMO if they keep their goal within reach. I've never heard of a one man MMO being written, but I'm sure someone can point to one.

If you want to write your own game, including engine, I'd recommend starting with a good book. I liked this one. You end up with a basic 2D game engine suitable for writing simple games, and extending to less simple games. It's all in c#, so, if you're looking for C++ or Java, you should look elsewhere. Whatever you choose, it should leave you with something usable as a foundation for future games, and pointed firmly in the right direction to continue learning. Writing a game engine(even a 2D engine) is a non-trivial undertaking. Make sure this is what you want to do before you start.

If you just want to make a game, and don't want to bother writing an engine, then you should look in to Unity, or one of the other ready made game engines. You can then focus more on making a game, rather than making an engine, which has definite benefits. If this is your wish, pick an Engine, and grab a book or tutorial and get to work on your game. =D

Whichever method you choose, make sure you're having a blast. Good luck!

Lance...

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I assume the bad graphics is a result of using a generic game engine.

Bad graphics are often a result of small budgets. Art creation is one of the most expensive parts of a modern AAA game. So, your best engine will not help you much if you don't have a few million $ to spend on art creation.


I am completely a noob.

<=>

I really want to create an MMO
Edited by Ashaman73

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I'll give it a 4 for the effort, obvious troll is obvious.

Edit: just in case the OP is serious and not just taking us for a ride.

Graphic quality is almost entierly in the hands of the artists.

Great artists + Lots of time = great graphics. If you reduce either the artists skill or the time they're allowed to spend on a single piece the resulting quality will drop. (The amount of time required for AAA quality artwork is insane (which is why it is expensive in a professional eviroment, time=money and indies cut corners on it).

If you have 7+ years of programming experience you should be able to figure out that a MMO is both complicated and timeconsuming and isn't really suitable for a beginner.

Start simple, (Pong is awesome) and go from there, a game is no different from any other software so just use one of the languages you allready know. Edited by SimonForsman

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So my question is where to start? I really want to create an MMO, judging by some of the really shitty graphics I've seen in other games, I assume the bad graphics is a result of using a generic game engine. I would rather write my own game engine than to waste my time making a game with shit graphics. I want to be very clear about this fact, I want quality over quantity and speed.


Don't try to write an MMO. Start with less ambitious things. Even if you're the greatest programmer on earth an MMO is still out of your reach because of the HUGE amount of resources it takes. Not only art, sound fx, music, video, localized text, shaders, code and everything else, but financial, logistic and labor resources. You simply can't do it. Believe me... I'm a damn fine programmer... who tried and gave up when he realized he couldn't pull it off without a very big team.

However, you could start writing and testing an engine conducive to MMO development... make enough progress and finding a big team and the resources you need might not be so far out of reach. If you're interested in this sort of thing and you're a competent C# programmer with C/C++ experience then shoot me a pm. You might find my work interesting.

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Fligex,

If you want to achieve something, then go for it.

If you want to create an MMO, then go for it, only you will know if it is the correct path whilst travelling along it.

You said it yourself, that you are exhausted with the games you play, so, do you think the quality of the graphics will make a difference to your motivation? if you
want to create an MMO, have you ever considered a text based MMO? This will enable your imagination to run wild without the need to create graphics.

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Again this OP was not meant to make people angry, I could have just started hacking away trying to make a game engine but I thought I take a slightly smarter approach and see if I could get a bit of taste of the different ways to go about it, perhaps learn from others mistakes(in coding). I am actually very very surprised at such the negative responses I got from people, 3 out of 4 of you were more interested (seemingly) in discouraging me from doing this than supporting of my interest in something you all obviously are interested in. Are these forums not here to promote support of game developers? The only one who gave positive advice was Lance.


You didn't make anyone angry, my friend (at least not me). No one is trying to belittle you or say you're not good/smart enough. We only wanted you to heed our caution and realize the immense weight that any "MMO" carries. No one person on earth that I've yet met can do it alone...even if they're an amazing programmer and have no life, no girlfriend/boyfriend or any social interactions with other people lol. It's that massive of an undertaking... trust me...

I'm all for the idea of you writing an engine. If you re-read my first post in this thread, you will see that is exactly what I suggested you do! Perhaps you will end up making it good enough to someday use to develop a good game; perhaps even an MMO when you have the man-power and capital? I say stick with the engine idea if you're a competent programmer and have the time and willingness to work and learn. Perhaps we can even be of help to each other, as I am writing a very large engine myself...

I didn't see where anyone was getting angry at you in the least; just giving advice/guidance, which we assumed you wanted because you posted here! :-)

Heck, someone even down-voted me for absolutely no reason, so I suppose some people have gotten a bit too emotional about this indeed lol...

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Instead of "playing" the video games, try analyzing them. Look at them like a programmer, like you would any other program. Think about how every frame would be coded, for instance, say you're making asteroids. Think down to just one frame. You have the ship in the middle, the asteroids flying around, the score and lives at the top. There you go, you have a few objects already. Now unpause that, and you have animation. Well, all that is is just a continuous loop that has changes in every iteration, depending on what happens in the game. You also have the controller, so there's input to worry about. And, of course, the screen, so you have to draw to that. When you destroy an asteroid, they would split or be destroyed, and your score would go up. Destroy them all, and you get to the next level, or new frame/scene. When you die, your lives would be reduced by one, and when you run out of lives, the game loop ends. You can either restart it, or close it all together.

So basically, you just have to scrutinize every aspect of a game. Think about it like a programmer, not a gamer, and you should be all set. I'm sure there are plenty of books on the subject as well. Have fun!

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I am not put off by the amount of work that is involved in such a process.


So you know how much work it is? Like the first comment said, you will need to clone yourself multiple times. For every good quality mmo there was a very large team of individual artists working many many years on the project. And such a project is never finished, you need to bugfix, update, support people etc. If you want to pull off something decent alone it will take you more then a life time. And thats why people discourage you.

Also you state getting bored at games (sounds to me you want to make your own better game), yet later you state you might only do the engine. The engine is the most work, and the least satisfying if you pursue the goal of making a game since you mostly see code and no game being developed.

The shear size of you ambition is just too much, and most of us had that too in the past and try to warn you about such a thing. Why don't you just start smaller, you can always undertake a project like this. If you start running you wont start with a marathon right? If you are truly a good graphics and sound artist then you can build a nice port folio MUCH easier then most of us around. Make a nice graphical Arkanoid, a very good multiplayer Bomberman clone and some innovative side-scroller. Then write a huge game design document and you won't have trouble finding 20 talented people to work together on a project like that.

If you still want to work on a project like that, go for it. Not saying you will fail like all of us, there are exceptions on the rule like Einstein or Mozart. I hope one day i can mention your name between those and say you made the best MMO single handed without any game programming experience.

Good luck!

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