Hi,

Since I have a sick and twisted mind, I'm wondering how far can we go before having trouble with "not-nice-things" in games ?

some examples:

- Have an extremely racist main character ?

- Play a terrorist that try to drop a bomb in a public place ? (with score based on victims number)

- Play a kid doing a bloodbath in its school ?

- Show naked children ? (not in a sexual context)

- A torture&murder simulation game ? with rape ?

and if we overstep the line, is there any risk beyond interdiction to sell in some countries (which would be a nice advertising^^) ?

Edit: I'm from France, but I guess it's more or less the same in most of the Europe and north America countries ?

I think the better question would be: "How long before these issues become acceptable?"

I once heard that there was a Chinese emperor that would travel throughout him empire and listen to the music produce by the people in the various provinces. He thinking was (quite wisely) that the quality of the music showed the health of the province.

This is very true and applies today. The state and health of a people can be linked to their media (music, games, theater, movies, art, etc.). If you look at acceptable media in the U.S. over the past century, you can see a steady progression in what is defined as acceptable. Movies and games now are filled with gratuitous sex, violence and profanity. The increase seems to be growing exponentially. There was a time in my lifetime where horror movies, for example, were all low budget crap with B-list actors. Now they are high budget, mainstream films with A-list actors and make the studios tons of cash. There is a growing list of mainstream movies with unsimulated sex scenes with mainstream actors. These movies are not intended as porn. We here are all well aware of the growth of violent and perverse video games.

My thought is that the list you gave will happen, as society's tolerance grows as we allow ourselves to be desensitized to these issues. It *WILL* happen, the question simply becomes when.

Several of those games are already made...

1. Ethnic Clensing - racist

2. Massive Mayhem - suicide bomber game

3. Columbine Game - kids shooting at school

There probably is some game with naked kids and rape too. (torture and murder, well, that's quite a big chunk of games really...)

I guess the trouble you could get into is lots of media cover (not really that bad?), some outlets refusing to sell your game (you can always sell it yourself) and maybe some guys picketing in your front yard, and sending you nasty letters.

All in all, I'd say it is already easy enough to get in trouble if you don't actively try how far you can go.

Have an extremely racist main character?

You might get away with that if you have a very good explanation, but it's risky to say the least. Not advisable in any case.

When Samuel Clemens referred to Jim as a good guy although he is only a nigger, this raised a lot of controversy. And that was over a hundred years ago, at a time when people were not nearly as sensitive to that kind of thing as they are now, and Clemens had a "kind of believeable" explanation.

If you plan for open racism in the protagonist (not in the antagonist), best prepare for a lot of hate mail, and plan for interdiction and criminal prosecution.

Show naked children

A naked child (as, for example, on the beach) is a pretty normal thing in Europe (at least it used to be), but a serious affront (close to a capital crime) in the USA or some other places. I would still be careful because Europe is more and more going bigot, too.

kid doing a bloodbath in its school
torture & murder simulation game ? with rape ?
play a terrorist that try to drop a bomb

Almost guaranteed to get you on "The Index" in Germany, interdicted in the USA, plus death threat letters from both rape victims and soccermoms and religious people. Most likely to get 18+ ratings in all other places. And, it's almost impossible to talk yourself out of the situation afterwards.

Also note, that quite possibly the police might have a close eye on you after that. Because, hey, you're obviously a pervert, potentially dangerous, aggressive, and a terrorist who is planning to drop a bomb. And you're encouraging others to do it, too.

And hopefully nobody re-plays your school massacre in real life, or you might be held liable for giving them a detailled how-to and a virtual training ground.

I remember some imbecile called Microsoft Flight Simulator a terrorist tool back in 2001 (though I can't remember who did). Because allegedly, the alleged arabs who flew those airplanes into the buildings used MS Flight Simulator to train (since they died and burned to ashes in the crash and could not be questioned, I wonder how we can be so sure about all that, but... anyway).

Calling Flight Simulator a terrorist tool is of course total bollocks, but if you make a game about doing a massacre in a school, and someone really does this afterwards, it is a quite different situation, and it is very conceivable that you'll be held liable.

I'm from France

Well, as you know, even France isn't what it used to be. As the Conseil Général put it only two weeks ago, they agree with Charente-Maritime's vice-president that attractive young women wearing bikinis are "bad taste".

Luckily they've agreed to gay marriage, now that Marianne isn't allowed to show her breasts -- even wearing a bikini -- any more.

First off, wikileaks...

If what you do displeases somebody, you're exposing yourself to a hate campaign, and do mind the fact that though your game might show naked children (not in sexual positions), a slander campaign can really come a long way in the people's imaginations.

First, the "Naked Children (not in sexual positions)" will become "naked children"

Then, they'll staple your "sick and twisted mind" which you've said yourself, and put it next to "naked children"

Then, they'll say "sick and twisted mind" + "having trouble" + "not nice things" + "naked children" and may even tie it with terrorism.

I don't think the problem is as much what you show, as how it is interpreted by your public. A strong medium can really make short work of you, and once a hate campaign of this magnitude hits you, legal suspicions might arise, and your life may become inspected. At this stage, they may use whatever incriminating evidence they have, whether its related or not, to discredit, and potentially harm you.

Obviously, this will only happen if what you do is considered sufficiently bad by a sufficiently large and/or powerful community.

Thanks for the advices

@samoth I was more thinking about it in the torture game than on a bitch

you're exposing yourself to a hate campaign

That's exactly the point: get known, even if it don't sell much, people will have a eye on the next games "look, the guy who did the bloodbath game is making a pokemon like game "

I thing you are right about racism guys, it's less trouble to cut someone in pieces than tell him he is a monkey, but a torture game sound wonderful, I don't thing there is any law for gore and violent or there wouldn't be any game outside, it's just pushing things a little forward. If it's well done with a lot of soft bodies and fluid simulation and some search on the subject, it could even be defended as a serious game about anatomy, I guess...

Would you say "Punisher" has received a lot of attention because of its theme and scenes of torture?