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Disbelief over publisher behaviour!

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Well I am stunned. I consider myself a patient and reasonable guy. I have dealt with dozens of publishers over the years but a post on a publishers intranet site directed at me has just knocked me for six. Basically the publisher swears at me, criticises my behaviour, tells me I have broken the law by signing a deal with someone else, and then physically threatens me! If i made this up it would sound far fetched but its true! Weird huh? just goes to show you that the one thing I have learned from all this publisher nonsense is this: SHAREWARE RULES. I get my registration-service checks each month without excuses, abuse or threats against mny person. All I can say is that shareware rules. Forget budget publishers they just are not worth it anymore. Dunno if this post will get deleted, I hope not as I am not (nor will I) naming names). But watch out for the sharks kids... and anyone who wants to be on my links page (shareware/demo games pls) just let me know http://www.positech.co.uk

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Not sure if it would be taboo or not, but it might be a service to everyone else if you could name the publisher who behaved in such an unprofessional manner. I''m sure nobody else would want to deal with them under such circumstances and perhaps the publisher would rethink such a lack of professionalism if they knew it was public knowledge.

By the same token, sometimes it would just be inappropriate to speak of dealings with publishers when they go sour (as some people certainly cannot remain objective).

I still have faith that publishers can work, but this proves again that a developer must be VERY careful in selecting the publisher. Always get references from the publisher so you can ask others about their dealings with that publisher.

Charles Galyon

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> Basically the publisher swears at me, criticises my behaviour, > tells me I have broken the law by signing a deal with someone > else, and then physically threatens me!

publishers that physically threaten you is pretty unprofessional.
this is why i skydive and go to the gun range.

advise:

join the Association of Shareware Professionals(been around since
the ''80s....) http://www.asp-shareware.org/
they have many services and providers available there for marketing, distribution, etc that are members......
(eg. esellerate, digibuy, sharewarepromotions, etc...)

> By the same token, sometimes it would just be inappropriate to > speak of dealings with publishers when they go sour (as some
> people certainly cannot remain objective).
the objective thing to do is to stay away from
rinky dinks under the age of 25.

it''s obvious from many previous complaints that there''s little
concern for "true" independents in the game industry.
many of you need to realize that you have to "do it yourself"
and align with others who are of like mindedness.

and to the sell-out developers out there....when i go to compusa,
bestbuy, or whereever....i''ll never buy your $40-50 dollar games,
so your 80hour weeks spent drinking coke, slaving over the
"next great" 3D game, while quoting dilbert and southpark
is all for naught.

the trials and tribulation of the game scene are the same as
any other industry.......
indie developers need to get smart.




--
GLIPS Entertainment, Inc.
DEMOS.GAMES.ENTERTAINMENT.tm
http://www.glipsent.com/
- My Crappy Software -

StarSpangled Solitaire

-
StarSpangled Screen Saver

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My sympathies are with you Cliff. I would not take any of you-know-who''s threats seriously. Clearly the last act of a desparate man.

I do find it shocking though that you are discouraged from using budget publishers. I regret this very much as it shows there is one who spoils it for many

Take care,

Alex

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Unfortunately there are far too many people and companies around like the one Cliff describes, not just within the games industry. I would simply say to ignore these companies and let them get on with it. We can only hope the old saying is true, "What goes around comes around". Failing that we could always have a version of the American Guardian Angels for game developers. Organise a group of elite assasins and go stick a rocket up the backside of anyone who screws over a small developer.. mind you, we would probably end up with no publishers left, heh.

In this industry too many people are only interested in the fast buck, nobody seems to be able to see past their first slice of profit. People seem to think making a quick few quid now is good enough, even if in the long run by doing the right thing they could make a few thousand later on.

At the end of the day the only protection we developers have is contractual and editorial. Contractual protection seems not to bother the bigger companies as they can throw enough money at the situation to crush a small developer.The editorial protection can be more damaging if done correctly, but even then if they throw enough money at it, it may not work.

I think the initial solution for small developers may be shareware as Cliff suggests, but on bigger budget titles MOST new developers need the publishers money, even for budget games. So if you dance with the devil, be prepared to lose your soul, house, car and clothes off your back.

Go into any deal eyes wide open, expect the worst and if things work out its all a bonus.

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The publisher in question has calmed down and emailed me since then so it looks like things will work out.
Not much fun, but hey, it just goes to show that you need to be wary of these things.
The only name I tend to mention is RealGames because they seem to be very good publishers, I am not one to publically criticise people I have an ongoing deal with.

http://www.positech.co.uk

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I don''t know why anyone would bother with budget publishers. If they aren''t willing to fund your game in any way why would you give them a slice of the profits?

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Guest Anonymous Poster
I am out of the game business. Because it's a joke.

I think he means [censored].
[censored] is indeed a bad publisher, but which one isn't.
Most publishers big or small are pushing independed developers.
The internet isn't by the way a solution for us.
But again I quit the business so ...

Even if I got enough money to fund my projects...I doubt to work
faithfull with a publisher as partner. They don't need you, they got enough submissions of various genres. And if you don't agree with there royalty rate, etc. they simply cancel. Or you don't even get a reply.

Publishers are animals.







Edited by - DavidRM on November 3, 2001 1:03:10 PM

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quote:
and to the sell-out developers out there....when i go to compusa,
bestbuy, or whereever....i''ll never buy your $40-50 dollar games,
so your 80hour weeks spent drinking coke, slaving over the
"next great" 3D game, while quoting dilbert and southpark
.is all for naught.


Yes, but I make a whole lot of money, we work on games that WE want to work on (i.e, no suits/business men within miles) and we have a chance to become 1st party to a rather large console manufacturer/developer. Our first game due out next x-mas is completely new GUARANTEED, you will not find any game ever made that you can compare.

So there is a good side to this business, but you really have to work hard and learn your lessons if you do get ripped by publishers. I''ve had it happen to me, most of the team I work with have.

Nothing I do now is for naught.



Marc.

Marc Lambert

marc@darkhex.com

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Do you really think I'm going to tell you what game we are working on? That would be breaking my terms of employment and I don't see that happening anytime soon...


Besides, I don't want to start seeing clones popping up before our game is ready to go :-)


BTW Ed, why did you change you account? If you have lost the password to the other one, the staff can help.



Marc Lambert

marc@darkhex.com

Edited by - mlambert on November 3, 2001 1:44:13 PM

Edited by - mlambert on November 3, 2001 1:46:39 PM

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Physical threats are a criminal offence - threatening behaviour, 6 months in prison or a fine. If you were seriously worried about this you should contact the police.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by mlambert
Our first game due out next x-mas is completely new GUARANTEED, you will not find any game ever made that you can compare.

Marc Lambert

marc@darkhex.com


So tell me about this guarantee...
(j/k)

JSwing

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quote:
So tell me about this guarantee...


So are you trying to be intelligent? Are you trying to annoy me?

I''m one of the very few people ACTUALLY employed in this industry who visit this site and give ACTUAL info on our experiance. So do you find this funny?


Let me tell you something, idiot. I didn''t become a moderator by putting up with your crap. I became one by having ACTUAL experiance and the desire to help people, do you have the same? If you did, you wouldn''t have posted the stupid post you did...



Let me tell you something BOY, I have worked my ass off to be in this industry, if you can say the same, then argue. If not, then go away because you are not welcome on a forum that talks about things with reason.














Marc Lambert

marc@darkhex.com

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I''m sorry, but I really find people like this to be complete idiots.

If they had worked on anything published, then they would know my stance. I want to help those who haven''t yet been ripped off, to not be ripped off...

Instead, I''m faced with people who have a problem because I deleted one of their posts, or people who think they are clever by trying to annoy me via post that asks ''so tell me about this guarantee''

Well, I say to this, shut the HELL UP. I know my stuff otherwise I wouldn''t be a PAID professional.

If you can do my Job better than me, then apply to my employer. If you can moderate my forum beter than me, then apply to the GDnet staff. If you are trying to be clever and annoy me, then at least admit it, don''t post any crap.



Don''t be a pussy and hide behind anon posts...





Marc Lambert

marc@darkhex.com

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>So tell me about this guarantee...
>(j/k)

Apparently, I think you missed the gist of the the anonymous user''s post. I noticed a smiley face and a Just kidding at the end of it.

It was a joke, and as you know, we have herd that claim before that the game is something new and never seen, only to find out it''s 3D pong. I''m sure what ever you are working on is pretty cool, not 3D pong, but, since he was just joking, trying to make light of the whole situation, he didn''t deserve the slap you gave him.


The above posts talk about the unprofessionalism of name calling..

>>Let me tell you something, idiot.

is not professional.


>>Let me tell you something BOY...

and

>>If not, then go away because you are not welcome on a forum >>that talks about things with reason.

don''t belong together in the same sentance. Calling someone and Idiot and a Boy and then saying we talk about things with reason here, in the same post no less, make''s you look... unprofessional, to be nice.

A hypocritical attitude towards things are only going to give you a headache and an ulcer. As soon as you can laugh at everything, everything doesn''t seem so important that you have to start calling people names. Arguing and calling people names in a message board is the path of the weak and frightened. It is for those who can not stand up for themselves and take everything with offense. What he said doesn''t really matter, but to lower yourself to the level of the very people the topic post is chastising, is.. to say the least... silly, and at work, just retarded.

-Jason


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Guest Anonymous Poster
Well said Jason. There is nothing any message board needs less then hypocritical behaviour.


"Don''t be a pussy..." This line defines the need for moderation.

"So much fun, so little time."
~Michael Sikora

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Guest Anonymous Poster
> I''m one of the very few people ACTUALLY employed in this industry who visit this site

Yeah, right. you''re telling me that people in the games industry DON''T come here? You''d be suprised..

> Let me tell you something, idiot

Very professional, your maturity level reminds me of a 12 year old..

> I didn''t become a moderator by putting up with your crap

I don''t know *how* you became a moderator, but you''re the worst moderator I''ve ever seen.. personal attacks galore. Step off your high horse and realize that we aren''t going to bow down to you just because you actually work in the industry.. so you say.

> If not, then go away because you are not welcome on a forum that talks about things with reason.

Hey pot, meet kettle. Just keep babbling angrily..

> Well, I say to this, shut the HELL UP. I know my stuff otherwise I wouldn''t be a PAID professional.

It''s people like you who turn me and others off about the games industry. I find it hard to believe that people could actually put up with you.. of course, maybe that''s only when you''re dealing with "inferior people", right?

-Jipe

jipe@zworg.com

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