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TechnoHydra

Has this been done???

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I was playing around with ideas for a cyberpunk story and gave a little thought to incorporating vampires into the world. My question about this is, Has this idea been used much? Vampirism is the result of a bioengineered virus. It was originally created as a symbiote lifeform to extend human abilities(lifespan, strength, senses, regeneration). The downside to it, is that once the virus and host has bonded anything that kills one will kill the other. Extreme temperatures, radiation, anti-viral medications that kill the virus will kill the host as well. Massive damage to the heart or brain can also be fatal to the host. The virus consumes massive amounts of protein starting with whatever is passing through the digestive track. Once that is gone it begins feeding off the host body. Vampires therefore are required to eat large amounts of protein rich foods(whether tofu, meat, etc) otherwise the virus will weaken and eventually kill the host. Vampires are also divided into clans. Each clan is different then the others because of virus strain. The virus has been modified into different strains of the Vamp virus thus creating different clans. Infection takes place in 2 ways. Either 1) direct injection into the heart. Or, 2) passed on from mother to child. Feedback?

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Why do you need a "new" definition of what causes vampires? There is no need to blame it on a virus; what''s wrong with the age-old "damned for all eternity" undead explanation?
Ok, sorry, I had to say that. I''m not really a fan of cyber punk anything.
But, I think your idea could work. Definitely. But maybe you should call it something other than vampirism (maybe add a prefix to the word, something that implies a virus).
Also, why would a vampire eat tofu when they could just suck some blood?

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I was trying to come up with something original that hasnt already been played to death. The virus wasnt intended to be called Vampirism when it was first created, however some of the more radical clans began to eat raw unbled meat, when this became public knowledge some began to compare it to vampirism. Even more extreme clans reverted to canibalism as a food source.

Lets compare tofu(or any protein rich food) to canibalism. Tofu is safer and easier to obtain then hunting down a victim. The public and the law enforcement community would cry foul play when people were turning up murdered and canibalized. Anyone with this virus would in most cases prefer not being hunted down like a dog. The first people who wanted to be infected were law abiding ctizens and scientists who had a concience. Not all vampires have to be bad guys. You'll get more conflict not only between the public and vampires but also between conservative and radical vampire clans.

Edited by - TechnoHydra on November 4, 2001 12:33:24 PM

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Vampire by virus was used in "The Last Man on Earth" starring Vincent Price...a black and white movie from the late 50''s, I think. The virus kills off the bulk of the population, and then the dead come back as vampires. This was remade in the 70''s, starring Charleton Heston, but I forget the name of the film.


DavidRM
Samu Games

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Guest Anonymous Poster
Vampisrism by virus is a cliche. However, what you have described isn''t very similar to traditional vampirism. Which is fine.

But consider an alternative. A form of the undead that is characterised by endless hunger and eating meat (raw) would be a ghoul. Ghouls are actually known for cannabalizing the dead, so it makes a nice alternative for your viral specimens. Why bother tracking down a still living victim if you can dig up a fresh one?

HTH

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The feeling I''m trying to get across is that vampires are part of the story''s world not its adversary. To that end they need to be accepted to a certain extent. As far as eating tofu, they can eat whatever they want. As long as it is protein rich they can survive. Those of them with a conscience and moral code wouldnt necesarily have to be inclined to consume flesh or blood. After all they didnt become vampires for the dietary requirements, but for the benefits that the Vampirism Virus offers.

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by Tacit
Hmm...vampires eating tofu. Vegetarian vampires...now *that* hasn''t been done.



R.

There was/is a kids TV series (or maybe it was a film) called "The Ketchup Vampires"

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Personally, I think one of the attractions people have to the world of vampirism is because it is a ''fringe'' or underworld, exactly the opposite of what you are proposing. There is no common acceptance of this condition...if anything the opposite exists. Add to that the idea that becoming a vampire was a conscious decision (you mentioned that people would choose to become vampires because of what benefits it brought to them), and you have a recipe for them to be completely feared and hated by the rest of society.

What you propose sounds a lot like a repackaging of the ''nanobot'' augmentation you would normally expect to find in a cyber-punk setting.

By the way, I think it''s great that you''re trying to come up with a different way to do things. But if you want your group to be more powerful than normal people, have some kind of physical requirement on account of their greater attributes, and also be accepted into society, then I''m not sure vampires is the best approach.

R.

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Vampires as a concept have been done to a point where there's not really anything new that's usually brought to it. I for one however, absolutely love vampire/cyberpunk crossings because when done well, they're incredibly pretty.

You also open up the possibility through technology, of Vampires not necessarily being more powerful than humans, Vampirism used in cyberpunk worlds often takes on an outlook that's more like body modification and gang habits that happen to progress to a sick degree (drinking peoples blood). They're not 'too' freaky when people can have all of their teeth replaced with razor sharp fangs at a clinic. It all depends on how bleak/militant your particular future is.

However, to answer your question...Microprose has an old game called BloodNet that crosses vampirism and cyberpunk, I don't know of any other computer games that do it. Conceptually speaking, Forever publishing has a complete line of Vampire/cult/gothic supplements to the Cyberpunk 2.0.2.0. Role-Playing Game. The movie Blade, and a few other things like that touch it in places, but Computer game wise, BloodNet is the only game I know of that's approached the subject.

So, yes it has been done, but we don't see it much.

Also, a note on using clans...this is almost guaranteed to make your work look like a White Wolf rip-off.

Edited by - Wain on November 5, 2001 12:21:56 PM

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IT has been done in Shadowrun à pen and paper game of fasa inc. and i dont think it would be a good idea anyway, shadowrun is a mix of the pen and paper game cyberpunk and donjons and dragons, i once wanted to do a modification for quake3 of shadowrun and it happens that microsoft owns the electronic rights to it since they also got mechwarrior wich is also a pen and paper game of fasa. the mod was called Q3SR, and was hosted on the defunct q3mods.net

May the code be with us !

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by DavidRM
Vampire by virus was used in "The Last Man on Earth" starring Vincent Price...a black and white movie from the late 50''s, I think. The virus kills off the bulk of the population, and then the dead come back as vampires. This was remade in the 70''s, starring Charleton Heston, but I forget the name of the film.


DavidRM
Samu Games




The Heston movie was named "Omega Man" - the Price Movie was better - except the Heston movie had the heavy "Angela Davis" character - big ''fro and all trey 70''s - and hey - don''t forget the classic "Dawn of the Dead"!

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by TechnoHydra
I was playing around with ideas for a cyberpunk story and gave a little thought to incorporating vampires into the world. My question about this is, Has this idea been used much?




Not used a whole lot, but check out the old RPG ''bloodnet'' if you can find a copy. This was a cyperpunk RPG where the main character is infected with vampirism at the beginning of the game.

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quote:
Original post by TechnoHydra
As far as eating tofu, they can eat whatever they want. As long as it is protein rich they can survive. Those of them with a conscience and moral code wouldnt necesarily have to be inclined to consume flesh or blood. After all they didnt become vampires for the dietary requirements, but for the benefits that the Vampirism Virus offers.

i can see where you are coming from, but the basic concept behind vampirism is that they drink blood. you can make them sociable, you can make them vampires through virus rather than the old-school explanation, you can even make them nice and friendly... but by definition vampires drink blood. if they don't, they are something else, not vampires. it has nothing to do with protein.
count duckula was a vegetarian vampire, but that was only because when they resurrected him they used ketchup rather than blood in the ceremony (this sounds like i am contradicting myself, but hey, he was in a children's cartoon!)

--- krez (krezisback@aol.com)

Edited by - krez on November 5, 2001 1:14:20 PM

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Just about any premise would work, even vampire viruses. However, for it to work, you should be focusing on the more important aspect of the story. The drama. Who are the characters, protagonists, antagonists? What conflict exists between them, what events escalate it, what dialouge further creates hate? If you''re making a MMORPG out of this premise, then you''re on different ground and the premise better be carefully planned out.

:: Inmate2993
:: William C. Bubel
"Please refrain from bothering Booster."

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OOO, lots of feedback, I love it. I stated back in my second post that they werent vampires when the original virus/symbiote was synthed. It was from the negative stereotype of the extremist clans(maybe I'll call them cells) that the public associated with everyone that had bonded. Like I said this adds potiential conflicts between the older more conservative clans and the younger ones, since any negative actions by radicals will affect the older vamp clans and threaten their continued existence.

Vampires still live in rather secretive societies but are publicly known to exist and for the most part tolerated. Now that I think of it Wain, your right, in Blade vampirism was something of a quasi-virus. I want to make genetic manipulation fairly common place. And with genetic manipulation whether it be through nano-tech or virus or whatever, you'll have conflict between those altered and those who fear the altered as a corruption of humanity. I want to focus on those who arent biased but must still maintain order and peace.

And just to clear up the purpose of this. This isnt for any game in particular. But I'm trying to set up a world to write about. For now vampires won't be the main focus, but they will be introduced as part of the main character's world that he lives in. Later on I hope to develope different aspects and inhabitants of this world. Thats why I want a thoroughly documented world with lots of background information. I'm hoping to set some of the limits and standards now to minimize as many conflicts as possible.

Edited by - TechnoHydra on November 5, 2001 7:06:23 PM

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Guest Anonymous Poster
quote:
Original post by TechnoHydra
The Ghoul idea is interesting. But would I be able to make the Ghouls as interactive and(in some cases) as sociable as inteligent vampires?


Sure. Keep in mind vampires are (typically) aristocratic types, while ghouls are more lower class, or in some representations little more than animals. So replace the gothic lords and ladies with a more joe-sixpack kind of mentality. For a widespread technological based source this makes more sense anyway.

Rather than clans, you might have packs. And instead of the soap-opera vampires you might have something more to do with integrating ordinary humans and the ghouls around them.

You could even have earlier versions of the virus produce the sort of animalistic behavior that might be associated with ghouls, which gives you further cause for prejudice and the term ''ghoul''.

Throw in a larger population density than we have now which drives people to a more vegetable based diet (cheaper and more efficient per acre) and the raw meat only ghoul diet really stands out.



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AP before last:

I like that idea, the distinction between vampires and ghouls. The different cast levels(?) between the two groups. Ghouls would in this case be shunned much more then vampires and therefore be less organized and exist at a lower standard of living. Perhaps existing in groups more resembling gangs then organized societies. The difference could be explained by many factors early(perhaps untested) versions of the virus, corrupted batches of the virus, mutation of the advanced form by radiation, etc. Considering this is basicly a cyberpunk theme the setting is likely to be dark and generally miserable. Thx for the ideas you''ve sparked a whole new line of thought.

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I think a gamestory centered around vampires could work.
The only thing in my oppinion that you should watch out for is that fact that some things will have to touch the common ideas and myths around vampires.
As long as people see some things as how they have been hearing them, then introducing other variants and things won''t be to hard.
I think a lot of folk would find it hard to play a vegi vamp

Also I would stay clear of the clan, cell, what ever idea.
It would be better to have like a messed up world where for example each town has it''s vamp society, driven together by perhaps the human populace... Or something like that.

I would however remain with the idea that there are higher members in an organization who in turn are more powerfull. Be it physically or by the use of some powers, etc.

As for ghouls..
I think this is pretty open to interpertation. Some myths place them as servents to vamps, made by their masters, while others just use them as underworld figures praying on the dead and living alike. Much like a zombie for that matter.

just my 2 cents
well good luck to ya

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Actually, if you are just creating a world for which to have stories come out of, you might still want to create some characters to act as historical markers or something. For example, the name of the scientists who made the vampire virus, what their goals were, maybe their familys who alienated them into wanting to make a deathplauge. Stuff like that, so the stories can have characters that have some sort of relation back to the characters that started the whole mess.

:: Inmate2993
:: William C. Bubel
"Please refrain from bothering Booster."

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quote:
Original post by TechnoHydra
...The downside to it, is that once the virus and host has bonded anything that kills one will kill the other. Extreme temperatures, radiation, anti-viral medications that kill the virus will kill the host as well. Massive damage to the heart or brain can also be fatal to the host. The virus consumes massive amounts of protein starting with whatever is passing through the digestive track. Once that is gone it begins feeding off the host body. Vampires therefore are required to eat large amounts of protein rich foods(whether tofu, meat, etc) otherwise the virus will weaken and eventually kill the host.
Feedback?


But, but, but....don''t things like massive damage to heart/brain, extreme temperatures, and radiation kill people anyway (actually radiation and exteme temperatures kill anything come to think of it)? Oh, and if the host dies obviously the virus will "die" won''t it? hmmm....

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Nice to see the comments coming in:

Kamithra - At first I did want to just throw vampires in there on their own, but I got to thinking. The virus created is going to be kept secret from the general public if possible. After in a setting like this there''s bound to be prejudice by some humans against non-humans or even gentically altered ones. So these organization would be held together by the powerful, influential, rich, or corporate entities. Thus creating the need for a generalized social structure in amongst themselves.

The first thing, using some of the more familiar concepts is a definate although it gets a little more difficult in a tech environ. Stake to the heart and sensitivity to UV/sunlight routine is already in and can be acounted for, any suggestions on other stuff that would fit?

Inmate2993 - My thoughts exactly.

Kordova - True, but the idea I was trying to bring out was that it would take a lot more damage to kill a vamp in this world. Anything less then massive damage and the vamp would able to regenerate because of the symbiote/virus. Example, a normal human gets his liver and kidneys ripped out, now unless a miracle happens he won''t live. Because humans cant grow those organs back. Vampires on the other hand, only have 2 major organs heart and brain(in my world anyways). They have those other organs as well, but those organs can be regenrated long before it could threaten its life. Not saying it wouldnt hurt only that it isnt fatal. A nd when I say radiation a mean the type you get when you walk out your door on a sunny day. With these vamps exposure to sunlight will begin to slowly kill the virus, after a few hours they get sick much more of that and they die virus and host. If one dies so will the other.

Love the ideas and feedback yall are bringing.

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