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Looking for a game engine.

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First off, I have some experience in coding, and I've been told I am talented in the ways of mathematics, but I never learned an entire programming language well enough to make an actual game. But I'm not looking for a game engine where there is no coding or scripting at all, I would prefer something where you can set up the game world or levels by dragging and dropping objects in. But I could control the behavior of the objects through simple logic parameters that you set up by selecting things from lists and inputting data. 
One example is that if you were dropping in the area the player would walk on you could select the object that the player would walk on and from a list that would come up you would select something like "Lable" or "Property" that would bring up a text box where you could input something like "solidSurface" and then you would select the level which would bring up a list where you could select an if/then choice and you would be guided through a thing called "Object Define" where it would say, "If object has lable/property, " and you would select from a list of lables or properties you already made like the "solidSurface" thing you entered in earlier, then you would select some things from a list saying "Player" and you would select an action like "Collide" and finally you would select an action that would happen on collision like "Stop" and you would end up with a surface the player can walk on top of.
Or if you were making an RPG and you wanted to define how a certain attack worked and had already set up variables for the stats of the player, enemies, and equipment you could type in some things like "preDamage = (weaponAtk x 1.25) x ((playerStrgth / 100) + 1)" and "enemyDefence = enemyArmor x ((enemyEnd / 100) + 1)" and "actualDamage = preDamage - enemyDefence" then you would select an if/then/else template saying something like "if actualDamage < 0, actualDamage = 0, else enemyHP = enemyHP - actualDamage"

If you know of a game engine that is like or similar to what I'm looking for or if you need more information to know for sure, please leave a reply.

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42 minutes ago, Levi Lohman said:

I would prefer something where you can set up the game world or levels by dragging and dropping objects in.

Game maker, Unity and Unreal allow for this. You make your art outside the game, drag it in and there it is.

43 minutes ago, Levi Lohman said:

One example is that if you were dropping in the area the player would walk on you could select the object that the player would walk on and from a list that would come up you would select something like "Lable" or "Property" that would bring up a text box where you could input something like "solidSurface" and then you would select the level which would bring up a list where you could select an if/then choice and you would be guided through a thing called "Object Define" where it would say, "If object has lable/property, "

Unity and Unreal both have tags, layers and properties that do exactly this.

You tell the object how it should act when it hits "Ground" and you label the floor mesh as ground.

45 minutes ago, Levi Lohman said:

Or if you were making an RPG and you wanted to define how a certain attack worked and had already set up variables for the stats of the player, enemies, and equipment you could type in some things like "preDamage = (weaponAtk x 1.25) x ((playerStrgth / 100) + 1)" and "enemyDefence = enemyArmor x ((enemyEnd / 100) + 1)" and "actualDamage = preDamage - enemyDefence" then you would select an if/then/else template saying something like "if actualDamage < 0, actualDamage = 0, else enemyHP = enemyHP - actualDamage"

This is what programming is. You declare a value like Damage and can use it to do all kinds of math.

 

It looks like you are looking for a game engine, I recommend Unity or Unreal for 3D and GameMaker or Unit for 2D. 

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I would recomend Unity , you can do all the above , its more complicated than Game Maker but, once you get grip you can make amazing things whit it, Dunno about Unreal didnt tryed it yet

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Unity is the wrong choice while this is all added by plugins you need to download from third party people using the Unity Store and may need to fix some issues. Unreal has there Blueprint System built in and working without code natively

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Scouting Ninja didn't mention it, but Gamemaker can do the same thing that he/she is talking about there.  You can make an object be a sort of "parent" and then you make other objects "children" objects of said parent.  Then, the children can override specifics of the parent if they want to.  In code, you can refer to the parent object, and all the children objects will be included.  You can make a parent bullet, and a parent enemy.  Then you make all your player's bullets, no matter the shape, size, movement be children of the parent.  Then you make all enemies children of the parent enemy(also no matter what the do).  Finally, you make a single collision event between the two parent objects.  Then, any of the bullets will collide with any of the enemies and the event will happen.  This puts the event code all in one place no matter how many different bullet or enemy type objects you have.

 

This concept also works in Unity(and I'm sure Unreal as well), but using standard OOP style class inheritance for the script objects.

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On 11/19/2017 at 11:37 PM, Shaarigan said:

Unity is the wrong choice while this is all added by plugins you need to download from third party people using the Unity Store and may need to fix some issues. Unreal has there Blueprint System built in and working without code natively

You don't need to download plugins for Unity to make basic games, and frankly I'm not at all sure how you got that impression as it hasn't worked that way any time in the recent past. Unreal is certainly a viable alternative but it has a steeper learning curve and the learning resources for it aren't as good as they are for Unity. Not to mention that really understanding Unreal development requires at least a basic understanding of C++ and that is far from the best object-oriented language to learn first. "C++ makes the easy things difficult and the really difficult things possible."

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3 hours ago, cjmarsh said:

You don't need to download plugins for Unity to make basic games

I think what @Shaarigan was saying that if the OP wanted to have visual scripting he would need a plugin for it.

 

Second in Unity you will need to buy some plugins or assets sooner or later, it's how the engine is designed.

Unity follows the same structures developers learn to create micro transactions. Give your players(Developers) a lot of basic stuff for free, omit some of the best stuff and charge for it.

It's true you don't need to buy the assets you are free to spend the time learning how to make them yourself(Grinding).

 

This however is not a bad design. The Unity asset store is the best around the net. It helps a huge amount of developers fund and others make there games. Unity does give you some good things for free.

The Unity asset store is a large part of making games with Unity, even basic games.

3 hours ago, cjmarsh said:

Unreal is certainly...

Unreal is using a experience gateway. They keep there official tutorials to crash courses, so that experts can easily adjust to make games with Unreal. This works for them because it means that the average Unreal game is higher quality than a Unity game.

Unreal can do this because they know that any developer making money with a competing engine could earn much more by just switching to Unreal.

 

In the end what engine you use is up to each developer, everyone of the engines have a upside and a downside. If they didn't there would have been only one engine, the best engine; there is no best.

 

9 hours ago, kburkhart84 said:

Scouting Ninja didn't mention it, but Gamemaker can do the same thing that he/she is talking about there. 

Thanks for pointing that out, Gamemaker is a faithful engine to 2D developers; always a good choice.

 

 

What @Levi Lohman is describing is a game engine; as in any game engine. Most game engines have layers/ tags/ properties. Most engines have collisions build in and most game engines can do: "if actualDamage < 0, actualDamage = 0, else enemyHP = enemyHP - actualDamage"

That is what coding is, no matter if it's script or visual.

 

Almost all of the popular engines can do any of the things listed here.

Edited by Scouting Ninja

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Disagree about Unity, a lot of people talking trash here about it, and honestly dont know why, I have about 1Year proper expierience with it, and didnt need to buy anything yet, you can build proper games with it, only downside I have that you need PRO version to put videos in your game

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6 hours ago, zizulot said:

Disagree about Unity, a lot of people talking trash here about it, and honestly dont know why, I have about 1Year proper expierience with it, and didnt need to buy anything yet, you can build proper games with it, only downside I have that you need PRO version to put videos in your game

That is actually no longer the case.  They changed things up, with the free version actually having all of the features that the pro version had before.  The dark skin GUI is still only in pro, as is the customizeable/removable splash screen.

 

I also wanted to mention....sometimes, it can be a good thing that stuff on the asset store isn't part of the Unity engine.  It would be even better if the stuff was part of the engine, but able to be taken out of builds if not needed, but lots of things would degrade performance just being part of the core, meaning it is sometimes better to have the separate and only included if you are actually using them.

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7 hours ago, zizulot said:

Disagree about Unity, a lot of people talking trash here about it

Yea true it does get a lot of trash talk but that is because Unity asks for it. I keep lists of perks and cons of every engine I use so I can decide on the fly what to use, Unity has over a thousand cons.

1.) Unity fonts: Unity does not support even basic font effect. Gradients, colors curves; none of these work. Update: Unity has a few font effects now (border and shadow) but they use a slow copy of the font; don't use them for mobile games.

- Use Unity font tools. (All Unity bought packs is in Libraries\Documents\UnityUtilities.unitypackage)

- Can also import custom fonts, with some pains, so rasterized fonts can be used to cover this. Tested with photoshop.

- Never use the Unity font BestFit option, it fills the memory with different sizes of the same font.

- Unity 3D font is just a texture, use custom font meshes for vector font. Use normal shaders with these, Unity font shaders causes artifacts. (Libraries\Documents\3DDoodles\3DText)

- Unity fonts consume 4 vertices per character, counts to the 64 000 vertices limit of the UI, use custom batch for text based games.

 

That is just one of more than a thousand entries like that I have for Unity. I often find that a lot of Unity users never more than skim other engines, that is fine I get that some people work better sticking to tools they know. Just understand that when people talk trash of Unity they do so from experience.

Unreal has more than 300 entries now, fonts isn't on that list because Unreal has amazing font effects.

 

Unity is a good engine and the pro and free version is the same thing now. Unity should be most new developers go to engine. Unity is also a very good go to engine for mobile games.

Unity is a fantastic beginner engine and has a huge amount of pros (More than 1200).

 

1 hour ago, kburkhart84 said:

it can be a good thing that stuff on the asset store isn't part of the Unity engine.

I just want to clear up in case there is confusion. Unity Technologies, still owns the store, they just don't use the engine staff to run it. Working on a engine is a full time job.

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9 minutes ago, Scouting Ninja said:

I just want to clear up in case there is confusion. Unity Technologies, still owns the store, they just don't use the engine staff to run it. Working on a engine is a full time job.

 

Yeah, I could have been more clear.  Unity owns the store of course.  My point is that some of the things that are in the store and are NOT part of the core engine are better off that way due to how niche they are.  I wouldn't mind seeing some nice voxel terrain as part the Unity core engine.  But, I also realize that voxel terrain is not likely to perform as well as what they have now(heightmap based terrain, not sure which algorithm).  If they included voxel terrain, it would either replace the faster version(bad idea, especially considering mobile platforms), or it would be an option, in which case, unless they figure out how to exclude unused code from builds in a proper way, will bloat the builds with features that aren't always used.  I'm sure there are other better example than voxel terrain as well.

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20 hours ago, kburkhart84 said:

That is actually no longer the case.  They changed things up, with the free version actually having all of the features that the pro version had before.  The dark skin GUI is still only in pro, as is the customizeable/removable splash screen.

 

I also wanted to mention....sometimes, it can be a good thing that stuff on the asset store isn't part of the Unity engine.  It would be even better if the stuff was part of the engine, but able to be taken out of builds if not needed, but lots of things would degrade performance just being part of the core, meaning it is sometimes better to have the separate and only included if you are actually using them.

Well good news for me :) , I use 4.6 now, so in which version they made import video possible?

19 hours ago, Scouting Ninja said:

Yea true it does get a lot of trash talk but that is because Unity asks for it. I keep lists of perks and cons of every engine I use so I can decide on the fly what to use, Unity has over a thousand cons.

1.) Unity fonts: Unity does not support even basic font effect. Gradients, colors curves; none of these work. Update: Unity has a few font effects now (border and shadow) but they use a slow copy of the font; don't use them for mobile games.

- Use Unity font tools. (All Unity bought packs is in Libraries\Documents\UnityUtilities.unitypackage)

- Can also import custom fonts, with some pains, so rasterized fonts can be used to cover this. Tested with photoshop.

- Never use the Unity font BestFit option, it fills the memory with different sizes of the same font.

- Unity 3D font is just a texture, use custom font meshes for vector font. Use normal shaders with these, Unity font shaders causes artifacts. (Libraries\Documents\3DDoodles\3DText)

- Unity fonts consume 4 vertices per character, counts to the 64 000 vertices limit of the UI, use custom batch for text based games.

 

That is just one of more than a thousand entries like that I have for Unity. I often find that a lot of Unity users never more than skim other engines, that is fine I get that some people work better sticking to tools they know. Just understand that when people talk trash of Unity they do so from experience.

Unreal has more than 300 entries now, fonts isn't on that list because Unreal has amazing font effects.

 

Unity is a good engine and the pro and free version is the same thing now. Unity should be most new developers go to engine. Unity is also a very good go to engine for mobile games.

Unity is a fantastic beginner engine and has a huge amount of pros (More than 1200).

 

I just want to clear up in case there is confusion. Unity Technologies, still owns the store, they just don't use the engine staff to run it. Working on a engine is a full time job.

Man , I was working with Unity for about 1+ years now, hearing this cons makes me think about it, but I invested so much time in it so its so hard to change engine, what would you advice?

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37 minutes ago, zizulot said:

Well good news for me  , I use 4.6 now, so in which version they made import video possible?

No idea. I think it was when they changed how there license(4.8?) works. I use Unity 2017(2017.01 I will update when done with my next game) and it has the video player script.

It supports the basic ones but depending on what platform you make for some videos won't work, this is the nature of most video codex.

37 minutes ago, zizulot said:

Man , I was working with Unity for about 1+ years now, hearing this cons makes me think about it, but I invested so much time in it so its so hard to change engine, what would you advice?

With a years experience you do have a understanding of how games work. So downloading other engines to see how they work is not a bad idea.

However be warned you won't immediately like the other engine even if it is good, the human mind does not like change, you will get frustrated at the start(it happens to all of us). A thing that helps is finding common ground, in Unreal the blueprints work like Unity's scripts.

 

There is no need for you to try any other engine at all. Many developers believe you should stick to one engine until you have made at least one game from start to end.

Edited by Scouting Ninja

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On 2017-12-11 at 5:59 PM, Scouting Ninja said:

No idea. I think it was when they changed how there license(4.8?) works. I use Unity 2017(2017.01 I will update when done with my next game) and it has the video player script.

It supports the basic ones but depending on what platform you make for some videos won't work, this is the nature of most video codex.

With a years experience you do have a understanding of how games work. So downloading other engines to see how they work is not a bad idea.

However be warned you won't immediately like the other engine even if it is good, the human mind does not like change, you will get frustrated at the start(it happens to all of us). A thing that helps is finding common ground, in Unreal the blueprints work like Unity's scripts.

 

There is no need for you to try any other engine at all. Many developers believe you should stick to one engine until you have made at least one game from start to end.

I know about changing things up makes you mfrustrated, but before Unity I was working with Game Maker for a while, then decided to move up to Unity, to be honest it was way much more difficult engine to understand but I was happy with it, I will give Unreal engine a try, mostly Im making 2D 2.5D games, so thats whats made me to choose Unity, I have no idea which language Unreal using I think C++ , is it hard to move between c++ and c#?

On 2017-12-12 at 5:03 AM, kburkhart84 said:

I think the license change to Unity happened with the release of 5.0, I could be wrong.

Thats awesome , I have Unity 5.5 aswell as 2017 so thats no problem, Im just using 4.6 just for a while, I will move up gradually

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43 minutes ago, zizulot said:

I will give Unreal engine a try, mostly Im making 2D 2.5D games

Then you have less reason than most to change to Unreal. Unreal's 2D part is nothing special.

I have made a few of my games now in both engines to see how they differ. Unreal was much better for my UI only games, like match 3 games, giving much better performance and UI tools.

Unity worked well for most 2D games except the UI ones, so it is still my go to engine for mobile 2D games; except the UI ones.

For desktop 2D games I use Unreal, because they are much larger and Unreal is great for long term projects.

58 minutes ago, zizulot said:

Unreal using I think C++ , is it hard to move between c++ and c#?

C++ is harder but as always C++ with the engine isn't like working with pure C++. For most part C++ and C# looks identical:

Spoiler



//C++ Custom Max function
int max(int num1, int num2) {
  
   int result;
  
   if (num1 > num2)
      result = num1;
   else
      result = num2;

   return result; 
}

//C# Custom Max function
int max(int num1, int num2) {
  
   int result;
  
   if (num1 > num2)
      result = num1;
   else
      result = num2;

   return result; 
}


 

How they work underneath is very different. The hardest thing to learn for C++ is garbage collection but again if you mostly work with Unreal functions it's not that much of a concern.

 

About the Blueprints VS Code thin I have an example I made, so people want to compare can:

Spoiler

 

Unity code C#


using System.Collections;
using System.Collections.Generic;
using UnityEngine;

public class TheUnityVersion : MonoBehaviour {

	int AddTwoNumbers(int NumberA, int NumberB){
		return NumberA + NumberB;
	}

	void PrintEveryChar(string InString){
		foreach (char Character in InString) {
			print (Character);
		}
	}


	// Use this for initialization
	void Start () {
		string TempString = AddTwoNumbers (100, 20).ToString();
		print (TempString);

		PrintEveryChar (TempString);
	}

}

Unreal Blueprints:

xUnrealBasic.thumb.jpg.3c6b0bed5c5d19a6e


 

Feel free to share this with others so they can compare the two.

 

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On 2017-12-14 at 4:38 PM, Scouting Ninja said:

Then you have less reason than most to change to Unreal. Unreal's 2D part is nothing special.

I have made a few of my games now in both engines to see how they differ. Unreal was much better for my UI only games, like match 3 games, giving much better performance and UI tools.

Unity worked well for most 2D games except the UI ones, so it is still my go to engine for mobile 2D games; except the UI ones.

For desktop 2D games I use Unreal, because they are much larger and Unreal is great for long term projects.

C++ is harder but as always C++ with the engine isn't like working with pure C++. For most part C++ and C# looks identical:

  Hide contents

 



//C++ Custom Max function
int max(int num1, int num2) {
  
   int result;
  
   if (num1 > num2)
      result = num1;
   else
      result = num2;

   return result; 
}

//C# Custom Max function
int max(int num1, int num2) {
  
   int result;
  
   if (num1 > num2)
      result = num1;
   else
      result = num2;

   return result; 
}

 

 

 

 

How they work underneath is very different. The hardest thing to learn for C++ is garbage collection but again if you mostly work with Unreal functions it's not that much of a concern.

 

About the Blueprints VS Code thin I have an example I made, so people want to compare can:

  Hide contents

 

Unity code C#



using System.Collections;
using System.Collections.Generic;
using UnityEngine;

public class TheUnityVersion : MonoBehaviour {

	int AddTwoNumbers(int NumberA, int NumberB){
		return NumberA + NumberB;
	}

	void PrintEveryChar(string InString){
		foreach (char Character in InString) {
			print (Character);
		}
	}


	// Use this for initialization
	void Start () {
		string TempString = AddTwoNumbers (100, 20).ToString();
		print (TempString);

		PrintEveryChar (TempString);
	}

}

Unreal Blueprints:

xUnrealBasic.thumb.jpg.3c6b0bed5c5d19a6e

 

 

 

 

Feel free to share this with others so they can compare the two.

 

Love your reply, you helped me a lot :) , I will try my hand on Unreal, if something than I will dump it and get back to Unity

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