Market Confussion, Video Game Industry?

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17 comments, last by Scouting Ninja 5 years, 10 months ago
2 hours ago, JulieMaru-chan said:

Competition is the whole point of capitalism and it's what drives progress in our society.

Really only way for indie developer to beat a big companies - is to use better tools and dipper knowledge of field. Tools most likely have to be self-made, so saying by other world - have to generate a "know how" that big companies unable to generate or use. It is really imposible to do for a just skilled schoolboy. Creation of its next-gen tools and most likely compatible gaming engine will take years for implement by solo engineer even with years of expirience into fields where entry level is higher than requirments that big companies have for gaming engine developers. So to win competition indie developer have to drive progress. But most of indie or tiny company developed games on Play Marked and Steam - is a complete garbage, made from free assets on free engines by free from any knowledges "developers" with only mind - put it on market faster.

#define if(a) if((a) && rand()%100)

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3 hours ago, Fulcrum.013 said:

Really only way for indie developer to beat a big companies - is to use better tools and dipper knowledge of field. Tools most likely have to be self-made, so saying by other world - have to generate a "know how" that big companies unable to generate or use. It is really imposible to do for a just skilled schoolboy. Creation of its next-gen tools and most likely compatible gaming engine will take years for implement by solo engineer even with years of expirience into fields where entry level is higher than requirments that big companies have for gaming engine developers. So to win competition indie developer have to drive progress. But most of indie or tiny company developed games on Play Marked and Steam - is a complete garbage, made from free assets on free engines by free from any knowledges "developers" with only mind - put it on market faster.

Comment of the year, man!

Unfortunately, the (mostly) capitalistic system doesn't guarantee any industry a viable option for small entrants. In many industries, a handful of massive, dominant companies is the norm.

You can only meet the market as you find it, and adapt to it as it changes. This may include not writing games for what you have determined to be a crowded market.

Large developers tend to be risk-averse. With large budgets and investors to be kept happy, it is expected that they maximise the chances of a good return on investment.

This presents two opportunities for smaller indie developers.

 

Firstly, smaller developers may be able to take risks that larger developers would not; experimental ideas, unusual combinations, new genres, racing to create one of the first hits on an unproven platform, etc.  Of course, many times indie developers try unusual ideas and they don't pan out in the market. Sometimes a risk can really pay off though.

 

Secondly, smaller developers can sometimes target a niche market that may not have the earning potential to support a larger developer with high costs, but could comfortably support a smaller developer who can bring a product to market with smaller costs. Many successful smaller business find a dominate some niche; being "the big fish in a small pond", rather than competing with the sharks in an open ocean, so to speak.

- Jason Astle-Adams

(1) Computer games is hardly an emerging industry.  I was buying indie games for my TI-99/4A 35 years ago -- they came on cassette because indies could not afford the manufacturing or license fees for the carts that the big mega corporations used (ah, Burger  Time, I haven't though about you in years).  Heck, the rich kids in my neighbourhood had a Pong hooked up to their TV 45 years ago. Three generations of developers is enough to start calling it a mature market.

(2) Computer games is not a special industry.  You're not going to make a full-time living as an indie musician, or an indie film maker, or an indie sports league, or an indie car maker (unless you product line is featured in a series of science fiction films as some kind of time machine).  Yet there are still plenty of those around.  The very nature of being an indie means you're a small fish in a big ocean and you better be doing it for the love of the art, and be able to pay your rent in "exposure."

(3) There are already plenty of laws protecting the market.  Unfortunately, an unregulated free-market economy always leads to a plutocracy and a regulated market, where the regulations are in favour of the folks at the same exclusive country club where the lawmakers spend time.  In other words, the existing laws, regulations, and justice system in most places is designed and operated to favour the richer among us, whether that's corporations in a capitalist society or elite families and individuals everywhere.

You want to make computer games as an indie?  Do it.  Do it out of love for the craft.  Make the best games you can. Put your games on the market.  Keep your expectations in line and don't bet the rent money.

Stephen M. Webb
Professional Free Software Developer

The point is, MEGA Corps have learned howto sport internet markets as orniments before they can become industry.
This will KILL ALL but a few internet emerging markets in the future. It's a done deal. After allt some MEGA's have limits kinda like ATT / Time Warner. 

Well, It's a good thing everyone has plenty of money these days. And that Social protections for Social Security etc. etc. are in place
(They probly will not be needed anyway). Because if you dont have pleant of money now, chances are you WILL in the future. In many ways It's easier to have your American Dream right now, than it's ever been.

Maybe thats why a Viable Indie Video Game Industry became extinct so soon. No one really needed it.

So, enjoy your hobbie indie.

6 hours ago, Allen Bipster said:

Maybe thats why a Viable Indie Video Game Industry became extinct so soon. No one really needed it.

Making loads of money as a single person with no experience is not a viable business. That doesn't mean that indie development is not viable at all, because you're describing hobby gamedev rather than indie gamedev. 

I've been doing indie development for about 6 years, and have met lots of other indie developers in that time span who are still operating today. These are not hobbyists though, they're independent businesses. 

Let's talk definitions for a moment; even though it's impossible to pin down the exactly what indie means, we can at least get an idea of the scope. The Indie Games Source defines them as self-published games with under 20 staff. That's a decent rule of thumb but also allows for venture-capital backed games while excluding small, independent  self-funded games who are marketed by a known publisher... My local PAX indie show has no strict rules, but 'prefers' games that are digital-only (not boxed retail), with under 5 staff for a small podium booth / under 20 staff for a larger booth, while also mentioning self-published. They also have a showcase competition, which requires games to not have a traditional publisher agreement in place (i.e. Funded by a publisher is a no, but simply being sold under their brand is OK) and also requires no external funding except for government funding or crowd funding. This allows  companies that work in other areas but funnel their profits into games, or long-term games companies that are reinvesting their profits into a new game. Or rich kids with trust funds. Or dedicated founders who've re-mortgaged their houses to raise a million dollars or start-up capital. 

These definitions can easily include games with budgets as low as a few thousand dollars up to about $2M... And businesses with that kind of cash flow are much more likely to be viable than an individual hobbyist with a dream. 

A $1M project can be an Indie game. If we're making strict definitions, then it's probably more likely to be a legit Indie game than these individual-hobbyist games are :P

If you want to be an Indie dev, treat it for what it is - a real business - not a hobby that you want easy money from. Make sure someone on the team is familiar with some kind of business-centric education, and can be detached enough to see the venture as a real business that sells unmarked boxes of product, not a hobby that they deeply love. Treat it the same as you would if you were founding a start-up that makes pacemakers, or coffee beans, or server farms. A business is a business. Indie games are made by independent businesses. 

And they can certainly be viable. We can and do operate in the same marketplace as the "mega" companies.

On 6/23/2018 at 6:21 PM, Allen Bipster said:

There should be some type Law's in place to protect emerging internet markets for Indies. 

This would create a unfair market where developers would stay "indie" instead of growing into a larger company. We can already see a similar effect happening now.

A lot of software gives indie developers a break, offering them lower fees while they are still earning a small amount of money. Once a developer starts making around 100K in revenue these licenses jump to five or six times the cost to keep using them.

So right now I have encountered a few indie studios who talk about the "pro hurdle" where developers will lower the price of their games from $20 to $15 so that they can miss the 100K revenue mark. Because revenue doesn't mean profit. Then they will use the money from the new game to "Jump" the 100K revenue mark by a large margin so they can afford to pay the now higher rates.

 

The simple fact is that creating laws to support indies would only create a lot of unintended consequences. So most governments support indies with funding etc and still tries to motivate them to grow into larger businesses.

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