C# and its functionality.

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44 comments, last by J_T_Biggs 22 years, 3 months ago
quote:Original post by Big B

If you are going to learn C#, wait until it matures a bit

Too late - I already know it

quote:
Actually, C# isn''t as open as you think. Microsoft still controls the standard and can say who is allowed to implement it. The only reason Corel is doing a FreeBSD port is because Microsoft told them to. MS also holds patents on much of the technology used in C# and .Net. This isn''t unusual for companies to do, but if you are trying to create open standards, it doesn''t make any sense. Also, the spec and what it takes to implement all of C# is something that only a large company could do.

Ximian is hardly a large company, yet they seem to be doing fairly well. Take a look at their status page: http://www.go-mono.com/status.html. You also have Portable.NET and DotGNU, none of which are backed by large corporations. All these are working off the ECMA specs.

quote:
The reason Java isn''t a standard is because Sun would have lost control of the standard. Microsoft would have been able to put in proprietary extensions (which it did), and Sun would have been powerless to stop them.

I dont follow the logic - Making it open would have enabled MS to make it proprietary?

quote:
Read more about it here:

http://netscape.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5100663,00.html?chkpt=zdnnp1tp01

If you have a similar or opposite article, please post it.

I''ve seen that article before. I can only refer back to my Tony Goodhew quote(couple of posts up).


quote:Original post by AP
The only thing i object about is the extra so called power that C# supplies by allowing unmanaged pointers. I feel this kind of defies the idea of a interpreted language and all rules of safety that comes with it. Such a design is not consistent IMHO

I cant see that this is much different than using inline asm in C++. The fact that you have to label these sections with the word "unsafe" pretty much suggests that this shouldnt be the first alternative, yet it is an option if you really require that kind of flexibility.

quote:Original post by subnet_rx
You don''t see many Unix programmers that know VB. It will be the same with C#.

The Mono people doesnt see it that way.


Fantastic doctrines (like Christianity or Islam or Marxism or Microsoft-bashing) require unanimity of belief. One dissenter casts doubt on the creed of millions. Thus the fear and hate; thus the torture chamber, the iron stake, the gallows, the labor camp, the psychiatric ward - Edward Abbey
--AnkhSVN - A Visual Studio .NET Addin for the Subversion version control system.[Project site] [IRC channel] [Blog]
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I don''t see the logic, you say C# has been out since fall of 2000, yet I can''t find a stable compiler. You really can''t have a stable languange without a stable compiler....at least.
"There are two types of languages, those that everyone complains about, and those that no one uses."Standardized C++ LibrariesGamecron PC GamingA Christian Blog
Download the framework here for free(includes commandline J-script, VB.NET and C# compilers): http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/default.asp?URL=/code/sample.asp?url=/msdn-files/027/000/976/msdncompositedoc.xml

Or order VS.NET beta 2 or RC1 on CD or DVD from Microsoft(you pay for s&h): http://msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio/nextgen/beta.asp

I am fairly sure that Beta 1 of the framework was released during the fall of 2000.



Fantastic doctrines (like Christianity or Islam or Marxism or Microsoft-bashing) require unanimity of belief. One dissenter casts doubt on the creed of millions. Thus the fear and hate; thus the torture chamber, the iron stake, the gallows, the labor camp, the psychiatric ward - Edward Abbey
--AnkhSVN - A Visual Studio .NET Addin for the Subversion version control system.[Project site] [IRC channel] [Blog]
C# is certainly a step in the right direction as far as programming languages goes, from a usability standpoint I believe I would rather use it than C++, and will provide a good incentive for Sun to keep on playing nice with Java. Unlike Microsoft, Sun has not been convicted of being an abusive monopolist, but I agree with Arild that standardization is the way to go in the long run, when Microsoft''s embrace and extend tactics can no longer be considered a threat to the platform independence of the language. That will also be the criteria for me to consider using C#, whether there exist an independent implementation of both language and class libraries that can be used to develop real applications and whether that implementation is backed by enough solid corporations to withstand possible attempts from Microsoft to shut it down or corrupt it (for instance by using patents to shut down key parts of the implementation). Ximian might be on the way to providing such an implementation, but they are still to small to withstand being screwed over by Microsoft.

Still, there''s no rush to pick up the language, considering that it has yet to be released and that it will have to prove itself in the marketplace. It''s nice that Microsoft is providing an alternative to Java, but I don''t think you have to be a fanatic to be wary of vendor lock-in and foul play with technologies like C# and .Net coming from a company with a business and legal history like Microsoft''s.

Henry


"If Ballmer told me that my pants were on fire AND I smelled smoke AND I felt my ass getting warm I still would not believe him. " -- Unknown
quote:It does no such thing. Not having your code littered with the trivialities of manual memory management makes it far more readable.

If you have numerous blocks of code that arent related to the problem domain, they dont improve readability. Thats not even a matter of opinion.

You seem to forget that programming IS memory management, and if you are programming for performance, it is absolutely necessary to know what is happening to your memory. You may be right about readability, but I think readability is a pretty poor altar to sacrifice performance upon. (Again, I speak from a game programmer''s perspective).

quote:Please refer me to one.

Pleeeease! Just forget it - it was stupid of you to pick me up on that one and maybe even stupider of me to say it in the first place...

quote:Notice here that C# gives you the power to choose - C++ just shoves it in your face whether you want it or not.

Hmmm... You''re right, I s''pose. I would really hate to have to surround all my code in unsafe {} blocks though.

quote:Not an insult. I stated an opinion. But the wording was unfortunate - I apologize.

Apology accepted. Opinion irrelevant.

quote:I stand by my statement regarding bigotry. Whenever the words "in the name of" appear, ugly things happen.

OK, it was silly of me...

quote:Yes.

Good. Learn not to be quite so sensitive.

quote:C++ - 4 years
C# - 5 months

C++ - 5 years
C# - 0 years
Stop calling me a newbie.

quote:Thats an extremely thin foundation for making such a strong statement. Do you know any language besides C++ at all?

VB, ASM, and Java, but C++ is my language of choice for almost everything. But you''re right about that - it was a "thin foundation." I stated my opinion - maybe I was in error.

Well, I''m done here - Happy New Year to y''all

---------------

I finally got it all together...
...and then forgot where I put it.
quote:Happy New Year to y''all

And to you too

Fantastic doctrines (like Christianity or Islam or Marxism or Microsoft-bashing) require unanimity of belief. One dissenter casts doubt on the creed of millions. Thus the fear and hate; thus the torture chamber, the iron stake, the gallows, the labor camp, the psychiatric ward - Edward Abbey
--AnkhSVN - A Visual Studio .NET Addin for the Subversion version control system.[Project site] [IRC channel] [Blog]

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