1st, 2nd, 3rd generation MMORPG?

443

January 15, 2002 06:46 PM

quote:Original post by InnocuousFox
So, to interpret your phrase: "but i consider any form of marketing a scam..."
If I tell you I have a candy bar for sale at 50 cents... exactly what I paid for it out of the vending machine... I am marketing the candy bar to you. Please circle the implied scam in red ink for us all to see.

perhaps technically you are "marketing the candy bar to me," but i meant "marketing" in the common usage way... i.e. sales departments and those people that think up commercials and billboards.

quote:My only point was that you took your distrust of marketing (which I believe is partially justified) to a ludicrous extreme and threw out a very large blanket from which nothing escaped.

yah, it is fun to generalize. this does not mean what i actually said isn''t true, though; it''s just an extreme point of view. i think most people got my point though... if my wording bothers you that much, pretend i just said, "let the buyer beware!"

quote:It just seems that every time I am annoyed by a post lately, I look up and see the kewl little skull thingy next to your name.

this would seem to indicate that i am not the bitter one.

--- krez (krezisback@aol.com)

--- krez ([email="krez_AT_optonline_DOT_net"]krez_AT_optonline_DOT_net[/email])

IADaveMark

3,839

Author

January 15, 2002 10:11 PM

quote:Original post by krez
perhaps technically you are "marketing the candy bar to me," but i meant "marketing" in the common usage way... i.e. sales departments and those people that think up commercials and billboards.

And yet, not ALL of those commercials and billboards are misleading and/or incorrect.

quote:yah, it is fun to generalize. this does not mean what i actually said isn''t true, though; it''s just an extreme point of view. i think most people got my point though... if my wording bothers you that much, pretend i just said, "let the buyer beware!"

Of course, if someone were to browse through and see someone saying "all marketing is crap" and believed it... wouldn''t that have been horribly misleading on your part? Tsk Tsk!

quote:this would seem to indicate that i am not the bitter one.

I am not bitter... just annoyed.

Now... back to the original topic, please.

Dave Mark
Intrinsic Algorithm Development

Dave Mark - President and Lead Designer of Intrinsic Algorithm LLC
Professional consultant on game AI, mathematical modeling, simulation modeling
Co-founder and 10 year advisor of the GDC AI Summit
Author of the book, Behavioral Mathematics for Game AI
Blogs I write:
IA News - What's happening at IA | IA on AI - AI news and notes | Post-Play'em - Observations on AI of games I play

"Reducing the world to mathematical equations!"

krez

443

January 15, 2002 10:41 PM

quote:Original post by InnocuousFox
And yet, not ALL of those commercials and billboards are misleading and/or incorrect.

ok, fine... i admit it... not EACH AND EVERY marketing person is a liar. but, generally speaking (for the most part / usually / add in your own qualifier here) their goal is sales not honesty.

quote:Of course, if someone were to browse through and see someone saying "all marketing is crap" and believed it... wouldn''t that have been horribly misleading on your part? Tsk Tsk!

now now, i''m not saying that to make money, or for any personal gain at all; it is simply my opinion about a part of business.

quote:Now... back to the original topic, please.

ok...

quote:I recently saw a reference to "3rd gen" MMORPGs. What are considered the definitions that set them apart... perhaps some examples?

a rephrasing of what i said earlier should count as "on topic": i consider there to be no definition, as they are fuzzy undefinable words used to add pizazz to a marketing scheme. the only thing that sets them apart is how "new and improved" the advertising people think they can get away with before someone realizes that it is the same old thing, with slightly better graphics.

--- krez (krezisback@aol.com)

--- krez ([email="krez_AT_optonline_DOT_net"]krez_AT_optonline_DOT_net[/email])

EvilCrap

134

January 15, 2002 11:26 PM

I know that there is some game in development where the players and ncps can make/destroy cities and stuff, and the players exist with properties derived from genetic algorithms depending on their parents. this i think might be next gen if they pull it off.
i forget the name of it, ill have to try and find it.

personally, i have found the mmorpgs to be somewhat dull. i would like to see one based in the world of diablo, where your your char would start somewhere, and diablo would pop up, and convert you and a ton of cities into minions and stuff -- and then theres big wars and everything. mmorpgs should not necessariy let a player be how he wants - instead, he starts how he wants, and then can be effected by uncontrollable forces, like Diablo, or govornments, or talents or learning defeciencies.

IADaveMark

3,839

Author

January 16, 2002 10:46 AM

quote:Original post by krez
a rephrasing of what i said earlier should count as "on topic": i consider there to be no definition, as they are fuzzy undefinable words used to add pizazz to a marketing scheme. the only thing that sets them apart is how "new and improved" the advertising people think they can get away with before someone realizes that it is the same old thing, with slightly better graphics.

I agree that many marketing people might spin stuff as being something it is not... i.e. the "latest and greatest". I also agree that a lot of groupings are not granular enough and neglect the more subtle differences between different titles. However, since I was on a technical related board, I was hoping for the technical definitions of what those divisions may be. I think I have accumulated quite a number of different ways to slice it.

Thanks,

Dave Mark
Intrinsic Algorithm Development

Dave Mark - President and Lead Designer of Intrinsic Algorithm LLC
Professional consultant on game AI, mathematical modeling, simulation modeling
Co-founder and 10 year advisor of the GDC AI Summit
Author of the book, Behavioral Mathematics for Game AI
Blogs I write:
IA News - What's happening at IA | IA on AI - AI news and notes | Post-Play'em - Observations on AI of games I play

"Reducing the world to mathematical equations!"

krez

443

January 16, 2002 10:53 AM

quote:Original post by InnocuousFox
However, since I was on a technical related board, I was hoping for the technical definitions of what those divisions may be.

well, i should shut up now (i probably should have shut up much earlier), but... there is no technical definition. do a google search; almost every [non-star-trek related] web page that has the words "next generation" is advertising something. any "technical" definition that you do come up with will be contrived.

--- krez (krezisback@aol.com)

--- krez ([email="krez_AT_optonline_DOT_net"]krez_AT_optonline_DOT_net[/email])

IADaveMark

3,839

Author

January 16, 2002 12:27 PM

That was one thing I learned early on in this thread is that there was no real technical definition. That, in and of itself, is a valid answer to my question.

Dave Mark
Intrinsic Algorithm Development

Dave Mark - President and Lead Designer of Intrinsic Algorithm LLC
Professional consultant on game AI, mathematical modeling, simulation modeling
Co-founder and 10 year advisor of the GDC AI Summit
Author of the book, Behavioral Mathematics for Game AI
Blogs I write:
IA News - What's happening at IA | IA on AI - AI news and notes | Post-Play'em - Observations on AI of games I play

"Reducing the world to mathematical equations!"

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