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GDNB

Wanna Be Game Artist......

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bishop_pass    109
Well, I can give you my take on it, but I''m a college dropout and I''ve never had an art class before. But, and that is a big but, I have some things to say.

Study architectural design, large format photography, digital arts, 3d modeling and animation, file formats, web publishing, anatomy, nature, the various light phenomena such as crepuscular rays, alpenglow, silhouettes, etc., and study composition. Learn about input devices and techniqes, including tablets, 3d digitizers, motion capture techniques and so forth.


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TechnoHydra    122
bishop-pass is right. Basicly go for a BA it''ll give you all the drawing, painting, RL modeling skills to get you atarted and from there its a simple conversion of canvas to pixel. I think anyways.

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Kandolo    325
Not sure if all universities offer this, but I know at Indiana University one can do an Individualized Major of whatever you want it to be. Great thing about this is that you can dive in across multiple departments (including all those listed by bishop pass). This also lets you do independent study in your field with an advisor familiar with the concept. At IU, you also must do a final project.

For example, if you were at IU, you could name your major, "Game Design Graphics", or something more specific such as "3d Art/Animation Narratives". I even think someone here has pulled off a "World Game Design" Individualized Major.

I''m considering doing one myself. I''m currently a telecommunications: design and production major with a french and fine arts minor. If I switch to IMP, I''ll be extending the fine arts minor a little more and will possibly take some interior design (autocad) courses as well. It all depends on what you and your advisor want. IU has plenty of people who could advise you because they have a unique graduate program called "MIME" which stands for "Masters in Immersive Mediated Environments". Just to give you an idea of the degree of the program, one of the advisors was one of the designers of Ultima Online. I''m actually hoping to enroll in this program once I get my B.A.

Another benefit to an Individualized Major is that it also lets you take graduate courses as an undergrad.

Also, there are many game design schools out there as well. However, with the IMP you can touch upon areas you may not be able to at those colleges. And, the experience you get from independent study with your advisor and your final project is immeasurable.

- T

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Niyana    122
I definitly agree with Dazyna! You do not need anything but a piece of paper, a pencil, and a lot of hard work put into practicing. You could spend years in school and not get as much practice as you could in a year without having to deal with other stuff in school like English and History. Trust me, a degree may be flashy, but nothing beats a good looking portfolio. If you are really that interested, spend all your time drawing drawing drawing, and then work on CGing your image in programs such as Photoshop, or Paint Shop Pro...and then start looking around for contract work. If you are good enough, the degree will not matter one way or the other, and you will just save yourself some stress and money from not wasting time in school or doing unneeded research papers!
~Niyana

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Davaris    118
I know a guy who is a pro moeller and all he did was learn 3D Studio Max. He had natural talent though. You can complete a degree and still not have the talent to make it though.

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bishop_pass    109
So it is clear that the remarks made since my original post do not belittle my advice, I never said anything about getting a degree. I merely said that the topics I mentioned are worthy of study.

And about learning how to sketch and using a 3d modeler, that isn''t enough. I earnestly sugget you learn every discipline I initially suggested.

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sleepyweasle    122
Just teach yourself. By the time I got halfway through school, I knew more than my instructors because I spent a lot of free time studying what the pros had done.Next thing you know, I was hired by Rainbow studios and I didn''t even have an associates degree. After I left Rainbow, I tried to go back to school, but my instructors didn''t have a clue.

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eng3d    91
quote:
Original post by sleepyweasle
Just teach yourself. By the time I got halfway through school, I knew more than my instructors because I spent a lot of free time studying what the pros had done.Next thing you know, I was hired by Rainbow studios and I didn''t even have an associates degree. After I left Rainbow, I tried to go back to school, but my instructors didn''t have a clue.


In my case is very similars, i knew more that my teachers (programmers studies in the university). So i learn that the self study in the game-dev-world is more worth that a long, expensive and useless study.

A artist need only one things :
-a carpet with many (a lot) of works. If you draw nice and fast, you can have a job easily. A degreed only help a little.

Of course, in the art-school, you learn many things, it is not good. Is better to be very-good in a fewers things that be average-good in a lot of things.




-----------------------------------------------

"Cuando se es peon, la unica salida es la revolución"

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Kylotan    10006
quote:
Original post by Niyana
I definitly agree with Dazyna! You do not need anything but a piece of paper, a pencil, and a lot of hard work put into practicing. You could spend years in school and not get as much practice as you could in a year without having to deal with other stuff in school like English and History. Trust me, a degree may be flashy, but nothing beats a good looking portfolio.

Of course, the university will tend to have more and better tools than you can afford or download as shareware. So if you want to be a game artist, as opposed to just an artist, formal education is likely to help you.



[ MSVC Fixes | STL | SDL | Game AI | Sockets | C++ Faq Lite | Boost ]

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Dazyna    122
"So if you want to be a game artist, as opposed to just an artist, formal education is likely to help you."

no its not. its a waste of time. you would get charged to use the school software and tools anyway.

what kind of artist do you wanna be anyway? 3d? concept?

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bishop_pass    109
Regardless of whether the education is self taught (and very hands on) or formal, I would like to see an enumeration of those skills and concepts that others think are valuable to being an artist. Let''s say a digital artist.

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GDNB    122
what up.. just a little background of myself.. I am a junior in high school.. I go to a technical high school so we have a vocational center to.. In the vocational center I take Commerical Art and am pretty well skilled in hand drawings.. I want to do 3D animation and modeling.. but also have a desire to program.. so should I go to college for programming and do drawing on my own (since everyone is saying I dont need to go to school).. alright peace and thanks for replying!!

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Dazyna    122
first, at least what i''d suggest, is to download GMAX. its a free 3d software and it has almost the same layout as 3DS MAX. so when and if you get 3DS MAX, if you learn GMAX, you''ll already know about 3/4 of what you need to know to use it.

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Kandolo    325
Once again, back to my post An individualized major gives you a LOT of opportinity for independent study while also retrieving credit towards a B.A. And, you get to pick what classes you take, so no BS courses

I just got back from Atlanta visiting CNN (Long story, but I wound up getting a personal tour by a pulitzer prize winning senior producer ;p) I spent a lot of time at the Graphics Department, which was very cool. But, the most interesting person I met was an IU grad with a Theater Major and a Telecom Minor with a NICE cushy job that just graduated last year. This just goes to show that there is a lot more than just a major that gets you a job.

College is still very important. College is an opportunity for students to hone their skills in various areas that will inevitably help them out in later life. It allows you to explore interest and expand your horizons, as well as have access to expensive technology and experts in the field. And, finally, and possibly most importantly, College can help you get a job through placement programs, contacts (like the CNN Producer I mentioned earlier), and internships.

While college may not be NECESSARY - if your good enough without it, imagine how good you could be with it??

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TechnoHydra    122
I agree that you don''t need to attend a special school to become an excellent artist, but going to school to learn art CAN help. Not all of us are child prodigies, studying theory and such can add to skills overall whether it be for canvas or CG. Plus the piece of paper you get CAN help. If you''re going to go into software engineering then I would strongly suggest that you attend a university. Many of the positions offered by major companies require that you have a Bachelors Degree.

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Kylotan    10006
quote:
Original post by Dazyna
"So if you want to be a game artist, as opposed to just an artist, formal education is likely to help you."

no its not. its a waste of time. you would get charged to use the school software and tools anyway.

What are you talking about? Why is it a waste of time? Don''t make any claim without backing it up - that is a waste of time.



[ MSVC Fixes | STL | SDL | Game AI | Sockets | C++ Faq Lite | Boost ]

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Dazyna    122
Ok, here goes.

1. You have to pay for the course (duh.)
2. You have to pay to use their stuff. (No, It's not tax-payer supported anymore)
3. Homework. UGH.
4. Imacs (WHAT KIND OF IDIOT USES IMACS??)
5. Tutorials are free and you can go at your own pace instead of either trying to catch up with or wait for the rest of the class.
6. The realization that marine biology would have been a lot better because you get to scuba dive every other class and it was cheaper, then the sudden realization of how interesting giant squids and octopi are.
7. I bet Kylotan is an evil college teacher in disguise!!
GAAAAAAAAHHH!!
8. Me is a kollege graduat. Lookit how grat i em...
9. Let's say you had an interview with Activison and you were up against someone who doesnt have a degree, didnt go to college to learn to draw, but still has a kick @$$ portfolio (I know lots of people who fit this criteria) and you have your degree, but only a so-so portfolio (cause you kept staring outside wishing you chose marine biology) who do you think they're gonna pick?

Edited by - Dazyna on February 13, 2002 3:04:31 PM

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digitalatari    122
Im a senior, getting a BA, majoring in art and psych.
Right now we are preparing a gallery show and also our resumes...getting us ready for the real world (it is a required class for all senior art majors). Also, I have been researching the game design industry quite a bit, as that is where I want to go (of coarse I didn''t decide/realize this unti this semester).

From what I gather, getting a higher education really will help you. You will learn a lot more than you think (yes, even some english and biology). You also have the chance to get involved in many campus organizations or pursue an internship, like with some graphics company. All these opportunities are for your betterment. Experience pays, and employers like to see that.

Yes, one could argue that you don''t need to get a formal education to learn how to use programs.

If you do skip college, there are a few things that you will be missing out on. Deadlines suck, right? But they keep you on track. If you do the work, you actually learn the program. But if you decide to sleep in all day, wake up and scratch yourself for an hour, and spend only about 2 hours working with the programs, you wont get anywhere. It is an amazing concept, huh?

Another thing is that you will miss is feedback from peers and professors. This is very important, as some feedback can be invaluable. If you are doing something that is bad, you might not see it, but someone else might, and they can help you out. There have been many times where I have been stuck and sought help from other students or a professor.

In each of my art classes I have learned something that is applicable to game design: color theory, form, how to create a focal point, working with 3D objects and materials, light and shading, textures. All applicable.

I don''t think that the average high school can prepare you enough for going right into the game industry. I know that my high school art curriculum was absolutely horrible. If you can''t afford a 4 year school to get a BA, you should strongly consider taking a few classes in different areas at a community college. I would recomend ceramics, photography, and painting. Those 3 classes would pretty much teach you the fundamentals of the arts. And any computer graphics courses would certainly benefit you.

I didn''t want to go to college. But I did anyway. When it is all over, I will be glad I did it. It certainly won'' t hurt my job search.

College is not a bad thing, it is a good thing. You will get lots of experience, and that always looks good to employers.

digitalatari.

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Kandolo    325
Okay...

Ok, here goes.

"1. You have to pay for the course (duh.)"

Yeah, you are also paying for something that will teach you more than what you could teach yourself.

"2. You have to pay to use their stuff. (No, It''s not tax-payer supported anymore)"

Heh... yeah, but at incredibly reduced prices. I know at IU anything involving technology comes free by our $100 technology fee that everyone pays any way. Also, just try buying a 3d animation package without a student discount. Heh. Also, this "Stuff" is more expensive than any high school graduate can afford.

"3. Homework. UGH."

Hah, so... you don''t like homework huh? Try telling an employer that you aren''t going to do what they want you to do, your going to do what you want to do and at their own pace. The working world is all about deadlines.

"4. Imacs (WHAT KIND OF IDIOT USES IMACS??)"

Who says they all have IMacs? Here at IU we have all G4''s and Silicon Graphics stations.

"5. Tutorials are free and you can go at your own pace instead of either trying to catch up with or wait for the rest of the class."

Once again, the real world has deadlines. Better get used to it. And, these free tutorials don''t familiarize yourself with the business and don''t give you the luxury of having someone to critique your work.

"6. The realization that marine biology would have been a lot better because you get to scuba dive every other class and it was cheaper, then the sudden realization of how interesting giant squids and octopi are. "

Yeah, just about everyone changes their major in college. Thats the great thing about it. You get to explore your interests and discover what you really want to do. I started out a Telecommunications major, and now I''m a 3d Art and Animation major.

"7. I bet Kylotan is an evil college teacher in disguise!!
GAAAAAAAAHHH!!"

Rarely will you find a "teacher" in college. Thats the great thing about it, you get plenty of first hand interaction with those with PhD''s and real time world experience.

"8. Me is a kollege graduat. Lookit how grat i em... "

Thats exactly what employers will look at. If they have completed a college degree and have received high grades in courses taught by top notch professors, then you must be doing something great! No college diploma? What does that show? Laziness.

"9. Let''s say you had an interview with Activison and you were up against someone who doesnt have a degree, didnt go to college to learn to draw, but still has a kick @$$ portfolio (I know lots of people who fit this criteria) and you have your degree, but only a so-so portfolio (cause you kept staring outside wishing you chose marine biology) who do you think they''re gonna pick? "

Oh, there''s plenty of other things involved. Let''s say that person you were up against had an internship already in the field? Had on their resume that they had experience with all the technology that they used, studied in Italy over the summer, was Fencing Club President (Heh, my brother got a job for that... showed team spirit), did a senior thesis on Art and Game Design, and graduated with honors. Not to mention had a rounded out eductation in science, humanities, culture, and historical studies. What''s this? The applicant also has a business minor? OMG! Sorry, your out of a job.

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sleepyweasle    122
Your demo reel is the most important thing. End of story. I know because I WATCHED the senior artists and engineers review them. They didn''t give a damn about where the person went to school. If it sucked, it gets chucked to the side. And I''ve seen them chuck aside a terrible demo that belonged to a graduate student that didn''t have a clue. If you do decide to go to school, do NOT use assignments you did on your demo reel. Sounds obvious, but I''ve seen it time and time again. Generate your own demo and don''t listen to BS that the school will feed you about your demo. I does not have to have a story and yes, outer space content is fine as long as you do it well. My demo was all outer space and it got me hired. (lots of schools push this stuff)

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