Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Opinions on AD&D in computer RPG's

This topic is 5672 days old which is more than the 365 day threshold we allow for new replies. Please post a new topic.

If you intended to correct an error in the post then please contact us.

Recommended Posts

I recently started implementing the (almost) complete rules of "Advanced Dungeons and Dragons 3rd Edition" into my game. In the last few days however, ive gotten a feeling that not everybody loves AD&D as much as i do. How do you feel about AD&D in computer games? Why? Any systems you like better? Why? Thank you in advance

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Two things that used to bother me about ad+d;

1. High level spells are really lame (except wish)

2. The whole ThAc0 and hit point thing were its just not realistic

The infinity engine games (BaldursGate I+II, Planescape, IcewindDale etc...) seem to have a VERY complete implementation of the rules...

We used to play paper and pencil D+D and my buddy came up with a table so we could roll for, ahem, p*nis size... One dude rolled so well the DM allowed him an extra attack (Schwing!)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Personally, I''m partial to

- Rolemaster (ICE): for the stat/skill system (though, with the 3rd edition, D&D is now somewhat similar); investing in a skill offers diminishing returns (hit points, magic points are treated as skills) and for the combat rules.

- Ars Magica (Atlas Games): the best magic system ever. Totally unimplementable on a computer, of course. No ''levels''

- Rêve de Dragon (out of print): very fun magic system (impredictible and dangerous). See Dwarfsoft''s description of the universe. The skill & experience system is relatively easy to implement. No ''levels''

And more... I''m mostly fed up with D&D''s rigidity, crappy magic and ridiculous combat.

Documents [ GDNet | MSDN | STL | OpenGL | Formats | RTFM | Asking Smart Questions ]
C++ Stuff [ MinGW | Loki | SDL | Boost. | STLport | FLTK | ACCU Recommended Books ]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Anybody out there try GURPS (Generic Universal Role Playing System), by Steve Jackson games?

That is a great system. Simple, extensible, and mostly something that can be implemented on a computer.

I actually like the AD&D rules, I have to admit, particularly the 3rd edition. If you can put a game together that uses those rules, more power to you - but man, that''s a lot of rules. :-)

I liked Baldur''s Gate and Planescape: Torment, both based upon the AD&D rules.

My $0.02 (Canadian, so not worth much, these days!)

Cheers,
Russ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quote:
Original post by ComponentFault
Anybody out there try GURPS (Generic Universal Role Playing System), by Steve Jackson games?



I''m still looking for a copy of Bunnies and Burrows ...

Documents [ GDNet | MSDN | STL | OpenGL | Formats | RTFM | Asking Smart Questions ]
C++ Stuff [ MinGW | Loki | SDL | Boost. | STLport | FLTK | ACCU Recommended Books ]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks for all your input , appreciate it.

quote:

If you can put a game together that uses those rules, more power to you - but man, that''s a lot of rules. :-)



Hehe very true. Actually i got the idea for this project after playing "Pool of Radiance 2". Besides a shitty engine and no story this game has the weakest implementation of ad&d in any game ever.

I figured i could do better. Anyway, it *is* a lot of rules and to be honest im pretty bored so far. But i think (hope) the fun will start when i have a working system.

Ill look into the various systems you all mentioned. I probably wont be converted but it should be an interesting read none the less.

Keep the input coming .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm sure there's plenty of people out there that are AD&D fans and would love what you've implemented. Diablo II seems mainly to be AD&D based and it's popularity is still going fairly strong.

To be honest, I don't see the point. The AD&D ruleset was designed so that players could sit down with pen and paper and quickly calculate damage, movement, character development, spells and so on. In a world of 1 to 2 GHz processors, isn't this system a bit antiquated? We should be able to create something much more acurate with relative ease.

I checked out GURPS along with some other game systems. This page link to some interesting systems. Hmmm, it'd be cool to create a Gaming System API... Duuuuuude!

- Jay


"Strictly speaking, there is no need to teach the student, because the student himself is Buddha, even though he may not be aware of it." - Shunryu Suzuki

Get Tranced!


[edited by - coderx75 on June 3, 2002 9:09:13 PM]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quote:
1. High level spells are really lame (except wish)

Most of them. They are powerful, which is appropriate, but in a way that really hinders the fun for everyone else.

------------
aud.vze.com - The Audacious Engine <-- Newbie alert, look at your own risk. Can induce severe laughing fits and other variations of hysterical outburst.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quote:

I recently started implementing the (almost) complete rules of "Advanced Dungeons and Dragons 3rd Edition" into my game.


Not to be picky, but with third edition, they dropped "advanced" from the title. It''s just D&D now.

Besides, Neverwinter Nights is just around the corner.

The d20 system is not bad, and would lend itself to computer games fairly easily. GURPS is pretty good in that regard as well; minimal and flexible.

Have you ever looked at Phoenix Command? Now there is something that needs to be implemented in a computer game.

Take care,
Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The question is, why WOULD you use AD&D rules?

Just use whatever makes your game most fun. I think it''s pathetic that people actually advertise "now with AD&D 3.1 rules!!!!" What the hell does that mean to most people? And then you have to deal with complaints like "hey man, in the REAL 3.1 rules Orcs can''t use two weapons!"

There is no reason to believe that AD&D rules make for a good computer game. There is no reason to believe that ANY pen & paper system translates well to computer games.

It all depends on how you want your game to play. Nobody cares about the rules, along as they work and are fun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quote:

The question is, why WOULD you use AD&D rules?



I think the main (only?) reason would be to appeal to the people who already play the pen and paper games.

Take care,
Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
D&D is nice in pen & paper games, because the system already exists and is wildely adopted.
That mean you can play with almost any role playing gamer without problem.

I don''t think that a computer game should tell you which rules it uses or even show stats to the player, do you want to play a game or do like most lame so called ''RPGamers'' play rules ?

Obviously I prefer to play games and I don''t really care about the rules, all that counts is :
1- never ever makes me chase rats.
2- never ever makes me weaker than a dog.
3- always makes me begin the game with nice clothes and equipement. (optionnaly that I can choose)


Rules don''t make role playing games, but they sometimes break them.
Just my Opinion.


-* So many things to do, so little time to spend. *-

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The AD&D rules used in the Baldurs Gate games were a pain in the ass, it took me about 5 minutes for my guy to hit anything with his spells/weapons and even then they did nearly no damage. I ended up stopping playing the game in annoyance at the incompetence of my guy to hit anything, that is not the way a game should be played.

If you want my advice make it so that weapons\spells almost always hit and just alter the damage they do to make them better. I'm not saying don't use D&D rules just saying don't feel pressured to use all of them

[edited by - Grambo on June 4, 2002 5:08:22 AM]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quote:
Original post by Siebharinn
[quote]
The question is, why WOULD you use AD&D rules?



I think the main (only?) reason would be to appeal to the people who already play the pen and paper games.

Take care,
Bill

Yeah, that''s what I was getting at. Of course you run the risk of losing people like me who really don''t know or care that the AD&D 3rd edition rules are. When I see previews, reviews and PR prattle on about them I tend to think that I''m not the target audience and move on.

You also run the risk of implementing them inexactly and then facing the wrath of "hardcore" players. For example I read a lot of Pool Of Radiance reviews that bashed it for not being true to AD&D rules.

I would say use whatever works. What do you want to emphasize? How do you want the pacing to be? What sorts of races and classes do you want? How do you want the player to feel? How likely should death be, how quickly should characters advance, etc.

Another problem with using AD&D rules is that is pretty much locks you into the genero-fantasy setting. Yeah, healing types can only use bludgeoning weapons or something...got that already...Elves make good magicians ho-hum. Innovation in setting is something most games are really lacking. How many variations of "Bonk Orcs on the Head" do you really need?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Anyone who has actually laboured through the creation of a full role-playing system will quickly see the value in a pre-existing set of rules. Content, balancing, playtesting, statistical analysis, history, geography are just some of the issues you can avoid when dealing with a properly working system. This enables you to focus your energy on gameplay and story.

Of course, if the original designers have not done their work properly, that becomes an issue...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quote:

Another problem with using AD&D rules is that is pretty much locks you into the genero-fantasy setting. Yeah, healing types can only use bludgeoning weapons or something...got that already...Elves make good magicians ho-hum. Innovation in setting is something most games are really lacking. How many variations of "Bonk Orcs on the Head" do you really need?



The new d20 rules have pretty much done away with all of the limitations that you mention. Any combination is possible now. Couple that with the fact that almost any monster can be played as a character, and you''ve got a lot of options.

As for "genero-fantasy", the d20 system is used for Star Wars and Call of Cthulhu, and it seems to work fairly well.

Take care,
Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You can implent AD&D rules to your game, but i have feeling that you cant advertice that. AD&D is registered trademark, you have to buy license if you want to tell that your game uses AD&D rules.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
In my opinion, d20 rules are not only more flexible and more realistic, but they seem easier to translate to computer code.

Here's a thought:
If you look at FF5, doesn't the multiclassing system remind you somewhat of d20?

[edited by - DuranStrife on June 8, 2002 1:09:49 PM]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites