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Smooothhh

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About Smooothhh

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  1. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

    Whats the biggest thing cloud could call? The summon Alexander:       Cloud could call all the summons, they would still be some 10-50 feet big, link can summon as well, the four giants, who would make Godzilla only up to his knees:     These giants even tower over clouds, thats easily 1,000 feet tall. These giants would step on all the summons like ants.    Young link at half clouds age was already at fighting skill and level of a commander of an army:  
  2. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

    Young links who can move around 1-5 ton objects       Link can manipulate and control the weather in various ways:   Song of storms x thunder medallion x magic flute = All combined basically calls forth a hurricane tornado lightning storm.  Fire rod x quake medallion x dins fire x gorons mask = a vulcan volcano exploding.      Lttp > Cloud Oot > Cloud A.L > Cloud MM > Cloud W.W > Cloud Loz > Cloud   And a bunch more carnations can each solo cloud in one timeline.    And here I thought this was a screw attack community http://forums.screwattack.com/index.php   Instead its the anti-screw attack terds an wannbes and nothing but screw attack haters. In that case they should take down that logo of screw attack, they should have named that site, we talk about everything but screw attack, join us to bitch and cry about our butt hurt opinions we cant prove.    lol at the mods like TheLousyTactician, should have named that site a lousy piece of shit. The mods dont even know the concept of moderating, and can only see why nothing gets proven right there, thats because even the mods is bias. Just looked at the actual members there, and its only a handful, no wonder there was so much butt hurt post, these are like the rejects you see in the link vs cloud comments section, even though that death battle had over 80,000+ likes. Ha ha ha,   Zack is killed by a regular platoon:     Even zelda fights small platoons and wins:       Clouds best feat is cutting some falling debris thats only 1/10,000th the size of the building. The bombs in the game might be able to just blow up a room in the game, but links bombs full capacity can nuke an entire pyramid building:           Links strength of his destructive power level ridiculously out guns clouds.     Link >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cloud.   And the falling debris which isnt that impressive, can easily be matched by a single sword beam of links:     Yup, link can blow shit up too with his sword.    And cloud tanked bahamuts blast and the killed the dragon?     Link tanked a blast point blank from four dragon heads using fire beams at once:       And then killed them all. An how much dragons did cloud solo, one? Didnt you know...link has solo'd over 50 dragons in his career, all which can be even bigger than bahamut:   But cloud can jump, really really high...so can link with the use of some good oh bombs:   Hmmm, pulls bombs out of a reality warping bag that alters the size of his items, (check), the shield tanks the blast from bombs (check), link then flys some 200 yards into a somersault and one shots...triple check. 
  3. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

      This damage is more game mechanic than anything, in that case titus can hit 99,999 and hit you 5x to clouds 1 titus in that case can one shot every character in the FF7 universe, would you also mind showing where is the attack point numbers when cloud is being butchered by sephiroth in advent children? Because I dont see 100 or 9,999 number poping out when cloud is being cut to ribbons by sephiroth.      Or how about when cloud was prostrate on the ground defeated and exhausted and had to be saved by Vincent valentine:   So you can see it, cloud cant handle multiple people at once, hes on the ground Ko'd saved by valintine, while link even without his sword can toss around giants:   Of course link dodges, or else how does he not get hit in the game, link has the superior speed here:   Speed = running distance in an amount of time Dexterity = deflecting things with their hands Agility = dodging things with their entire body   Link has the goron mask his running or rolling speed is double that of a horse, (no FF7 characeter runs faster than 30 mph on foot this is why cloud has a motorcycle), link has dodged pits light arrows, and if you played pits games you'd know he is hyper sonic in movement, agility, he has the bunny hood.   Of course pit is non-canon but this is the same link that dodges plasma attacks, lightning, and lasers in almost every game, again this is where you take cinema (clouds movies) and ignore the stuff link does in game play.    There is no confusion here, there is just a lack of knowledge. Show me one speed feat cloud has that matches link doing figure eights around a laser beam blast:     And then one shotting that same guy   Or how about these reflexes where link dodged super fast fairy when it was already a few inches from his face:     And then tanked a grenade point blank:   Then caught one of them, threw it back and it blew the guy up to bits:     Links strength can stop 100 ton metal bulls with his bare hands:       With the titans mits  you can lift 100 ton metal blocks   Link could just bend the buster sword around clouds neck and tie a bow.    Cloud can take damage? Link can tank hits from ganon and ganondorf the wielder of tri-force of power, not to mention gets hit by bosses with each boss like 100-1,000 tons of force by the sheer size of them. Its funny you should mention reflexes, yet in the game no speed is even required, no fast pace thinking is even added in as the enemy's just stand there and wait for you to formulate a plan of attack. 
  4. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

                If it was only smaller than a atlas stone (atlas stones can be from 150-250-500 to more) than why would they incorporate such large stones in every game after? You do know link has lifted larger objects before this game even came out right? This game came out in 1991, the comics were before this game, link in the first zelda game he moves what looks like mini mountains in Loz when he gets the bracelet. Link has always been shown lifting large things with magic, strength and enhancers:   Not even ten tons can break steel chains, steel chains can be used to drag bulldozers, the bracelet snaps than easily and flys ganon like 100 feet:   (Did you catch the part link jumped over a 50 feet wall with no enhancers?)   If you watch further here, link blasts a hole in the ceiling over a 100 feet high, link could have just brought the whole castle down doing sword beams:   (So much for the myth link cant fire anything out of his protection state)   With crazy durability jumping through walls as if he was the incredible hulk:       All of this is way before link to the past, never seen a human in my life do these kinda things...have you? Link has done tons of things in the comics before link to the past, link has done tons of strength feats in the manga, tons of strength feats in the animated series, pretty sure he is proven to be superhuman at base before most of his enchantments take play, what seems to frustrate cloud fans Is that:   1.) They dont know anything about the history of Link.   2.) They take only clouds story persona of super soldier and apply it to your average no feat farm boy. (Any one who says it that way will think the soldier out classes a farm boy)   That is the main problems. Cherry picking or building your own version of link with literally nothing in his arsenal, and then you wanna give cloud all things he usually doesnt use canonically (like materia) then you wanna highlight the bullet timing, the 100 feet jumps, the cutting debris ect, thats like all cloud has, like 4 show cased feats, link has over a 100 show case feats that shows he is superhuman. Cherry picking and ignoring the basics. What people wana do is make up this idea that if you take away all links gear that he is some  weakling cloud will dispatch in ten seconds, yet what they never do is, apply it both sides, if you take away all his arsenal, then take away all clouds mako enhancement and sword, link will still pulverize cloud, at base, with basic equipment or both having access to everything in the their games/cinema.           If one has titanic strength and durability, and the other at base is just a 80 pound twig with no fighting skills or even experience. then I think the stats will show link a superhuman level person at base will win regardless of what excuses you can come up with. Link is lifting rocks that are bigger than atlas stones like nothing, as a kid...his adult version would be much stronger as shown in ocarina he transitioned from moving 1 ton blocks from the deku stage. to 10-100 ton blocks in the forest temple. Cloud is not a martial artist.            Sounds more like you just wanna ignore that link has more advantages. If link can lift a mid tier giant over his head with one hand, I think link would do to cloud what hulk did to loki:   Forest temple adult link:   No power gloves,  no handy glove, no silver or golden gauntlets, no titan mits, no anything...just raw strength:         Thats just how it is written, you cannot bypass the rules in chess just as same as the rules applied with superman not being able to eat kryptonite. If you dont have ganondorfs weak stuff, you cant kill him, there is no mentioning of sephiroth needing a divine element to beat him, if he can be killed by a single combo by an ordinary sword, he is not all powerful.    Link goes through entire armies one shotting people:     In another scene he one shots an entire army on a bridge:   Zack got killed by a platoon. Cloud is not vastly more powerful than zack.      First off its not that impressive compared to what other true swordsmen who can tank stuff an dish out stuff too like dante, raiden, kratos ect, link one shots in the animated series alone over a 100 monsters, ranging from 100 foot tall giants, 50 ton giant crabs, armies of moblins and skeleton knights, and three shots a dragon twice as big as bamahmut with only sword beams. Nothing is impressive in FF7 AC other than clouds movements. If link was in FF7 universe with the romani magic milk, you could solo every enemy or boss by his combo of protective enhancing, it would be like link has a unlimited supply of heros drink, clouds protect and shied magic materia do not offer him invulnerability, they just lessen the damage, link on the other hand is untouchable in several ways, only hero drink is the thing that makes cloud untouchable for 2-3 turns and he doesnt have a size reality warping bag like link has to fit even more than he has pockets so no 99 hero drinks, no 99 mega lixers, just what ever he can carry. Links usual bosses are no more smaller than the omega weapons, sure cloud and his team beat them, but they used a team, sure cloud could solo one if he reaches lvl 99 but how did cloud reach lvl 99 in the game? By team effort, he gets stronger along the way with the help of his friends in battle, this is obvious in the bahamut fight,cloud couldnt even reach bahamut and the team had to catapult him up, link is nearly always solo.   And as for the master sword, its not just a weapon against ganon, it enhances the abilitys of the bearer, heres link first getting the master sword:         How the master sword looks like in combat outside game mechanics: http://www.zeldacapital.com/Zelda%20Comics/A%20Link%20to%20the%20Past%20Comics/Chapter%206%20-%20A%20Fool%20in%20the%20Shape%20of%20a%20Tree/page%201.jpg   http://www.zeldacapital.com/Zelda%20Comics/A%20Link%20to%20the%20Past%20Comics/Chapter%206%20-%20A%20Fool%20in%20the%20Shape%20of%20a%20Tree/page%202.jpg   http://www.zeldacapital.com/Zelda%20Comics/A%20Link%20to%20the%20Past%20Comics/Chapter%206%20-%20A%20Fool%20in%20the%20Shape%20of%20a%20Tree/page%203.jpg       Doesn't look like an ordinary sword now does it?       More like giant water melon compared to the orange.
  5. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

        He still lifts these type of rocks his own size before no enhancers:         Even the worlds strongest men have trouble lifting rocks smaller than them:     Then strip away the mako from these soldiers and they'd be average. Link still throws massive sizes rocks over his head  meters away like nothing and runs around with them, show zack or cloud doing that if you wanna low ball. And thats still young link, cloud, zack and the rest are only in the game as men.        Nope, as a adult the stone link is pushing is in the forest temple, thats way before he gets the silver gauntlet and he cant use the goron bracelet as an adult so this is base link with ten tons. Never said its only gona be clouds sword, the mako obviously plays a role in enhancing his attributes, it can repel and reflect ganons beams back and is used specifically against him, If sephiroth transitioned, link can kill him, if ganon made his way to FF7, no one could stop him because they dont have the master sword.    Base = Link Regular gear = Tie Enhanced = Link Full powered = link        
  6. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

    Links items that doesn't consume magic:   - Heart ring (auto regen) - Bunny hood and boots (increases speed and agility) - Blue ring (damage taken halves) - Armor ring (decreases damage)  - Red ring (sword damage doubles) - Experts ring (unlimited bomb-like punches) - Holy rings (nullify all elemental attacks) - Mirror shield (reflects magic/light/energy)   Link can be self restoring and immune/reflect magic, at the same time be strength, durability and speed enhanced through out this entire fight without spending one drop of magic.     Clouds material that consumes magic:   - wall  (lessens magic and physical damage) - reflect (reflects attack spells back) - fire/ice/earth/lightning (elemental) - Full cure (restore back to full health) - Shield (heavy amount of magic use ups his defense) - haste/slow/stop - summons over 10 of them     I think people are not tallying in how much times cloud can actually use all of his magic material, in the game you can junction alot of magic because 3 people are using there own magic meter in one fight, if it was just one person not nearly as much spells can be casted, so cloud probably has only enough magic to use each once. Each is only temporary and lasts only a few moments. So this fight has to be quick for cloud other wise link will wear cloud down and once his magic is gone and the fight gets physical then link will be pretty much super enhanced while cloud reverted back to base, at base cloud is no weakling, but link will be just too superior.   Links enhancements = Limitless Clouds magic materia = limited   A composite is still quite a bit to over powered for link, a single link with all his ring enhancements is already nearly impervious and suped up,link also has the four swords which splits him into four different links:   Thats 4 links, 8 hands, 40 fingers. Power Ring L-1 Sword damage +1, Damage taken +13 Power Ring L-2 Sword damage +2, Damage taken +24 Power Ring L-3Sword damage +3, Damage taken +35 Armor Ring L-1Sword damage -1, Damage taken -16 Armor Ring L-2Sword damage -2, Damage taken -27 Armor Ring L-3Sword damage -3, Damage taken -38 Red RingSword Damage x29 Blue RingDamage taken 1/210 Green RingSword damage +1, Damage taken -111 Cursed Ring1/2 Sword Damage, Damage taken x212 Expert's RingPunch when not equipped13 Blast RingBomb damage +214 Rang Ring L-1Boomerang damage +115 GBA Time RingLife Advanced!16 Maple's RingMaple meetings ?17 Steadfast RingGet knocked back less18 Pegasus RingLengthen Pegasus Seed effect19 Toss RingThrowing distance +120 Heart Ring L-1Slowly recover lost Hearts21 Heart Ring L-2Recover lost Hearts22 Swimmer's RingSwimming Speed +123 Charge RingSpin Attack charges quickly24 Light Ring L-1Sword beams at -2 Hearts25 Light Ring L-2Sword beams at -3 Hearts26 Bomber's RingSet two Bombs at once27 Green Luck Ring1/2 damage from traps28 Blue Luck Ring1/2 damage from beams29 Gold Luck Ring1/2 damage from falls30 Red Luck Ring1/2 damage from spiked floors31 Green Holy RingNo damage from electricity32 Blue Holy RingNo damage from Zora's fire33 Red Holy RingNo damage from small rocks34 Snowshoe RingNo sliding on ice35 Roc's RingCracked floors don't crumble36 Quicksand RingNo sinking in quicksand37 Red Joy RingBeasts drop double Rupees38 Blue Joy RingBeasts drop double Hearts3 9Gold Joy RingFind double items40 Green Joy RingFind double Ore Chunks41 Discovery RingSense soft earth nearby42 Rang Ring L-2Boomerang damage +243 Octo RingBecome an Octorok44 Moblin RingBecome a Moblin45 Like Like RingBecome a Like Like46 Subrosian RingBecome a Subrosian47 First Gen RingBecome something?48 Spin RingDouble Spin Attack49 Bombproof RingNo damage from your own Bombs50 Energy RingBeam replaces Spin Attack51 Dbl. Edged RingSword damage ^ but you get hurt52 GBA Nature RingLife Advanced!53 Slayer's Ring1000 beasts slain5 4Rupee Ring10,000 Rupees collected55 Victory RingThe Evil King Ganon defeated56 Sign Ring100 signs broken57 100th Ring100 rings appraised58 Whisp RingNo effect from jinxes59 Gasha RingGrow great Gasha Trees60 Peace RingNo explosion if holding Bomb61 Zora RingDive without breathing62 Fist RingPunch when not equipped63 Whimsical RingSword damage -1, Sometimes deadly64 Protection RingDamage taken is always one Heart Thats four over powered links with 10 rings per hand that could rival the lantern     One link is too much for cloud, 4 links wearing ten rings each while having access to multiple masks is over kill, one can have on the goron mask, the giants mask, the fierce deity mask, ect, then its 4 even more over powered links against cloud. 
  7. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

      I think a chosen timeline would be fair, say one game (zelda ocarina of time) vs one game (FF7). But that would dilute it a bit, because game wise cloud does not run pass 5 mph nor jumps 5+ feet, if we take advent children movie scene then thats out side mechanics as well, which what death battle looked like they did, they didnt take a composite link from all games, they just mentioned them, in reality they only gave each 9 items/skills each two themes. For cloud, the final fantasy 7 game and the movie, while link had ocarina of time and links awakening, thats why it seemed fair, if they would have gave cloud more stuff, they would have to give link more as well.   In that case of links stuff founded, almost every rpg character is that way, unless like superman and has all his powers derived from within, then almost no character has a embodied skill. They always find enhancements along the way, if the lvling up system was true in ff7 other than game mechanics and AC was canon, then cloud should have been well above  lvl 99 in the movie. Mug doesn't fit out side of turn base, because where would cloud then hold each item he steals, his pockets? Link after all has 100's, and link is accustomed to his gear to fit his puzzle solving character, dont think cloud would know how to use it with his characters main personified intelligence, at best hes a mechanic an hack an slash em guy, not a diverse skill's men. You are also presuming cloud would have precognition of all of links items (like all villains know superman is weak to kryptonite, when only about 3 know), unless cloud can study him through the entire fight and find out in game play time what each item does (before even being killed by it) then I think thats a far fetch'd idea. Link with no items is still a power house in the strength department, and cloud doesnt have anything to show for hand to hand, you cant assume he can fight like zack as more than he can use powers as sephiroth, sephiroths scene with angeal and genesis is not all that impressive, every one who has the masamune in other franchises do exactly that, even frog from chrono trigger does similar things like cutting a mountain in half, cloud doesnt have the masamune.   This fight would be a game like chess and built on rules, a pawn cannot move like a queen, a bishop cannot move foward, if a pawn has an obstacle in front of it, it cannot just jump over it and eat it, it can only attack diagonally, hence cloud cannot just by-pass certain elements of links skill and prowess, cloud cannot kill link using most magic because link has an immunity to almost every elemental attack, cloud has only temporary protecting things tied in with magic, all of them rely on his magic meter alone, most of links do not rely on magic, if cloud wanted to become faster with haste, it is temporary in two ways, one being he needs magic, and two it only last a short amount of time, links enchantments does not have this problem, if link wanted to be faster, his bunny hood is an unlimited supply as long as hes wearing it. This goes the same with clouds entire arsenal, everything he uses has a limit of use or a time limited to its use. All links enhancements, like strength (gloves), speed (bunny hood), movement (roc feather and boots), extra protection (shield, rings and clothing's) multiple add in skills (transformation masks) all dont need to be fueled by magic. Hence in the long run or a rapid amount of use in a short period, cloud will be left with only his sword, while link will still have access to all his enchantments. I mean its a tough fight in terms how it'll look visually, but on paper the powers link has dwarfs the power cloud has.    Its like superman, he isnt just one of the best superheros of all time for having one base skill/power, he has a combination of them, hes diverse, as link is. It could go either way depending on the creator/writter like superman against luthor or batman, even power houses lose to average humans, but if we go full power set in and base it upon their all around capabilitys, then link wins in my opinion a still 9/10 times based on everything in play. All in all death battle should do a composite canon round 2 to end the debate much like their goku vs superman 2, which was a even further stomp once you understood their entire history.   Ocarina of time vs FF7 cloud = Link 7/10 Both composite = Link 9/10 Both's entire franchise plus spin offs and non-canonical history = link 10/10
  8. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

    The extended version of Super Nova inflicts massive damage and status effects, but cannot actually kill a target  http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Supernova_(ability)   So a supernova that wasnt intend to kill, and originally only 2000 damage, which is like 1/1000 the time weaker than the knights of the round attack.  Link doesnt need a supernova, cloud is suspect to impaling and cut an butchered from a 2 inch sword               Hence cloud might shrug off a 2 inch sword, but link has much bigger swords.    And death battle? Not according to the polls, the VIP for the entire game is none other than link him self.        Na, but if you start comparing characters from different universes, following different "laws of physics" or "magic systems", using sometimes utility gear as an indicator of combat power (never seen link smash any enemy in link to the past with his super gloves, how do we know it is even usable in combat?), we get into an "everything goes zone" that makes silly statements like mine... well, less silly.   Fact still stands that the telletubbies never lost to an opponent in open combat (and I guess not many people on this forum would have been able to stand to watch the mindboggling stupid tubbies long enough to find an episode that proves me wrong (probably one of the tubbies got beaten by a squirrel in one of them :))).     If you want a less silly, and more to the point comparison that shows how pointless this whole thing is:   A Jedi vs Indiana Jones. Jedi uses normal Jedi gear, so only lightsaber as weapon. Fight start at a distance. Fight is on earth...   Indiana wins (given his trusty revolver does not fail him).     If we shorten the distance, and take away Indis revolver, it is more of a fight. Still quite open.     Reason:   Lightsaber doesn't work without Star Wars physics. That is not how light works in the real world. The Force doesn't work in this universe. The Star Wars technical explanations retconned into the universe tried to explain the weird physics in the movies by stating "its a different universe"... which makes the star wars laser blasters more awesome if used in this universe (the light-"bolts" are now travelling at the speed of light), but most other things non-working.   So all the Jedi is left with is his fists and physical abilities (if you discount using that useless lightsaber as a short club...). Indie has his revolver and a whip which work just fine on earth.   You can add to that the fact that Indie is the main hero of its movies, and thus cannot loose unless the script says so, and cannot die, while there are many Jedis that get thrown under the bus with every movie, the Jedi has lost by default anyway as long as he is not one of the main characters. Even then, Darth Vader got killed, Obiwan got killed, many other main characters die in Star Wars. But this is now getting as far fetched as using the force or weird-physics driven tech on earth. Lets just say 6 bullets and a whip will beat some non-force-enhanced martial art tricks and a disfunctional lightsaber grip.     Now, that is totally silly. Given how Jedis are portrayed in THEIR universe, they should beat Indie everyday. But by transferring heros into the real world (what you did with your strength measurements), a lot of these story related powerlevels get messed up.   Given how Link is just an average guy in at least the Zelda Games I played, just with more guts than the average citizen, as well as some magical gimmicks, and Cloud is portrayed as some kind of enhanced supersoldier, who just gets overshadowed by even more ridicolously powerful beings running around in his universe, I'd say servants post is quite accurate with declaring cloud the winner. Different universes follow different laws of physics. If a guy can lift 100 tonnes in one, and nobody bats an eye (because your average dude lifts 50 tonnes without problems), and a guy lifts 0.5 tonnes in a universe with a more realistic physics outfit, the guy lifting the 0.5 tonnes would clearly be stronger COMPARED TO THEIR UNIVERSES AVERAGE, because the average dude would struggle lifting 0.1 tonnes.   What happens when you throw them together? Which universes rules are now active? Do they mix? How? How do characters function under a different universes rules?       I think most people responding where not offended at all by your posting... just as astonished as me how long a post you made about such a subject. :)     Kinda just copy an pasted some of it, so I didnt write all of it.   Never knew average men could push around 10 ton blocks. A enhanced super soldier who has feats no greater than links. In fictional sense, even gods arent impressive, some can destroy whole universes, others cant destroy even a town. Just because soldier sounds more impressive than farm boy, doesnt negate all of their feats. Other than a hand full of battles canonically, cloud is almost feat less, his arsenal as well is about 1/100th of links, batman might be just a human, but he has beaten people with godly like powers. Other than clouds movements and endurance, I dont see him any where near as powerful as link.      Okay, maybe I was writing to much, so you didn't got my point.   My point was:   If Hero A is godlike, but in his universe every citizen is godlike, so being godlike is the norm, while Hero B is just above average, but in his universe the average citizen is just average, Hero B is stronger relativ to the norm in his/her universe!   There is little point in trying to rip both out of their relative universes and put them into an arena without normalizing their powerlevels and equipment. If the average person in the Zelda universe pushes 10 tons easely (not saying it is like that, but given the toonish tone of the universe, that is not far off), pushing 10 tons is like pushing 50 kilos in reality. Its just average strength. While Cloud splitting concrete blocks would translate to an impressive amount of strength in the real world (and an impressively tough sword) given that the average person in FF7 wasn't able to do that, and that concrete in the FF7 universe is just as hard as it is in real life.   Now, I am NOT saying Cloud > Link in the strength department here. I have not enough knowledge of the newer Zelda games (though you sampling links feats from multiple games while cloud has a single game to show his powers also is kinda Oranges to Apples), and really, the whole thing would fill WAY more space than you did up there if we wanted to it proper. We would have to first set up the laws of physics and magic, relative strength of the Heros in the different universes compared to a comparable average person in the same universe, and rules on how to translate that to a common temporary universe before even starting to collect informations about the heros themselves.     All I am saying is: 1) Even with the proper process, this is going to be Apples to Oranges. 2) Without the proper process, you are comparing attributes not properly normalized. Its like comparing a candle in the night and a bright torch at daylight and calling the candle at night brighter.       Yes, a soldier in one story can be way less inpressive than a farmers son in another. Which kind of proves my point above. Disregarding this fact however, and looking at real life, a professional soldier (without being enhanced) will kick the crap out of a farmers son 99 times of 100.   There have been "farmers sons" in the past which did kick some professional soldiers ass. The swiss where quite feared in the early renaissance for doing just that while being not professional soldiers. But: they were more than just farmers. They had extensive training in the use of the pike, ranged weapons and whatever weapon else they could afford (certainly not swords, if you disregard the cheap short swords they used). They were basically part time soldiers, combining the strength and endurance built up as farmers in the mountains with the guts of people having nothing to loose (switzerland was quite poor by then) and some weapon training... while their enemies were professional soldiers, but badly paid and trained most of the times. And not yet adapted to some of the tricks the swiss were employing (the pike for example).   But part-time soldiers doing farming on the side beating professional soldier sometimes is =/= farmers boy without military training beating elite soldier (if we translate enhanced to just being the best of the best) every time.    Nah, its ten tons, not ten kilos, (i get your point) but  if they swapped universes cloud wouldnt have gotten through the first stage without his sword (pretty much 1 item). He'd be trying to figure out block, tackle and ropes to move the ten ton blocks, while if link was in the middle scene of zack who was killed only by a small platoon, they wouldn't have layed a single bullet on him with all his impenetrable enhancements.   I also get it, cloud has a likability in a more realistic scene...looks cool by dodging bullets, enforces an aggressive stance ect. But I dont over hype their ideal quality's, I just compare their overall statistics , and statistically link just dominates cloud to another degree of ownage.    Links raw strength written could bend the buster sword into a balloon animal, then punch clouds head off. Nuff said. 
  9. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

      Na, but if you start comparing characters from different universes, following different "laws of physics" or "magic systems", using sometimes utility gear as an indicator of combat power (never seen link smash any enemy in link to the past with his super gloves, how do we know it is even usable in combat?), we get into an "everything goes zone" that makes silly statements like mine... well, less silly.   Fact still stands that the telletubbies never lost to an opponent in open combat (and I guess not many people on this forum would have been able to stand to watch the mindboggling stupid tubbies long enough to find an episode that proves me wrong (probably one of the tubbies got beaten by a squirrel in one of them :))).     If you want a less silly, and more to the point comparison that shows how pointless this whole thing is:   A Jedi vs Indiana Jones. Jedi uses normal Jedi gear, so only lightsaber as weapon. Fight start at a distance. Fight is on earth...   Indiana wins (given his trusty revolver does not fail him).     If we shorten the distance, and take away Indis revolver, it is more of a fight. Still quite open.     Reason:   Lightsaber doesn't work without Star Wars physics. That is not how light works in the real world. The Force doesn't work in this universe. The Star Wars technical explanations retconned into the universe tried to explain the weird physics in the movies by stating "its a different universe"... which makes the star wars laser blasters more awesome if used in this universe (the light-"bolts" are now travelling at the speed of light), but most other things non-working.   So all the Jedi is left with is his fists and physical abilities (if you discount using that useless lightsaber as a short club...). Indie has his revolver and a whip which work just fine on earth.   You can add to that the fact that Indie is the main hero of its movies, and thus cannot loose unless the script says so, and cannot die, while there are many Jedis that get thrown under the bus with every movie, the Jedi has lost by default anyway as long as he is not one of the main characters. Even then, Darth Vader got killed, Obiwan got killed, many other main characters die in Star Wars. But this is now getting as far fetched as using the force or weird-physics driven tech on earth. Lets just say 6 bullets and a whip will beat some non-force-enhanced martial art tricks and a disfunctional lightsaber grip.     Now, that is totally silly. Given how Jedis are portrayed in THEIR universe, they should beat Indie everyday. But by transferring heros into the real world (what you did with your strength measurements), a lot of these story related powerlevels get messed up.   Given how Link is just an average guy in at least the Zelda Games I played, just with more guts than the average citizen, as well as some magical gimmicks, and Cloud is portrayed as some kind of enhanced supersoldier, who just gets overshadowed by even more ridicolously powerful beings running around in his universe, I'd say servants post is quite accurate with declaring cloud the winner. Different universes follow different laws of physics. If a guy can lift 100 tonnes in one, and nobody bats an eye (because your average dude lifts 50 tonnes without problems), and a guy lifts 0.5 tonnes in a universe with a more realistic physics outfit, the guy lifting the 0.5 tonnes would clearly be stronger COMPARED TO THEIR UNIVERSES AVERAGE, because the average dude would struggle lifting 0.1 tonnes.   What happens when you throw them together? Which universes rules are now active? Do they mix? How? How do characters function under a different universes rules?       I think most people responding where not offended at all by your posting... just as astonished as me how long a post you made about such a subject. :)     Kinda just copy an pasted some of it, so I didnt write all of it.   Never knew average men could push around 10 ton blocks. A enhanced super soldier who has feats no greater than links. In fictional sense, even gods arent impressive, some can destroy whole universes, others cant destroy even a town. Just because soldier sounds more impressive than farm boy, doesnt negate all of their feats. Other than a hand full of battles canonically, cloud is almost feat less, his arsenal as well is about 1/100th of links, batman might be just a human, but he has beaten people with godly like powers. Other than clouds movements and endurance, I dont see him any where near as powerful as link. 
  10. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

      How does that work? You cant compare them, yet you wanna state one is superior to the other? That to me doesn't make sense, it just sounds as if the one you want to win, doesn't really have a argument in how it supersedes the one you want him to win against.     I did point out his strengths, he can cut debris, he also can endure alot of punishment before going down. Fast in movement ect. But soo that as enoug to beat someone who has more advantages.    Memories is one thing, experience is another.    The magic is useless in clouds case, because link has various combos of defensive artillery that nullifies almost 90% of his magic, and link has his own magic which cloud is not immune to.    
  11. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

      If I could give you a +1, I totally would.   Lets compare Apples and Oranges, because WHY THE HELL NOT? Next, Teletubbies vs Kratos. Teletubbies win, because they have never been defeated in their TV Shows!       @ Smoooth:   You signed up just to post this?     So one has to lose to be comparable? Nah, was just surfin through and felt like being a part of it, you know...if you check the lounge, theres some 100's of threads made that went unanswered or no replys, perhaps you could spruce all  of there threads up as well and ask them why did they post there...surely it will aid their questions in a categorize section called... the lounge...but if it bothers you that much, you can ask the mods to shut it down. Wouldnt bother me...what I find interesting is, the other poster ended with a note of...     How does that work? You cant compare them, yet you wanna state one is superior to the other? That to me doesn't make sense, it just sounds as if the one you want to win, doesn't really have a argument in how it supersedes the one you want him to win against.  
  12. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

          I understand that, but one has power (Cloud) and one has power...and...strength..(Link)   Could you show an extension of clouds destructive power to match this?   Lets compare destructive power: Punching boulders to bits: Blow up 1,000 ton stone walls just as big as the debris cloud is cutting with bomb arrows: Slicing a building sized stone to pieces with his sword: Physical strength, throwing a a 20,000 ton monster: Fierce diety killing twin mold:               Which he usually gets punched more times than he lands anything, also lacks any power and strength as he hits them more than several times, links punching power can put cloud down in one punch.                Yet but an all powerful being with no feats, is still a being with no feats. Cloud is not sephiroth nor has been shown doing the things sephiroth can do.   Half of clouds life as a kid he was in an orphanage:       Half of links young life he was already killing 100 ton monsters         Young link has a record of killing at-least 30 different bosses and hundreds of random battles before cloud even picks up a sword.         This comes from clouds materia, canonically he doesnt use it, but since this is composite link, its only fair to let him use all of it...which cloud still loses because all of them are close range base. Unlike link who can kill cloud from a 100 feet out. And the summons can be killed, bahamut is killed by cloud. Dont see how cloud is carrying around alot of his items either, canonically cloud has no item shrinking device, he cant even carry all the materia in the movie, yufi has to carry them in a large chest. So cloud wont have accesses to any of his eithers, elixirs, and hero drinks to restore his magic. Link has all his stuff because his old school version showed how he kept his inventory in a size reality warping bag:         Hence link can have over a hundred items in his small bag, 2 foot bows, 3 foot shields, bombs, swords or anything.        Curbstomp would need a hefty amount of advantages to say the least, link can kill cloud over a 100 different ways having a hundred different things in his arsenal, cloud can only kill link several different ways aside from his sword. And lightning? Link has holy rings that absorbs lightning, and a mirror shield that can bounce it back, and a goron which is rock element that can nullify it, and a much more powerful lightning medallion that covers a farther radius.     Plus link could just dodge it, cloud is portrayed fast by dodging bullets, but link dodges arrows, plasma, lightning and lasers.   Aghanim and Yuga shoot lightning at link which he dodges and in every game the enemy beamos shoots lasers at him which link dodges. Lasers are as fast as light, light is the speed in any form and is constant. Cloud hasnt that much speed, probably a little faster than the fastest human, but most of his movements are agility and dexterity based, which allows him or atleast zack to dodge bullets and bullet time.     Link without the bunny hood is still around 30 mph at full speed and jumps 30 feet in the air:     The roc's feather make link jump 3x the nromal distance:   The jump spell can make link jump 3x as high:   Slap on the pegasus boots, roc feather, roc cape for gliding and jump spell, and you can triple those base stats.    http://zelda.wikia.com/wiki/Roc's_Cape   So link is now able to keep up with the superhuman movements of cloud. One could argue cloud is slightly the farther jumper, but link has the fairy spell which allows him to fly, in game you can fly over 100's of feet worth over lava:   So no matter what terrain, link can travel any distance or height. unlike cloud who is limited to height, he couldnt even jump high enough to each bahamut sin, the team had to catapult him up.                  A omnislash is just cloud focusing all his speed and agility into a consecutive attack of repetitive blows, nayrus love, staff of byrna, magic armor, and the hylian shield all can deflect it. Link has a similar move, the tri force slash. Unlike clouds move where the person isnt really paralyzed, links move makes the opponent unmovable:   http://www.ssbwiki.com/Triforce_Slash           I'm pretty sure some of links allies would give cloud a run for his money, like gorons:     - Darunia a ten ton goron who can smash and tunnule through mountains thick rock - Impa a super assassin - Midna a reality warper - Zelda a power house wizard and ninja   Its not so much that they are weak, its villains like zant, majora, ganandorf and others are either reality warpers or deity's and demi gods who cant be killed unless they have specific weapons of holy stature to defeat them, if you dont have kryptonite, red sun or magic, theres almost no other way your gona beat superman. Unlike FF7 bosses, who if they are just continually attacked they can be killed with no divine like weapons needed, via sephiroth is killed by just one ordinary sword combo landing on him, genesis gets almost put down by a piece of a sword brushing against him, zack gets killed by a large platoon.   I'm pretty sure its a fact most games differ in bosses and enemies: http://zelda.wikia.com/wiki/Boss   Link fights mostly all of them solo, if he wasn't good at it, he would not have triumphed, if cloud didn't have his allies he would have not a have triumphed, Vincent valentine is proof of that.              Nice quote, but link has:   - The muscle (10-100 ton without any enhancements moving blocks in every carnation) - The brains (tactical fighter constantly looking for his enimies weaknesses) - The will power (tri-force of courage) - The arsenal (over a 100 useful things in combat) - The variety (can kill cloud better in more places than land, via in lava, under water, in the sky ect) - Has the experience and skill ( was actually trained and defeated bosses solo more often)           1.) Take away the mako, and take away all links arsenal, and link is still vastly stronger and has wits, I back the hyrulian farm boy with crazy strength. 2.) Liked reading of the game creativity here and thought it could be spruced up with one more cool thread.     
  13. Smooothhh

    Death battle Link vs Cloud Round 2?

    Long range, I dont see cloud doing much damage, since his equipment is just a sword, he will have to rely on magic alone, which the only use of his materia is green materia: http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Magic_Materia_(Final_Fantasy_VII) Which the only offence he has with long range spells is, fire/ice/earth/lightning...all four which are not effecting link because of his holy rings which nullifys elemental base attacks, and will be reflected back to cloud by his spell reflect, or by the mirror shield. Ultima/gravity/commet, can all be guarded with the staff of byrna and somaria: 1 does a impenetrable shield around link, and the other makes a giant indestructible block of energy in which link can stand behind. The rest of the green materia are only recovery effects, and not offence long range attacks on link, in which links combos of defense, pretty much makes the little 8 spells of clouds useless. As for link, he has various long range methods of attack, he is an expert bow man: Fire/ice/light/harpoon/silver/bombs: Which the bomb arrows were basically medieval rocket launchers of its time, Link also has 3 medallions that cause lightning storms, fills an entire radius with bomb explosions, and earth quakes which also polymorphs:  Link has 4 other rods, the fire rod, ice rod, water rod and sand rod, with the power to control sand: He could literally command sand and water to be rushed into any opening of clouds face, filling his body with so much sand/water that he implodes.  For mid range link has the boomerang, deku nuts for stunning, sling shot and hook shot for retrieving, getting to higher places, and offence. Toped in with dins fire along with all the rods, another mid range item he can use the ball and chain: Along with several variations of wind/gust boomerangs, magical gust pots, and other gadgets of mid range weapons: http://www.mtv.com/news/2019040/legend-zelda-items-ranked/ So it kinda shows that cloud with a few green orb materias and his only other weapon sword have no basis or mid to long range against link which is another disadvantage.  Its basically this: vs  All of this: Which means: - Long range link has the advantage of killing cloud about 40 different ways - Mid range link has the advantage of killing cloud in about 30 ways - Close range link has the advantage being physically stronger/durable But long range wise, cloud could technically use his green materia and heal him self with, cure/heal/recovery ect, but these take up alot of magic, even his ethers and elixirs will run out far before links arsenal does. Link too has recovery potions too if some miracle damage was inflected upon link, he needs but one ring, the heart ring: Which as long as hes alive his health steadily restores, like a auto regen. If his magic runs low, link can always use the romanis magic milk, which gives link unlimited magic for 3 days, which I dought the fight will last longer than an hour. Unto the last of their spells, cloud has, haste/stop/slow/death...death never works on bosses and has less than 50% rate on enemies, his time magic last but only a turn or two, which are only temporary, and if not weak because they only can be casted close range and on 1-3 people at a time. Link has similar time magic or mystical powers, his ocarina is so powerful if he plays these ancient songs the time magic effects the entire world, from slowing it down, or speeding it up, useful in both maintaining cloud at a slower pace, or if cloud has heavy damage and is bleeding much like sephiroths fight, speeding up time can make cloud bleed out in a matter of seconds.  Again, clouds haste/slow ect is temporary in two ways, one being it last for only a moment, and secondly he can run out of magic. Links time or speed enhancing doesn't have this problem his bunny hood which doubles his speed and agility last as long as hes wearing it and doesn't consume magic: Fast as cloud is as a bullet timer, link faces a foe name beamos in every game that shoots lasers, hence dodging laser beams would take alot more dexterity and agility Along with the Pegasus boots x roc feather, rocs cape, jump spell and hoover boots link can be an aerial fighter like cloud is in advent children:     Pretty much the cape allows for much farther jumps and gliding, if matching clouds jumping movements wasnt enough, link can go one step further and fly using the fairy spell. So... - Jumping, aerial fighting advantage goes to = Link - Magic and mystical enchantments in recovery goes to = link - Speed, agility and maneuverability goes to = link   Finally the summons, cloud has a variety of summons, but these things are actually killable in almost all final fanatsy games, kefka kills the espers in 6, in 7 cloud kills bahamut sin, 8 squall defeats ifrit and seifer kills odin, in 10 all the aeons are killable. Hence link can kill them with the right combo of defence and attack.  Ifrit wont do anything to the goron mask, as gorons live in valcanoes, walk through and tank lava, and get shot out of vulcans 100s of miles away and live under water. Since gorons are made of rock, ramuhs lightning has no effect on rock base attacks. So the goron would punch ifrit and ramuh to death much like he punches boulders to nothingness.  Goron >>> Ifrit and ramuh Same with leviathan, the zoras mask could swim right through its tidal wave and then kill leveithan with its impenetrable shock aura. Zora >>> Leviathan The three bahanmuts, regular bahamut, zero and nero, would all attack at once 3 beams to the mirror shield and the mirror shield will focus a much stronger attack of it back at them, killing them all in one counter attack.  Mirror shield >>> 3 Bahanmuts Shiva and Titan will be burned to death as both ice and earth is weak to fire. Fire rod/dins-fire/bombo-medallion >>> Shiva/Titan The chocobo summon can be countered with calling both epona and the giant owl, a horses kick is much more effective than a birds peck...and the owl will be distracting the moogle at the same time.  Epona > Chocobo Alexander can be killed with the giants mask, and megaton hammer, alexander is basically a castle that shoots beams, gaint link will be demolishing this castle to rubble.  Giants mask >>> Alexander The one shotters, odin and hades, odin was killed by siefer without even moving, link can kill him with any of his holy swords and link is protected by death from various light defense, byrna is a mystical light Light>> dark/evil, he also has the cross and light arrows to kill either or.  Light arrows/byrna/cross >>> Odin/hades And for clouds rest if he wants to call all his summons at once, link can summon as well, the four giants, who are so large they can jump over a mountain in one leap, something not even godzilla can do. They are so strong they can hold up a moon for several hours.  They would kick around clouds summons like foot balls. The heaviest hitter in FF7 is the knights of the round, legend sin the making...but that still falls short of links fierce deity's mask, which a deity is a god, and  A male deity is a god https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deity fierce firs/ adjective having or displaying an intense or ferocious aggressiveness. "as women, we need to accept that we can be fierce, cunning, and predatory" synonyms: ferocious, savage, vicious, aggressive More (of a feeling, emotion, or action) showing a heartfelt and powerful intensity. "he kissed her with a fierce, demanding passion" synonyms: aggressive, cutthroat, competitive; More (of the weather or temperature) powerful and destructive in extent or intensity. "fierce storms lashed the country" synonyms: powerful, strong, violent, forceful; More Link is a fierce god. https://www.google.com/search?q=fierce+deity+link+cuts+the+moon+in+half&biw=1270&bih=625&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjP2fKp2v3MAhXBLmMKHZgJDjcQ_AUIBSgA&dpr=1#q=fierce Who fierce deity link pretty much takes out every boss in majors mask in two shakes, and kills majora a reality warper like nothing. His powers all over zelda history is near planet buster.  - Links summons vs Clouds summons Winner = Link
  14. With hundreds of forums and blogs reviewing the death battle out come, I figure I post a thread about it too an point some stuff out too: http://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/gym-leader-challenge-sora-vs-link-1758106/ http://board8.wikia.com/wiki/Cloud_Strife_vs_Link_vs_Mario_vs_Samus_Aran_vs_Sephiroth_vs_Solid_Snake_2006 But it seems there are alot of people who disagree, and think cloud should have won. So do you think death battle should do a round 2 with both all their items like they did recently with their superman vs goku 2 and include more stuff? Who do these two characters resemble? Cloud resembles Captain america: Cloud/Cap's similarities - Both Have their powers from a super serum (mako energy) - Fast - Powerful - Can jump real high Link resembles Thor: - Both have hammers (Link has megaton hammer) - Like thors belt of strength (link has his power gloves) - Both can call forth storms (song of storms and thunder medallion)  - Both can fly (Link fairy spell) - Both can time travel (Hero of time/ocarina) Along with alot of other things too that are similar. But the biggest thing that most people who supports cloud say is, cloud is ridiculously stronger. Physical strength and power go hand in hand, and dont necessarily mean the same thing, I have searched all of clouds, movies, mangas, games, spin offs and yet to see a cutt scene or it written down anywhere that he is above 1 ton, cutting falling concrete debris in advent children is powerful, but then again, humans have karate competitions breaking concrete blocks with their hands. If any one does find a strength feat, please post it. So lets to a fast show case of links strength, I know these are just fictional things, but death battle did a interesting size comparison/estimation, and it seemed accurate: This huge boulder (it weighs one ton) ended up being a table in an outdoor living area we’re currently creating in Pasadena…and we didn’t even know we needed a table in this space. - http://www.pottedstore.com/tag/sunburst-decorative-rock/ What a 1,000 ton stone looks like: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1333403/Brute-force-Huge-1-000-ton-boulder-carried-mountainside-power-Icelandic-volcano.html Links strength: Pushing/grabbing/throwing/pulling - At base 10 tons (moves blocks and throws gorons) - Titan mits 50 tons - Power bracelet 100 tons - Silver gauntlets 500 tons - Golden gauntlets 1,000 tons (or strength to move mountains) - Giants mask 20,000 tons (throws twinmold who is longer than godzilla) Lifting ten tons over his head four twelve year olds pushing 100 ton objects Adult link pushing 100 tons with no enhancers Kid link lifting a 100 tons over his head Silver gauntlets pushing 500 tons Golden gauntlets lifting and throwing 1,000 tons Twinmold: Punching/smashing/crushing/slicing + Experts ring makes links punches equivalent to a bomb + Toss ring doubles the gloves strength (thats two mountains) + Red ring doubles links sword power + Hammer and magical hammer busts boulders larger than link + The handy glove ups links power breaks blocks and busts through shields + Slices a metal 100 ton 8 armed monster to pieces http://zeldawiki.org/Magic_Ring So in comparing their strengths: - Cloud = 1 tonner at best due to the mako enhancements - Has no hand to hand or punching feats - Has memories from zack, but was never in soldier - Rely's solely on his sword with out it he has no feats + Link at base is 10-100 tonner, enhanced hes 500-1,000 tonner + Link has the experts ring which make his punches equal to a bomb + Has training from various teachers, from gorons/swordsmen/knights/ + Fights 90% of average foes and bosses solos So I think cloud might be out gunned in the physical strength department.   Its a shame technology and graphical power wasn't invented in zeldas prime years of its first creation out of the 2 bit era, heres some of the original art of link which showed back in his day he would have been seen similar to that of Kratos: (Nintendo powers original concept art of link back in the late 80s) Link might look tooney in wind waker, soft in spirit tracks, and a regular in skyward sword, but link in his prime years was a monster butcher'er like god of war in his 2 bit days of legend of zelda and links adventure. Cloud doesnt seem all that durable, he is suspect to being cut open by what looks like a sword 7 feet long, but only about 2 inches in width: Although impressive and powerful. The entire final fantasy cast actually isn't durable to the contact of swords, angeal gets put down by only a piece of a sword a foot long breaking ricocheting and cutting his arm: - Sephiroth is imapaled, and killed by several sword slashes  - Aeirth is killed by being imapled by this same 2 inch thick sword - Cloud is impaled by it - Gensis is cut open by s weaker sword Cloud was also rescued by Vincent valentine from nearly being killed. And cloud is actually not the strongest in his universe, in final fantasy tactics, his soldier class is weaker than the holy/dark knights, temple knights, arc knights, rune, ect and would lose in a 1 on 1 against agrias izlude, gafgarion, agrias, beowulf and killed 10/10 times by thunder god cid. If we go even further out to his multiverse of Final fantasy, cloud ranks much lower compared to Terra, squall, tidus ect.  Cloud also needs help from his team when Link goes into 100s of battles solo. While in links universe, he is the uncontested but still goes up against reality warpers like zant, the magician, majora, ganon ect. So in the durability department, link is quite a bit better as well, he does afterall have almost every immunity just from his 50+ different rings to magical attacks like ice/fire/water/earth/ along with having the other rings which amplifys his attack power 10 folds, and increases his defensive durability another 10 folds: So to where cloud is sort of only a one trick pony with his sword: Link has quite the defensive power combo with his gear: Cloud does have a variety of swords, but none really differ in enchantments, they just range by increasing his weapon strength or adds more slots for materia, links swords on the other hand have a massive range of purposes and mystical enhancements, from calling hundreds of life restoring faeries, to swords that kill phantoms and other undeadly beings, to razor sharp, super big, strength enhanced and even the power to split link into four separate foes to tag team his enemy: Cloud carries around a set of different materia and a sword, to where link carries around an arsenal of weapons and defensive items in his reality size warping bag. Links super soldier mako poising movements, in jumping high and basic materia can be matched by links basic spells he knows as well: Link has so much in his arsenal, he probably has more than bat man and iron man combined. So durability wise: - Cloud gets cut sliced/impaled/bleeds by a 2 inch width sword - Link never bled, has a shield and sword that can deflect and reflect magic Both have capabilities of breathing under the water, link has the blue tunic and the zora ring, and cloud has a materia that allows him to breath under water, but is he any good under water? His swimming is novice at best, while links gear besides just protecting him, he has a vast variety of all weather/terrain gear, hes a good fighter on land and his zora armor makes him a under water ninja: To even a water demon that has a impenetrable shield: A white armor formed by the red ring which amps his defense: A fire tunic to sheath against fiery temputures: And walk through lava with his goron mask: To a mirror shield that reflects magic back at his foes: To a temporary indestructable armor: So because of his massive defensive inventory: - Has the advantage of in the water - Has the advantage of wrestling him into lava - In a hit for hit competition can absorb more damage - Has better durability, endurance, recovery and stamina if hit - Tank all his physical shots and magic with shields So physical strength, and durability goes to link   Who do you all think will win?
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