Leveling and Attributes in an RPG

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14 comments, last by studentTeacher 10 years, 7 months ago

From my experience, watching a bunch of numbers get higher is not very exciting. When I level up, I want some new toys to play with.

By toys I mean: special abilities, spells, weapons etc. Things that provide more meaning and utility to my character than raw numbers.

Even better, ensure that there are a wealth of synergies and interactions between those abilities. Designing a 'build' and watching it come together over the course of the game, testing it out each step of the way, can be a motivator in itself.

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Thinking about 'luck' attribute mentioned....

Those game systems with 'open ended' rolls mechanics (both for good and bad results ie- 'Fumble Table' ).

They resulted in quite memorable happening in some playing sessions (ones I remember decades later)

Most of the game operates using the mundane standard rules : player skills enabling ability and then efficiency, tool quality etc...

but once in a while spectacular results (with some systems having a progressive magnitude mechanism)

--------------------------------------------[size="1"]Ratings are Opinion, not Fact

From my experience, watching a bunch of numbers get higher is not very exciting. When I level up, I want some new toys to play with.

By toys I mean: special abilities, spells, weapons etc. Things that provide more meaning and utility to my character than raw numbers.

Even better, ensure that there are a wealth of synergies and interactions between those abilities. Designing a 'build' and watching it come together over the course of the game, testing it out each step of the way, can be a motivator in itself.

Cool idea. This is actually a really good foundation for how to implement a GOOD system that has tons of attributes...

A system can be designed where you gain abilities for leveling up a specific set of attributes to a certain number.

I.E.:

Ability: Egg Throw

requires : Aim : lvl 10 || Cooking: lvl 2

Ability:Catch Fish In Water

Agility: 2

Strength: 15

Farming: 10

Actually ... now that I think about it, this is pretty much what final fantasy tactics did, only in a superfluous way: using jobs instead of attributes.

Posted Today, 03:57 AM

Let me address you first! Sorry for the vagueness of the post, I'm still learning how to make a really well done post, but here we go.

First, overall level is (1) a time to gain new abilities and get EXP points spread over your attributes, (2) probably going to become the "trust" factor, along with fame and heroism or such. (3) is also a way to raise some things that you don't want players to raise themselves, like health (which I would like to have control over, rather than the player. Too much health can't be a good thing; I mean, you are only human or some race like it....).

Not plausible and too "mundane". Hunger management is better covered by physiological traits ("efficient digestion", "can eat rotten meat", "can digest cellulose", etc. and healing related ones like "fast regeneration").
Cooking can be a profitable and useful crafting skill. Or maybe not, depending on the game's tone and priorities.

For cooking, I'm finding it more likely to be (1) something to sell, (2) something that can, like you said, cause faster regen, or longer saturation (food keeps you full longer), and more traits that are more noticeable. Because part of the game, especially the early game, will be survival, food is important to that.

All standard stats, except aim. Traditionally, precise aiming is subsumed into normal attack ability as an option to increase attack roll difficulty.
If you want a special skill for precisely aimed attacks, adding another, opposite special skill for making all-out quick and/or powerful attacks might be a good idea (it's a meaningful axis of specialization and differentiation).

I'm thinking of instead of aim, a ranged attack stat, as it rises, can take random factors out of their shots. By that, I mean if there's wind, or something else hindering perfect performance, a higher ranged stat can lower the effect of wind.

Speed might increase with skill, but not luck; searching rubble isn't exactly difficult.
I wonder what sort of tools might require a qualified expert digger: even explosives can be part of universal basic training.
Instead, magical digging implements could be very expensive, requiring a wealthy (presumably experienced) character.

Maybe luck is the wrong word...I mean something more towards getting all that diamond in the rock, or the purity/size of the pieces you get from it. Inexperienced players might lose some (say 25%) of the ores they mine because of experience, while higher levels get exactly what they see. I'm trying to stay away from magic for now, as I like more....realistic results, but bombs, explosives, and other such tools are definitely going in the game. As for your magical example, I'd better choose maybe automation/machinery? I'm going for a more steam-punk feel I guess.

You need something specific to do with them; eating rate isn't very flexible (a person needs to match calories to exertion, regardless of endurance).
Endurance can be useful for forced marches or other abnormal extended efforts.

Possibly use endurance for charging between special abilities/attacks, or long travel distances before resting is needed?

Can these be economically competitive and fun player character jobs? If not, consider making them NPC jobs (potentially major money sinks) and/or giving a basic competence at these tasks to all PCs.

Like cooking, farming would be something to do in the beginning, and automate / pass to NPC's in the later game. Building and engineering would allow you to apply yourself the the future of a group of NPC's -- allowing the player to help design a town, or add personal touches to their world.

What about magic other than alchemy? Wouldn't it have its separate skills?
Mundane chemistry, like farming or engineering, might be too mundane to have a role.

But chemistry that heads towards better weapons and tech (electronics, measurements, etc) can be useful! At least, I think so now.....

Can it be competitive with enchanted or high tech weapons? Having senior blacksmiths be the sole source of enchanted weapons might be a good trick to make blacksmiths relevant, and to force typical players to make their own weapons.

You hit it right on the head there. In the later game, I'm thinking of maybe your expertise in a field can resonate in the NPC's you hire; so if you are competent at black-smithing, then so will your blacksmiths you hire. Maybe you can gain a substantially small amount of exp from your NPC's working, or even have exp for NPC's as well; the longer you keep an NPC around doing a job for you, the better they get at it, and you also gain a little experience from it too.

Highly vague. How can a generic character benefit from findings and discoveries? How good are "obsolete" technologies and items when technology advances? (For example, how easily can guns catch up with magic wands of fireballs?)

Again, trying to avoid magic for now smile.png For "obsolete" tech, I think things like wood, stone, and such will be expendable; they are there to get you through the beginning. Later in the game however, different tech will be used for different things; e.g. you can use electricity for lighting instead of torches, but coal might be good for, say, making some materials, or even diamonds (carbon FTW!) tongue.png

A completely meaningless stat, with no gameplay effect whatsoever. Consider instead letting players spend luck points permanently to save their characters (cheat death, succeed automatically at crucial die rolls, etc.)

I LIKE THIS IDEA! I might want to think of something along those lines. I also might have the player spend stats on NPC's abilities rather than their own, too.

How would this be important?

(in response to clothing, leather, etc.)

Maybe a tannery?

Learn how to weave clothing, how to create leather to use for armour? Or to end up, in the later game, spending this all on NPC's to do this for you? Not entirely sold on this one myself...but I see some usefulness...

From my experience, watching a bunch of numbers get higher is not very exciting. When I level up, I want some new toys to play with.

By toys I mean: special abilities, spells, weapons etc. Things that provide more meaning and utility to my character than raw numbers.

Even better, ensure that there are a wealth of synergies and interactions between those abilities. Designing a 'build' and watching it come together over the course of the game, testing it out each step of the way, can be a motivator in itself.

There are definitely things to gain from upping levels! Like once at lvl 10 for a weapon attribute, you can begin learning special attacks, or spending your levels on your special attack options. Certain levels can have you learn new tech, or raise the damage you do, or your ability to block certain attacks. And synergies are planned, in the same way fr0st2k displayed...certain weapons, attacks, etc. require certain levels in your stats.

Thinking about 'luck' attribute mentioned....

Those game systems with 'open ended' rolls mechanics (both for good and bad results ie- 'Fumble Table' ).

They resulted in quite memorable happening in some playing sessions (ones I remember decades later)

Most of the game operates using the mundane standard rules : player skills enabling ability and then efficiency, tool quality etc...

but once in a while spectacular results (with some systems having a progressive magnitude mechanism)

I'm thinking of sticking to standard rules, but you have a slight chance of getting something extraordinary. Maybe you only get ordinary loot mid-game, but at one point you might get lucky and get some legendary armour from a battle long ago! Well, I'll have to flesh the system out. :D I know what you mean though, and that feeling could be very good for the game!

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