Hey

So I'm not a complete expert but I'll give you my two cents for fun.

Java is a great programming notation, although it has lots of outdated libraries, some of them are still useful.

The answer to your question lies within what your goals are: If you want a programming notation that allows for

RAM addressing and copying of all objects by value, bit by bit, then obviously C++ is the way to go. If you want

something maybe a little faster than Java and/or something that can compile to x64 then Python or Cython are

probably good choices. If you want something that can be used to create internet applications, in browsers,

but has more organization and easier to use than the weaker notations, Javascript, then go with Java.

My personal recommendation is Java+ Jython and C++. Hopefully someday something a bit more ideal

than C++ will come around, but as of now there is only Python, Cython and C++ for using C libraries, which

are the root of OpenGL and Vulkan commands, as far as I know. Actually, on second thought I believe there

are a few more, maybe something like that lisp. There are also a few newer notations like Clojure and Kotlin,

but those both compile to Java Virtual Machine codes too.

Java is compiled, although it compiles to something that then gets run through an interpreter, but it is

thought to run nearly as fast as C++, at about 1.1x the speed. I found this data in Killer Game Programming,

near the beginning of the book, its an O'rielly book with a wild cat on the cover.

C++ is a bit less than perfect, as somethings require some extra lexicons compared juxtapose to other notations. but,

C++ is certainly the most prominent notation today, arguably the very most important of all. I believe this may change, but

for now that is how I see it.

Thanks

Because I read very good critics to python and advices against C to beginner programmers.

If you know neither C nor Python, the choice is easier to make. In your case, as you know some C, switching to a new language is an extra step that doesn't immediately give you anything game-related.

On the longer term, Python is probably going to be simpler to use, in C you have to write a lot of additional code that you get provided with Python without any effort.

Another point of doubts is if I choose LUA because it has also good critics.

Lua is typically used embedded into another program, and not much as stand-alone language. Com[ared with Python, Lua is super simple, also known as "minimal". There is only one data structure, namely table, and it's used for literally everything. It has no class system by default (but you can make your own). Great for small scripts / snippets, which you typically get if you hook high-level callbacks into a surrounding program, a bit limited if you want to write a complete program, and learn about the various data structures.

Evidently I am not going to program directly in one or other, I prefer to be in that looks to be its more promising frameworks: PyGame and Love2d

I don't know Love2d, but for PyGame, there isn't much framework. You pretty soon start providing your own logic in normal Python code (which makes sense of course, a generic framework can't do your logic).

Besides that, if you want to understand programming it's more useful to understand the plain programming language as well, as that makes life a lot easier to predict what code is going to do.

An example: how to compile, what's the IDE, etc.

Neither Lua nor Python need an explicit compile step, it's just "save & run". It does compilation along the way, but pretty much instantly, so you won't even notice it happens.

Python comes with an IDE called Idle. There are many more though, a search engine can find them for you :p I use a plain text editor and a shell.

I don't know if Lua has an IDE of its own, likely there exist IDEs for the language, given the popularity. I use the same plain text editor and the same shell for Lua too :)

Not many mentions for html5 based gaming & javascript, any reason?

For me, I know nothing about it, so can't compare it really. However, it seems the primary language used in web games, so studting it seems like a good idea, especially if you want to do browser games.

... it`s only that I seek about Idle and feel disappointed because in wikipedia is said to not support GUIs ...

What does "a GUI" mean to you?

An IDE is basically an fancy editor, with some tricks. It knows how to run a Python file for example, perhaps it can also display errors reported by Python, it may be able to rename variables, etc, but basically it's a way to enter your program.

Wikipedia claims "lack of ..general user interface design" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IDLE_(Python)

Note that "user interface design" there means a graphical program with windows, pop-ups, drop-downs, and menus, etc.

The claim means that you can program a Gui using Idle (an IDE is just a fancy way to write Python code), but Idle does not help you with extra tools. Thus if you want to make such a program, with lots of interactive fill-in forms, and reports, and popups and other dialogues, Idle is likely not the right tool for you.

This is however not a problem. While commercial software normally gives you 1 solution to a problem, open source software (such as Python and Lua), typically give you between 3 and several dozen solutions. Editors are definitely in the latter category, and "a few dozen" is probably an underestimation.

Python itself gives you Idle (if only to make sure you do have at least one way to edit a Python program), but nobody prevents you from finding and using a better IDE ("better" here means better to you). python.org likely has a list, and even Wikipedia provides a list (and if you look for 5 seconds at the Internet, you'll find even more lists).

Personally, I never even considered using Idle, as I like my gvim editor too much (but you may not, it has a very steep learning curve).

Just have a look at a few, and pick one that you like (and if you later find out it's not any good, ditch it, and find another that's better.

Note that programming PyGame will work fine even in Idle, as pygame only provides a rectangular area for you to draw on (see also below for a more detailed discussion), it doesn't have dropdowns, popups etc (unless you make them yourself).

Sadly, I dont understand the paragraph: "don't know Love2d, but for PyGame, there isn't much framework. ..generic framework can't do your logic"

When you use pygame, you get a program that displays a window. You get notifications that the user clicked the "close program" button, or moved the mouse, or clicked a mouse button, or pressed a key. The window is black, unless you paint rectangles, lines, or text in it. You can also display image files.

The decision what to draw, and where, or how to react on a mouse click or a pressed key, is your game logic. For example, I have a pygame program running where I track time, so it has code that catches mouse clicks, and then changes some time variables. In your code, a mouse click may mean to go left, or to remove the thing you clicked, so you'll have different code (different logic) than my pygame program.

All this logic is just normal Python code. Using a framework does not mean you won't write normal code. The framework just gives you some additional functions so you don't have to write them.

but Im not saying who is right or not, only that other people consider framework this (probably beginner like me in this case)

Did you read my reply on open source providing you with a lot of solutions for any problem that you may have?

Guess what, that also applies to frameworks.

There are a lot of solutions, and people can only point them out for you. You'll have to decide yourself. I can't tell you much, as I have no experience other than with PyGame. You may not consider that a good framework, and that's fine. Your proiblem is likely different from mine.

Just have a look at some frameworks, download a few, and try them. If you like them, keep them for further exploration. If you hate them, throw them away and find better ones.

Not sure if this topic is still relevant, but I'll just toss this here:

http://haxe.org/ using the framework http://kha.tech/

In short - Haxe is a language very similar to Flash's Actionscript and Java in syntax. It compiles to other languages though, including C++, Javascript, C#, Java, Python, PHP etc.

For game development, this is handy. The Kha framework (and other ones in the language's ecosystem) compiles the source code to Javascript for HTML5/WebGL, or C++ for all desktop and mobile platforms. Currently, this means 1 codebase gives you all these targets, and they run in a native way - the only overhead is an implemented garbage collector for the C++ target, but this is less than a VM.

It also does some cool stuff that transforms your shaders written in GLSL, to target specific shaders. Basically, for many parts of the development process, you truly write once, deploy everywhere.

I think it's definitely worth a look, I use it for my own projects!

P.