Don't forget the entire image of "Caveman clubbing cavegirl on head"
What interests me is how you are balancing the intent of what could seem humour based actions i;e; tickle to death or torture by farting with the more serious actions such as cannibalism or rape (yes I noted you were dispensing with it). What I mean by this is how would I as a player be expected to react? Is there a deliberate step into satire for the game?
Crusader Kings 2 is full of so called misogyny.... no big deal.
Just put what you think should be in the game and don't worry about PC.
What interests me is how you are balancing the intent of what could seem humour based actions i;e; tickle to death or torture by farting with the more serious actions such as cannibalism or rape (yes I noted you were dispensing with it). What I mean by this is how would I as a player be expected to react? Is there a deliberate step into satire for the game?
tickle to death and live with mother in law were just a joke.
the basic list is:
kill, followed by optional eat
torture, for whatever reason or none at all
sexually assault
enslave
the previous version, being more of a god game like the sims vs a FPS/RPG like Skyrim, had a fair amount of humor in the animations, especially the "bitch" animation, where your character would yell at you, stamp their feet, wave their arm's and complain about something ("Its cold! , I'm hungry!, etc).
for the sexual assault action, it occurred to me that a "mate" menu option would be the clinical way to do it. you could even get crazy and add a "mate" action to the "dead caveman" menu for necrophilia.
but i don't plan on implementing the rape action.
I think in regards to the sexual assault/sex or whatever else... There should simply be a list of actions which can include a generic "Have sex". Whether the other character consents to the act is a different matter. If for example that option is used on a regular tribes woman - she might decline, and the player can try again after buying presents or doing something else to increase the "Persuasion". The same mechanic could apply to anything really - Take item, Follow me, Do a barrel roll etc. Its all dependant on how much your character is capable of persuading the NPC.
If you implemented actions which can affect the "Persuasion" value such as: Beat up, Threaten, Compliment, Restrain.. You could indirectly allow for actions like rape, theft etc. A character refuses to give up their prized knife? Beat them repeatedly to drive up the Persuasion value until they give it up.
In the case of prisoners/slaves - their Persuasion is probably so high from being attacked/captured that when you order them to do something - they won't object... And if they do - that can be corrected through a very general set of actions which don't touch on ethically sensitive issues as much.
Also opens up the possibility of treating your prisoners nicely so they don't run away?
Enslaving doesnt work too well if there is a lack of controllability (via threat of easy overpowering and punishment, restriction on movement/action, longterm mental adjustments that prevent consideration of contrary actions, etc...) Caveman days was a little to freeflowing for alot of those things.
Caveman X is enslaved by Caveman Y and at first opportunity brains caveman Y with a convenient rock and make his escape. Not too practical. Stealing women might be more common but thats more adoption than enslavement.
BTW if multiple humans existed in the same local there WERE social conventions (even animals do this) so you might have to build up proper repercussion for 'taking things too far' (and making it plain to the player ) That is actually were the complexity explodes in behavior mechanisms where you move up a magnitude. To be closer to realistic there has to be 'history' not just reactions of the moment. Things happen as a continuum where an action has results/effects that may last a long time - the overall situation has to be considered in motivations and reactions you can get.
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Another avenue may be people who want to join you (strength in numbers and survival dependant on sharing resources). A typical 'capital' punishment' in many nomadic societies would be exile where the environment was often such that it basicly WAS a death penalty. It also might make you look more than twice at someone who comes along solo who cant provide an adaqute reason who MAY have been exiled and might not be the best candidate to join you ....
Another consideration is balance. You COULD enslave that person but do you need them will they supply something you need or already have too much of. One guy has 10 slaves (with little autonomy) and unless he is mean enough to cow them all sufficiently one might get the idea that with a few others they might easily overpower the master. Too many women for one Caveman and it throws off the 'hunter gatherer' balance (he has to/cant hunt too much to maintain the nutritional balance to be flexible in the seasonal variations)
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Something I formulated years ago - all social interactions are part of a negotiated agreement of some kind. " I dont attack you and you dont attack me" is one of the simplest. Another is "I join you and do what you say and I make use (and add to ) your resources."
It all is based on getting something you want/need and giving/supplying something in return that isnt too much.
I think in regards to the sexual assault/sex or whatever else... There should simply be a list of actions which can include a generic "Have sex". Whether the other character consents to the act is a different matter. If for example that option is used on a regular tribes woman - she might decline, and the player can try again after buying presents or doing something else to increase the "Persuasion". The same mechanic could apply to anything really - Take item, Follow me, Do a barrel roll etc. Its all dependant on how much your character is capable of persuading the NPC.
If you implemented actions which can affect the "Persuasion" value such as: Beat up, Threaten, Compliment, Restrain.. You could indirectly allow for actions like rape, theft etc. A character refuses to give up their prized knife? Beat them repeatedly to drive up the Persuasion value until they give it up.
Yes, at the moment the game only models attack to subdue, and relations between friendlies and the player's band members. once subdued and captured, there would then need to be some additional step or modeling required to do the persuadable / convertible captive thing.
For the captured cavemen, what if you had some dedicated slave traders working with you?
this would work great in your standard caveman themed rpg where you made up the rules. unfortunately, this is a caveman simulator. if it didn't actually exist, it doesn't go in, except for the "Bring on the dinos!" option. a number of features from the original version such as settlements and monoliths (a la 2001) were removed as unrealistic. The game includes over 50 representative species of extinct mega fauna. There have been 3 versions made, requiring a total of 5-6 years development time of which 2 years was research.
BTW if multiple humans existed in the same local there WERE social conventions (even animals do this) so you might have to build up proper repercussion for 'taking things too far' (and making it plain to the player ) That is actually were the complexity explodes in behavior mechanisms where you move up a magnitude. To be closer to realistic there has to be 'history' not just reactions of the moment. Things happen as a continuum where an action has results/effects that may last a long time - the overall situation has to be considered in motivations and reactions you can get.
Yes i'm beginning to think there should be modeling of "degrees of hostility", not just friendlies with a relationship rating like The SIMs, and hostiles who attack on sight. right now a negative relationship just means more work til they're friendly enough to do things like trade or travel with you, etc. IE they don't attack you or anything like that, and you can't throw insults like in the sims.
Another avenue may be people who want to join you (strength in numbers and survival dependant on sharing resources). A typical 'capital' punishment' in many nomadic societies would be exile where the environment was often such that it basicly WAS a death penalty. It also might make you look more than twice at someone who comes along solo who cant provide an adaqute reason who MAY have been exiled and might not be the best candidate to join you ....
when relations with a friendly are good enough, you can get them as a traveling companion (like a henchman or flunky). when relations with a travelling companion are good enough, you can get them to join your band, like joining your household in he sims. the player can control a band of up to 10 cavemen, and can tab between them at any time. so one may be out hunting, while another is 10 mile away gathering berries, while a third is back at the cave making arrows for the hunter, and a forth band member has gone to the nearby lake for a swim.
