Mind monolog experiment

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158 comments, last by Fournicolas 18 years, 9 months ago
The following is an experiment I have been meaning to run for a while now. I probably should be doing uni work, but oh well [smile]. I really wish I had more time to spend on this forum. The purpose of this experiment is to observe and document the thought process people go through when trying to come up with new and original ideas. It could be said quite easily that the thought process that goes into creating a scene that I go through is vastly different from that of Steven Spielberg. Each one of us has our own methods of creating a path to the goal that is a good idea. By looking at the thought process of different people is, in my mind, no different from watching another person play football. You watch their process, you watch how they react, you think how you would of reacted to that situation and incorporate their methods into your own. By watching those around you and learning through their techniques you become better at what you do in return; a simple theory. What I would like to do is apply that to the thought process that goes on with writing. I have presented three different options below, with the task of choosing one and creating a synopsis for a story based on one of those keywords. Now, the point of this exercise is NOT to try and come up with an award winning synopsis of a story that will be turned into a movie, but instead to accurately document your thought process as you try and reach your perfect idea. As such, in the exercise you will type as you think, documenting your entire process as you think of your idea. Every thought on the way should be written down; the keyboard should not even be noticed. You should use your typing as a simple extension of your thoughts, using it as a recorder. If you pause while you are trying to think of what to do next, tap the period key while you think. To clarify the steps of this exercise:
  • Choose from one of the following options (A,B, or C).
  • Create a synopsise for a story incorporating those three keywords into the theme.
  • Document your entire process as you think of your synopsise. Every thought on the way should be written down; the keyboard should not even be noticed. You should use your typing as a simple extension of your thoughts, using it as a recorder. The backspace key should NEVER EVER be touched if you are accurately documenting your thoughts. The options to choose from Option A: life, hurt, individuality Option B Guilt, death, home Option C Environment, science, new.
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    Option B:

    Ok, so guilt death and home. I suppose it could be that home could be the place of a murder. Ooh, even in max payne style. Maybe a cop had his wife killed or something. Mmm, too cliché. Ok, so what if guilt is something else. Come to think of it, what if death and guilt where just metaphors. Hell, the guy could be a cop still, but make it so that the death is really of himself in a manner of speaking. Maybe he stuffed up a week ago, is on suspension, and now the guilt is driving him to kill himself. Nah, I said that it should be a metaphor. Ok, so the death could be what he thinks of himself. Maybe he could see it’s the death of what he saw himself as when he left the academy, now he has seen the real world in all its gory details for its horrible truths, and now his image of this perfect world he thought he could uphold has died. That could work, but the whole ‘fallen cop’ thing seems pretty cliché as well. Heh, what if he is a murderer? Holy shit! Ok, what if it is the life of this cop while he realises that the world is a totally **** up place, but told from the last three months of a murderer that the cop is tracking. The murderer could be stalking the cop, told like a diray of his last months before he is caght…………………………………………………………………….. Or better yet, the cop is retelling the story AFTER he has caught this guy and has found his diary. Hey, that could work well. He could then use this diary as a means to see the world through a different view than his own, and maybe have a realisation that the world is not as doomed as he thought it was. Heck, the guy he captured could really be quite profound, seeing life as a thing that is so beautiful that it had to end at some point, and he was the means to do it. I duno, something still seems a bit to cliché. Cop chases murderer. Cop catches murderer. Cop reflects on whole event up until this point. Still seems pretty damn standard even if it is that the entire story is a prequel of sorts. It needs a gimmick, or something to make it stand apart. Maybe like………….the cop is dead? Or the cop was already murdered? How the heck will that work? Ok, it’s a twist, but there has to be a better one. Maybe I just haven’t thought about it enough. Heh, what if the cop was really the conscious of the murderer….ok..that could work. Actually, that could work really well! The murderer tops himself at the end, being caught by this cop that was really this conscious of his, proving to the guy that what he was doing was really a bad thing (the murderer could probably see no fault in what he was doing up till then). That could be cool. That way the cop could really delve into the mind of this killer, analysing what he does and why he does it, trying to answer the question ‘why murder someone'.
    *******Out Of Thread*******

    Since the story sounds good in taking place, it would be a shame to let it go to waste. If you can, check a French movie called Dédales, out in 2003 with Lambert Wilson, in its French title. On IMDB, it says that the English title is Labyrinth. Do not confound with the movie with David Bowie...

    *******End of Out of thread*******

    Yours faithfully,
    Nicolas FOURNIALS
    Hmm, the least dubious of these options seems to be life, hurt, individuality. Can I do anything with these? Will it be anything I _want_ to do? Is this experiment meaningful, since I never write from word prompts when I create a synopsis for a story? Well I'll attempt it because I want other people to attempt experiments and surveys when I post them, and the results will probably be interesting no matter what prompt we start from.

    How do life, hurt, and individuality fit together? Well, hurt is often caused by individuality (people not fitting in) Life is an ongoing process of personal growth, which increases individuality, and if you never get hurt, you're probably not really living. Risk. (taking a drink of water, debating whether to eat a piece of chocolate, deciding to reserve it as a reward for writing more. I love the shiny foils on candies, it was very accurate when I used to have that sticker that said "easily distracted by bright shiny objects".) Focus!

    Having recently received the criticism that my stories are all the same, even though there is a good reason for this I would feel silly if I outlined a story where individuality=alternate sexuality, hurt=social rejection, and life=beginning and nurturing a romantic relationship. Besides that would probably defeat the purpose of the experiment. (I am normally this aware of the purpose of a piece of writing I am creating, so it's a part of the process, not a contaminant.) Er, anyway outlining a story built on that formula would defeat the purpose of the experimant because I don't have to think about it anymore, I've done it often enough that it's automatic, so there wouldn't be any process to document. (Bet this will be longer than Boolean's when it's done, I'm a very chatty writer, which is funny since IRL I'm a quiet listener and never have anything to say (literary divice=exaggeration to strengthen a rhetorical point by making a dark grey area black).

    So, if I don't do that, what _else_ can I do with life, hurt, and individuality. Ooh, I had that story idea a while ago about the unicorn. See, a unicorn's memories/personality are stored in its horn (don't ask why, it's magic). An adult female unicorn dies at the foot of a small cliff, and after a few years just the bones are left. Then an overconfidant teenage male unicorn jumps incautiously off the cliff and sticks himself on the skeleton's horn, so now he is really confused to have all the female unicorns memories... (argh, that's about gender and sexuality again, isn't it? >.< ) Maybe it's impossible to write a story about the intersection of life and individuality without hitting sexuality. Maybe I should switch to choice C: environment, science, new, except I hate that word environment... (Some indian women and children are barbecuing outside) Well, I only hate all the stupid connotations the word is burdened with, so I should forget them and reinterpret the word. I like it's connotation as a psychological term, like "learning environment".

    Okay, let's write about a new learning environment, and make it a science fiction story. Not new once, that's too simple and uses up it's interest too quickly; let's write about a learning environment that is perpetually new. Maybe I'll just use all 6 words, and Boolean can interpret it as whichever prompt he wants, probably A since choosing C might invalidate my first 3 paragraphs. (Reminds me of Akazukin Cha Cha, which I was watching last night, about 3 kids with individual=different abilities who struggle against a new enemy every episode while attending magic school. This is a cheesy example, but may be a good place to extract useful elements for building my story from, so I'll keep it in mind. But first I'll go get more water and chocolate, or maybe a bagel because that's a bit healthier...)

    (10 minutes later) Often I would put some music on while doing this, but in between creating the story idea and documenting everything I'm thinking, I don't think I have any brainpower to spare.

    So, a learning environment that is constantly new. One time I dreamed about being a student in a military school space station *cough*ender's game*cough* where the corridors and their contents shifted around constantly to train the students to be "ready for anything". As a student, my biggest worry was that I would get separated from the other student I had a crush on (lol back to romance again - it's like the magnetic north pole of my mind). I never developed this dream as a story, but I have played with some other sceience-fiction-school-story ideas, including a comic villain school idea (like the inverse of Cha Cha, the student villains are the main characters and they fight new stupid but frustratingly lucky good guys every few episodes, with other episodes in between showing the students learning funny villain stuff in class, since I always thing school stories don't have enough of this.) The more serious school story ideas I worked on were a Harry-Potter inspired one with doglike aliens and Dominion Academy, an 80s sf military academy one built aroung the idea of training not single students, but teams/families of students called dominion teams (romance again). [insert my surface memories about these previous projects here]. Really, (Maslow's Hierarchy) there're only three strong motivations life can be about: fighting for survival, being driven by ambition/greed/revenge, and wanting to end loneliness. Since I don't care for fighting or the hurried/adrenaline feeling associated with being driven, is it any wonder everything I write is about romance? (thinking, looking out the window, listening to the noises the washing machine is making...)

    So, that establishes what I have done, such that I can disassemble it and use the building blocks to make this new story. But what do I _want_ to do now? Well, normal schools are boring, so I need students who have psychic, magic, or unusual biological powers, so I can write about the students acquiring new powers and practicing them and making humorous mistakes. If I'm going to be introducing new worldbuilding it's best to have an outsider or n00b as the main character(s) so they start out equally ignorant as the audience and then everyone can learn about the worldbuilding together as the story progresses. So, we want (a) main character(s) with a newly activated/discovered power or aptitude for power. (Aww, cute! Out in the yard a dad is rocking a daughter in his arms. Yay families. ^_^ Glances at what I have written - oh yeah, way longer than Boolean's and I don't even have any characters yet, lol.)

    And we need a worldbuilding reason that it is feasable to create a constantly-changing environment, and a motivation for some school administration or other character(s) to especially want the students to be "ready for anything". So perhaps some kind of external threat that evolves rapidly and requires the individual combatants to make snap decisions.. yuck, now I'm thinking invading aliens vs. students in mechas. :P Quick, scratch that idea out before it pollutes my brain. Next option is 'wizard duels', which are generally one-on-one and require quick, creative strategy. But this is supposed to be a science fiction setting. What's a science fiction version of wizard duels? (An evil little voice whispers: "Mechas, duh." I smack it with a mallet and tell it to shut up.) Cyberspace duels? Nah, that's too freeform, strategy is the most interesting when there are a variety of non-alterable playing fields and obstacles you have to work with. Gladiatorial duels for the entertainment of the peons? That has the problem of implying that the duelists are always in danger of being fired and having to find a new job in the real world. Similarly military duels imply that there is a chance the duelists will be killed.

    (These 'locical' paragraph breaks don't at all match the pattern of progress and pauses in my thinking.) Well, how about a meritocracy where you have to excel in combat to earn rank and privelage? But how would that fit with teams/families rather than being every man for himself? Maybe there is some prerequesite (biological?) for being a leader of a family, such that only about 20% of the population can be one. That would be good, because I could use a version of my Nakago/Ravennin/born leader character, and a looks-like-a-leader-but-chooses-to-be-a-follower character, and a submissive born follower, etc. So, what would qualify someone to be a leader? Size? That's simple and rather rigid. Personality/hormonal balance/multiple genders? Used these all before, with both the dogaliens (who were color-coded by personality/hormone balance and became a gender appropriate to their personality at puberty) and the Alphas and Betas in my novel idea. :/ I don't believe in fate, so I refuse on general principle to use 'children marked by destiny' with a birthmark or other magical omen. An inhereted trait would be arbitrary/unfair and not work with the idea of a meritocracy. Maybe just personal choice - there are only so many leader 'slots' in a generation and you have to be really determined to choose to compete for one. But there has to be some opportunity cost, something that traps leadership candidates into striving for this once they declare themselves, or else they could always just change their minds, which isn't dramatic at all...

    In any case, the plot will naturally be about a leader-candidate, his rivals, his followers, and the struggle toward and finally achievement of the family/team's rank. This is a clear pattern which naturally ought to be populate with certain character types - from this point on it's just a matter of deciding all the details. Phew, I'm done! o.O; ^_^

    I want to help design a "sandpark" MMO. Optional interactive story with quests and deeply characterized NPCs, plus sandbox elements like player-craftable housing and lots of other crafting. If you are starting a design of this type, please PM me. I also love pet-breeding games.

    It is actually pretty boring to read through someone else's thoughts, why not just document the different methods directly? Sicne the first two options were already picked I will pick the third one.

    Option C Environment, science, new.

    Environment is the context where a message is contained. Science is the process of explaining message of embedded in the context. New can be the illusion of discover or verbalization of the association between the message and the context. Therefore, in this case I can devise a story about how how intuition is explained through the use of science.

    The environment, or the context, can be chosen so that illusion can commonly exist, where the science of understanding it is still in the earliest stage of development, therefore the theories about it are still new to the common eyes, but in fact they are no more than the conscious explanations of the intuition.

    The environment that comes to mind is music. The story will be about the science behind the composition of an emotional expression through the use of music as the medium. The story can be about the rise and fall of a such composer, how the very development of science threatens the community of intuition composers. In a nutshell this is another religion vs science story, but with a theme of musics instead of religion. It is also analogus to the threat about robots replacing human, and computers replacing programmers. But all of these more common debates are wrapped up and re-presented in the theme of musics and arts.
    Sns, wow that was awesome. Thanks for taking the time do that. It's really interesting to see how you use the romance side in your writing, and how genders and sexuality are big parts of your stories. When you try to come up with a story outside this theme, it almost seems like the struggle is not so much coming up with a good story, but not trying to return to these themes. That was my impression anyway. If you compare your style of writing to my 'just avoid the clichés and build a story around that' style of writing, it can already be seen how different the process people go through is.

    Quote:Original post by sunandshadow
    (Aww, cute! Out in the yard a dad is rocking a daughter in his arms. Yay families. ^_^ Glances at what I have written - oh yeah, way longer than Boolean's and I don't even have any characters yet, lol.)


    [lol] thats awesome
    Quote:Original post by boolean
    Sns, wow that was awesome. Thanks for taking the time do that. It's really interesting to see how you use the romance side in your writing, and how genders and sexuality are big parts of your stories. When you try to come up with a story outside this theme, it almost seems like the struggle is not so much coming up with a good story, but not trying to return to these themes. That was my impression anyway. If you compare your style of writing to my 'just avoid the clichés and build a story around that' style of writing, it can already be seen how different the process people go through is.


    You're welcome. :) Looking back over what I wrote, I am wincing at the zillions of typos, but oh well, stream-of-consciousness typing doesn't give one time to edit. I agree with that assessment that even if I set out to do something else, I end up back at romance and sexuality - I just see them as some of the unavoidable foundations of life in a society, and I would feel like I was making something incomplete and unrealistic if I completely left them out when designing a culture. Plus character psychology and relationships are my favorite thing to write about, and romances are one of the most important types of relationship, and an opportunity to show the characters going through a range of vivid and interesting emotions (lust, loneliness, anxiety, joy, fury, despair).

    I'm looking forward to reading everyone's responses, especially the people who are good at creating plot ideas because I could use some insight into methods of doing that. I also like the fact that this exercise will give us a window of insight into the other forum members' personalities and writing goals. :)

    Boolean, I read yours after I wrote mine (so as not to bias myself), and one thing I am curious about is, why did you pick option B? How do you feel about each of those 3 words, what do they make you think of? I do think it is very cool the way 'home' ended up being inside the main character's head, where the cop is - I think this would make a nicely suspenseful story with a good dramatic twist at the end, I can easily imagine finding a story like this in a published short story collection. :) Would you say suspense is one of your priorities in designing a story?

    I want to help design a "sandpark" MMO. Optional interactive story with quests and deeply characterized NPCs, plus sandbox elements like player-craftable housing and lots of other crafting. If you are starting a design of this type, please PM me. I also love pet-breeding games.

    Quote:Original post by sunandshadow
    Boolean, I read yours after I wrote mine (so as not to bias myself), and one thing I am curious about is, why did you pick option B? How do you feel about each of those 3 words, what do they make you think of? I do think it is very cool the way 'home' ended up being inside the main character's head, where the cop is - I think this would make a nicely suspenseful story with a good dramatic twist at the end, I can easily imagine finding a story like this in a published short story collection. :) Would you say suspense is one of your priorities in designing a story?


    Thanks mate [smile]

    Whenever I write anything, I absolutely hate to conform to any standard, as doing this usually leads to creating predictable story lines - something I strive to avoid. I look at it the same as a joke you might read on the internet or see in a skit. The truly funny ones are the ones where you did not expect the ending, where you think you know where it is heading, but the writer knows that most people will assume that if event A happens, then event B happens, then as per usual event C will happen. The jokes work well when it turns out that event X actually ends up happening.

    As such, in my writing I try to keep the reader on their toes as much as possible. Every time they assume something is a standard affair (for example, boy falling in love with girl) I try to head in the complete opposite direction (girl falls in love with a computer program, aka the AI Love story I started for Genjix and his RPG). If someone takes over the world, I want to make sure that the person reading it is thinking ‘I never even thought of that reason for doing it before’. I mean, this might the same way everyone writes, I don't know. The other thing I always strive to do is to keep the reader thinking after they have read the story. I want them trying to figure out all the intricacies 24 hours a day, thinking ‘I wonder if he really meant this when he said that’, or ‘maybe this section was all a metaphor for that section’, giving them moral issues to stew over for weeks. Even though it might sound silly, if I ever had a best seller, I want forums flooded with people picking the book apart trying to get to the real story, something that those who take the book on face value will never notice (big surprise, my favourite director is David Lynch [smile]).

    Of course, I make no reservations that any of this is actually working for me [grin]


    Quote:How do you feel about each of those 3 words, what do they make you think of?


    Good question.

    I chose these words because they have so many ways they can be taken apart from their literal meaning. Home was mainly the word that kept coming up for me every time I read through them, since it has so many connotations. Where is it? What is it? What do people expect home to be? Where is the last place you would expect home? What else can a home be? Same with death and guilt. Death of what? Who? Guilt. What are all the forms of guilt? Can guilt be used in any other ways?


    Quote:Original post by boolean
    Whenever I write anything, I absolutely hate to conform to any standard, as doing this usually leads to creating predictable story lines - something I strive to avoid. I look at it the same as a joke you might read on the internet or see in a skit. The truly funny ones are the ones where you did not expect the ending, where you think you know where it is heading, but the writer knows that most people will assume that if event A happens, then event B happens, then as per usual event C will happen. The jokes work well when it turns out that event X actually ends up happening.


    Surprise/incongruity humor is probably the most dramatic and popular type of humor, but I just wanted to point out that there are other types of humor: ironic, anticipation, and repetition.

    Ironic humor involves opposites - Character A expects that X is going on, while you the reader or Character B knows that really X is the least likely think to be going on or the opposite of what is actually going on.

    Characteristic humor involves surprising individual instances that, in hindsight, were predictable from a character or the world's personality or habitual behavior. These are things like the poor character who always has a raincloud over his head, raining on just him. He gets an umbrella... and it starts raining _inside_ the umbrella, on just him. All the other characters are suffering from a drought - this character is suffering from getting hit by lightning bolts because his storm turned into a dry electrical storm. Also, think about the coyote and the roadrunner. You know how it's going to end - the coyote will get beaten within an inch of his life and the roadrunner will go "meep meep" laughing at the coyote's misery and run off. It's not surprising at all - but it's funny anyway.

    Repetition humor is the "Oh no, not again!" kind. Seeing the same event occur 3 or more times builds up suspense about when it will end, or when it will strike again, or exactly what form it will take this kind. I mentioned Akazukin Cha Cha above - this series has lots of repetition humor. For example, when Cha Cha tries to do magic, 95% of the time she will get a pun of what she asked for (like a moose instead of chocolate mousse) which will then chase her around and destroy buildings until someone else makes it dissapear. You can also have a character with a wrong belief (often ignorance of a secret identity or paranoia), which always results in that character reacting to things off at right angles to the other characters. Or you can simply have a character always use the same phrase, which your audience will start mimicking, and you can reinforce the humor by having the other characters in the story get sick of the phrase and start ignoring it/talking over top of it/parodying it, etc.

    So personally I don't focus on avoiding cliches because in the right instance a cliche can be a powerful, almost Pavlovian way to get a desired response from the reader, and many readers have a cliche or archetype they love and will buy all books/games they see which have it; this is why RPGs very often include one enemy who is a cactus, one who is a zombie, one who is a penguin, and one who is almost too cute to fight, so that when players stumble across this in the game they go, "Yay, my favorite!"

    Quote:
    As such, in my writing I try to keep the reader on their toes as much as possible. Every time they assume something is a standard affair (for example, boy falling in love with girl) I try to head in the complete opposite direction (girl falls in love with a computer program, aka the AI Love story I started for Genjix and his RPG). If someone takes over the world, I want to make sure that the person reading it is thinking ‘I never even thought of that reason for doing it before’. I mean, this might the same way everyone writes, I don't know. The other thing I always strive to do is to keep the reader thinking after they have read the story. I want them trying to figure out all the intricacies 24 hours a day, thinking ‘I wonder if he really meant this when he said that’, or ‘maybe this section was all a metaphor for that section’, giving them moral issues to stew over for weeks. Even though it might sound silly, if I ever had a best seller, I want forums flooded with people picking the book apart trying to get to the real story, something that those who take the book on face value will never notice (big surprise, my favourite director is David Lynch [smile]).

    Of course, I make no reservations that any of this is actually working for me [grin]


    Gene Wolfe. My roommate loves this author for _exactly_ the reasons you have listed - his writing is unpredictable, with mysterious happenings, scenes of questionable reality, and events that somehow comment on other events, but you're not sure quite how. His fans do nutty stuff to try to analyze it including numerology, lol. So if you're not already a Wolfe fan, you should check out either his serious masterwork, the Urth of the New Sun series, or his comic masterwork Free Live Free. :)

    I want to help design a "sandpark" MMO. Optional interactive story with quests and deeply characterized NPCs, plus sandbox elements like player-craftable housing and lots of other crafting. If you are starting a design of this type, please PM me. I also love pet-breeding games.

    It might be odd to you that my post was different, but that was actually how I thought since I am familiar with this kind of exercise. I would think about the definitions, then stop. Then think about how they could go together and then stop. And then think about how the same idea may or may not have already exist, and the analogies. So what I posted was actually the raw data, not the processed documentation.

    "The other thing I always strive to do is to keep the reader thinking after they have read the story." "and events that somehow comment on other events, but you're not sure quite how"

    One way you can do this is to start with the meaning first, and then use metaphors and symbolisms to obscure it. The idea is to deliver messages through symbols that the reader cannot consciously defend against. The entire story is designed to be a trojan horse to begin with. The events themselves are symbols. It is not surprising that there are uncanny associations to the keen minds that the story is not what the story is about, but the story should also prevent the reader from knowing what the true story is. This is story creation based on design.

    For the musics example above, the designer can use symbolism to simultaneously lead the reader ino thinking that maybe the story is really about religion vs science, or about artificial intelligence. THe designer is able to do this because the designer knows the analogies of the message in different landscapes.


    Another way is to simply make smoke everywhere to trick the reader into thinking that there are coordinated hidden meanings, this can be done by writing the story and whatever comes to your mind that not even you know why it comes to your mind. Subconsciously there is a relationship, and the readers will take the assumptions that there is an association as they read them. The writer does not need to understand the associations explicitly. Just because you don't know why you put it there doesn't mean that it is not related. This is story creation based on expression.

    [Edited by - Estok on April 17, 2005 4:43:47 AM]

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