Hi guys. Been a while since I've been on these forums.

Aaand I'm posting outside the programming forums :D
(although I did consider putting this in the graphical programming one)

Lets talk about graphical styles in games

We're @ a point in time now when realistic looking games can look incredibly polished.
I mean today's machines are games are capable of some pretty impressive stuff.
But this can be a barrier if you're making games yourself & don't have teams of concept artists, modellers, textures, animators, graphical programmers & all the rest..
It seems that, in part caused by this, indie games are starting to pursue lots of unique styles of their own (& I'm sure also because some people are just awesome creative)

But the days are gone when low poly models will do it any more. And most of us don't have the skills required to keep up with this hyper-realism style.

Now I'm not saying that we should feel we have to; there are many different styles we can go for.
But it seems any style we do go for we really have to seem like we're "pushing" for that style. If we do a game in any way "retro" it has to seem like we're really going for that retro style.
It seems every style has to be hyped up in some way...

And the question is...

But what about those of us that just want to make games?
Is there a good style that's applicable to modern 3d games but isn't too intensive to pull off?
(cos we'd feel all self-conscious if we brought out a game that looked like classic Half-Life now, right?)

Are there any simpler-styled games you like?

How can we best avoid the problem of having lower quality textures & models?

Games like minecraft get around this great. But the problem is that that's been done now, & it feels like a deliberate style and also going down that route would seem too "copy-cat". It would also seem like we were really "pushing" hard for that style, not just trying to make a game without making it look amazing.

What do you guys think?

Do you get me, or am I just talking rubbish? Am I totally wrong?

I'm a little confused by something in your post, namely that you're asking for good graphical styles but seem very sensitive to copying an existing style. If you're looking at existing styles, then you're going to have some element of copying involved.

Cell shading might be something to look at. I don't know exactly how difficult it is to do, but it's certainly less than ultra-high poly count models. I also feel that it lets more of the artist's style through, although that's open to debate.

You can also mix styles between background and character models. You can have ultra-high detail backgrounds pre-rendered, but simpler characters to be rendered in real time. A (very dated) example of a game with mixed styles that I liked was Breath of Fire III, which had 3D maps and 2D characters. With better maps and crisper sprites, such a style would probably look good today.

I guess I'm also not quite sure what you mean by saying that you have to really go for a style. You have to really go for a lot of things to make a good game, because phoning in something like graphics, which the player will see at all times, will probably always look shoddy no matter what style is used. I've always felt that the best graphics aren't necessarily the most realistic, but rather the ones that are consistent with the theme and feel of a game. So if a given style, be it hyper-realistic or 8-bit, fits with gameplay and atmosphere, I'll still likely be satisfied with them.

Mmm.. The game examples were good. All nice 2d games, thou. But that's alright :]
(Truth be told despite mentioning 3d games I much prefer 2d styles)

Cell shading's also a good idea, & is reasonably easy to implement. It goes nicely with flatter, simpler texturing, too. Thanks.


Khaiy: I was trying to avoid deliberately being stylistic for the sake of it.

This is kind of an open question & my train of thought was:
"What if someone really wants to make a specific game, but they don't want to push on any particular graphical style as a "gimmick"; They're interested purely in making the game?"

That's what I meant by "pushing" for a style: trying to be overly stylistic.
Maybe you're right & pushing for a graphical style is as important as any other aspects of the game.
You make a good point in that you certainly don't want to make it seem like the graphics are "lacking" in any amount - as this may drag down the game. (which was my main initial fear)

Eskil's Love is a good example of this - he came up with an exceedingly simple, and largely programatic art style, and at the same time managed to create an entirely original and distinct look.

But you are right, you can't just copy another style and expect this to occur. Which I think makes discussing a universal style a little pointless. As soon as two games come out with it, it starts to be stale.

And this applies to AAA games as well, just look at Halo. When it came out, it was the only FPS set in sunny outdoor locations, with a palette consisting almost entirely of primary colours. Fast forward a few years, and everything is back to grey and brown, to avoid looking like the Fisher Price of video games...

A game is a piece of art. Your choice of art style for the game is an artistic choice. That's not something you can or should get away from.

Personally I like 2D cartoony styles. Plants vs. Zombies is one of my recent favorites for excellent gameplay, looks, and value for cost. I'm probably biased because I'm a 2D artist who works in a cartoony style, and it's kind of amazing to me to play a professional-feeling game like that and realize that I could make that art. (It would take me all year, but still, theoretically... lol) Disgaea is a 3D example - the models are not ultra-realistic, but the game as a whole is very attractive. It takes an approach much like FF7 and Warcraft II of using simpler models or sprites as the workhorses of the game, but higher-quality story segments to make the characters feel real and the plot feel immersive.

swiftCoder: Hmm.. Love is both a good & bad choice in my mind. I completely admire him for holding to his guns & really being able to say he created something that was his own, but the look is not without it's frustrations @ times.
It's both an attraction & a deterrent, a USP & a deal breaker, a something.. & something not so good.

Halo is a good example, I feel. It did a very good job of feeling fresh & nice, while not having to push too hard with any particular visual style (althou they did have a lot of bump-mapped metal panelling)

Hmm.. universal styles are stale.. I'm not sure.
Again, using classic Half-Life as an example of a game I really liked, looking back 1998 seemed like a pretty stale year, in terms of graphics.
I remember 3D games around that era all tending to look very much the same.
Yet I remember having this profound sense of fun & exciting story-involvement from Half-Life.
This could be a tainted vision, of course, but perhaps one of the things that made it good _were_ that it was rather plain? (In as much as they were not a distraction & served their purpose very well?)
To which you reply: "But no! Back then it looked most excellent! It was new & exciting then! Your modern expectations deceive you.".
Hmm.. & maybe.. or maybe not? Just trying to see :] What are your thoughts?

sunandshadow: an artistic choice, yes. But you don't need to be trying to make an artistic statement to make a game. (although if you are, all the better, right?)
I'll agree that I also really like simple 2d styles.
They're light on the eyes & give enough information, while not being too complicated or overwhelming.
They compliment games, while letting you just get on with them & have fun.
Even if done relatively simple as long as they're vector-like they will scale well.
In comparison, if 3d models are done simply they're usually lower poly & don't scale well to scrutiny at all. (maybe part of the trick, as TyrianFin suggested, is in the toolset? We just need more organic modelling tools, heh)

(Btw - I want you both to know I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm just trying to understand things from both sides. This thread is out of character for me & I'm glad I'm being chastised :]. The look is usually one of the first elements I like to get a firm grasp of when working on a project. I am, perhaps, trying to see things from another angle)


Thanks for your thoughts so far, people.

I think I'm starting to get swayed & lose momentum with my question already.
Does anybody else have anything to say either way?

I think that we tend to mix two issues. Games like LOVE and Minecraft are two good examples. Minecraft is the typical programmer art game with an acceptable retro, but consistent style. LOVE on the other hand is an artistic style, where you have 'art' , but you need less efforts to created it compared to photorealistic art. Still you will need artists to create this kind of art.

There are other examples, take a look at DeathSpank. It looks like simple art, but it is still art and not 'programmer art', so you still need artists.

From an indi developer view, most developers try to stylize their art to save money and I think that two kind of game market evolves , the ultra expensive photorealistic game market and the stylized game market.Stylized is not a pure indi domain,many successful companies like blizzard or valve seem to get away from photorealistic games. Thought money is not the only reason, but photorealist art degenerated much faster then stylized art.

From a programmer art view, nowadays we have many more options to create better programmer art than in the 90th. Many classic artistic skills have to grasp the form of an object, to envision a surface material and its interaction with light and shadow, can be 'coded' nowaday. With a simple model and a simple albedo/heightmap you can archive some pretty decent looking programmer art when using some decent 3d engine.

I'm a pure coder, but I don't fear to create my own "decent" art any longer. I try to "fix" it with shaders and effects. My game will never stand up to any decent photorealistic game, but I think (and hope) that it will not scare away everybody :-)

Games using stylized art:
- Teamfortress 2
- DeathSpank
- WoW/DiabloIII
- Minecraft
- LOVE

other artistic techniques:
- painting with polygons