Religion in games.I''m not talking about Christian Games or stuff like that, I mean the different gods you use in fantasy games.You know, God of Thunder, God of Justice, Bad God etc etc.I think that most RPGs are full of sh*t when it comes to this.So, what do you think ? Any cool ideas ? How do you handle it ? In my world, there are no Gods.The people worship Gaia, the Earthmother aka Nature.The Druids are the "priesthood".I must say that I was influenced by Stephen Donaldson so there''s a lot of this ''beauty'' and ''nature'' thing, with the addition of ''life''. Runemaster Join the Game Developers RuneRing !
The Specular Lightosis Research Fund

Maybe take the "everyone is right" approach. The gods or different faces of them are really just the same god, but people look at it from a different perspective. Some believe that it is one almighty god, others think that it is a society of many gods. Some beleive that there are lesser and greater gods. Other beleive in only magic and say that there are not real gods, just vast pockets of magic that cause random occurances. Others don''t even believe in magic, it is all just ''stuff''.

Note: I have been reading a lot of Raymond E. Feist, and just started Krondor the Assassins

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-Chris Bennett of Dwarfsoft
"The Philosophers' Stone of Programming Alchemy"
IOL (The list formerly known as NPCAI) - A GDNet production
Our Doc - The future of RPGs
Thanks to all the goblins over in our little Game Design Corner niche

I like the no god thing... I think that a philosophy that was started by an elder (who was mortal) can be passed down from generation to generation. So the history is set. People enter the game where there is a conflict. But it isn''t because of any unseen gods... it''s because in parallel there was another society that had different beliefs, which usually accounts for the conflict.

Taking runemaster''s example, one of the societies worships Nature (I think of American Indians when I hear "worship nature") and possibly the other society could care less about nature (sounds like a modern political arena to me ). They believe in man''s right to prosper at any cost. A conflict arises between these two and that''s when the player comes in.

Essentially you have to build some sort of belief into the player that this is believable... since (most of us) we think in terms of a God or a supreme being, you have to give a reason for why you are where your at in the game. Otherwise the feeling of the game could be lost.



Dave "Dak Lozar" Loeser

I have no answer on this one...

I''ll think about it.

Anyway I think that you only need to write a good background story and legends involvings gods to make the feel that they''re real.

If additionnaly you met priests having special powers...
You couldn''t say that gods are not for real.

In my RPG (true pen&paper tabletop one), they are artifacts and holy places you mustn''t damage for fear of being struck by the god owning the place...
And of course some players tried to damage them anyway and were killed or something worste

So here its the example that tell you that gods are for real.


-* So many things to do, so little time to spend. *-

The second you personified nature as Gaia and the "Earthmother" and gave her (Her?) a dedicated "priesthood" you created a religion with a god(dess). Of course, if you meant that your god isn''t a male figure, but a female goddess, then you succeeded in having no gods.

As for what''s the best solution. There is none. Your world is your world and what you feel best breathes life into it, whether that is wars, gods, devils, nature, aliens, conspiracies, legends, swords, guns, ..whatever.. is totally up to you!

There are so many ideas out there that I hesitate to even list one. You''re best bet is to read a lot.. then read more.. and after that read some more.. then read a lot.. Once you''ve accomplished that, read a bit more. When you think you''ve pretty well covered it all, read more.

Of course, reading never hurt. It''s all research and the more you read and the broader the topics, the better.


-------
Monkey eat deadCricket, checkmate!

I agree. RPG games should have an idea in every God. Not just God of this & God of that. Games in overall should be more like good books(don''t that I like to read). They should have a message. Be more phsycological. Like Secret of Mana(If anyone played it). I really felt beeing in the game when you discover that the Mana tree is your mother. Great game.

But it r eally should send a message. That might be the future?
Maybe Black & White will be a game like that.


That''s something I''ve tought about a lot, with messages in games. Becuase I myself have many teories of God & Life.
And usually people write these ideas in books, but why not in games?

i´m my game there a entidy. and from it come all will(mana) of the world

the caracters know about the existence of it. but don´t know anything else about it. if it manifest in some form in our uniferse. or the relationship of it and the existence in general.

=========
Nothing is perfect.
I´m nothing.
So i´m perfect.

Edited by - The Alchemist on September 1, 2000 12:46:59 PM

quote: Original post by deadCricket

The second you personified nature as Gaia and the "Earthmother" and gave her (Her?) a dedicated "priesthood" you created a religion with a god(dess). Of course, if you meant that your god isn't a male figure, but a female goddess, then you succeeded in having no gods.

As for what's the best solution. There is none. Your world is your world and what you feel best breathes life into it, whether that is wars, gods, devils, nature, aliens, conspiracies, legends, swords, guns, ..whatever.. is totally up to you!

There are so many ideas out there that I hesitate to even list one. You're best bet is to read a lot.. then read more.. and after that read some more.. then read a lot.. Once you've accomplished that, read a bit more. When you think you've pretty well covered it all, read more.

Of course, reading never hurt. It's all research and the more you read and the broader the topics, the better.


-------
Monkey eat deadCricket, checkmate!

I understand what you mean, but Gaia is not really a person ...something more general, maybe a force.Oh, and another thought.For you who have read Eddings' Belgariad & Malloreon and Belgarath the Sorcerer and so on, don't you think the Gods were great ? They were persons, they actually appeared and were important for the story.Belar is quite "human".



Runemaster
Join the Game Developers RuneRing !

The Specular Lightosis Research Fund


Edited by - runemaster on September 1, 2000 1:13:19 PM

quote:Original post by runemaster
I think that most RPGs are full of sh*t when it comes to this.

Can you please clarify this? What do you mean? Because they didn''t do it the way you think they did? Because it''s unrealistic? I wan''t to know more about your thinking before I get annoyed at this comment.

Religion is a very touchy subject. I''m very religious (Christian), so I usually don''t like the "no gods" situation. I like to present an underlying morality in my worlds. Without that, there is no good or evil and therefore no good vs. evil. That''s what these games (or at least the stories in them) are about. Good conquering evil. Someone mentioned Hitman. I view that as the next step toward total abandonment of all that is good. Yes it''s just a game, but it represents evil and those who enjoy those games are espousing evil whether they practice it in reality or not.

Anyway, you can see that this is a sensitive point for me, and this is my opinion. If you don''t have some underlying morality (and if it''s not enforced by a higher power/law, it doesn''t exist), then your world is dead. There is no reason to do anything for anyone else. Selfishness and apathy would rule unchecked, much like they are doing in today''s mainstream society.


Pax

quote:Original post by runemaster
For you who have read Eddings'' Belgariad & Malloreon and Belgarath the Sorcerer and so on, don''t you think the Gods were great ? They were persons, they actually appeared and were important for the story.Belar is quite "human".

Yes, I''ve read them and the Eddings are some of my (and my wife''s) favorite authors. The gods there are quite human, but as a result, the world was nearly destroyed.

As far as Gaia being more of a force, what about our God (on the assumption that there is one, for I''m sure not everyone here believes that)? When was the last time you saw him? His influence on this world is more like a force than a being. He works in and through us. Your Gaia is no different, except that she is physically manifested in the planet, where God is an actual being, ''looking down on us from above.'' What''s the difference?


Pax