Obscure, you're correct.
Do you know of any guidlines that should be followed in a situation like this?
At what point can I feel confident that my 3D models are different enough from any real life counterparts?
Also do the car companys have a copyright on the "shape" of a vehicle, how is this possible?
I totally understand copyrighting logos, and names of vehicles...as far as the shape of the car...what legal precident would a company have if they brought a suit against me for using a 3D model that looks like a car they produce?
Also, it seems that a major car company wouldn't pursue the invidual car modelers, but instead they would go after a site like turbosquid.com which propogates the distribution/sale of 1000s of models which fall under the same legal limitations that my project does. The fact that so many of them use copyrighted logos alone should be enough. Plus the site gets a commision off these models.
Your input is very much appreciated.
- Dan
[Edited by - dgreen02 on August 4, 2005 4:45:56 PM]
Vehicle liknesses?
Like the others have suggested, find a lawyer with expierence in this.
As for me INAL and Not too much help for you, but i think this would probably fall under trademark laws, not copyrights or patents. Even though, you would NOT be using company logos or product names, the actual shape is probably trademarked or ACTS like a trademark. Trademarks are only as strong as there defense. What I mean is if A company does NOT defend thier trademark, then they lose it.
This will explain alot of the times why companies seem to threaten law suits of seemingly unimportant matters. They usually aren't doing anything other than defending the trademark.
I seriously doubt that there is much legal precedent set for 3D models of products. However, since companies (game makers, model makers) do cooperate with the auto makers, that is precedent itself.
But in the end it doesn't matter. If Ford or DaimlerChrysler want you to suffer then you will suffer. If they tell you to remove your models, then you will HAVE to or be prepared to spend ALOT of CASH in the courts.
GO talk to a lawyer. You models look nice. It would be cool if you can use them.
As for me INAL and Not too much help for you, but i think this would probably fall under trademark laws, not copyrights or patents. Even though, you would NOT be using company logos or product names, the actual shape is probably trademarked or ACTS like a trademark. Trademarks are only as strong as there defense. What I mean is if A company does NOT defend thier trademark, then they lose it.
This will explain alot of the times why companies seem to threaten law suits of seemingly unimportant matters. They usually aren't doing anything other than defending the trademark.
I seriously doubt that there is much legal precedent set for 3D models of products. However, since companies (game makers, model makers) do cooperate with the auto makers, that is precedent itself.
But in the end it doesn't matter. If Ford or DaimlerChrysler want you to suffer then you will suffer. If they tell you to remove your models, then you will HAVE to or be prepared to spend ALOT of CASH in the courts.
GO talk to a lawyer. You models look nice. It would be cool if you can use them.
Author
Quote:Original post by HAM
But in the end it doesn't matter. If Ford or DaimlerChrysler want you to suffer then you will suffer. If they tell you to remove your models, then you will HAVE to or be prepared to spend ALOT of CASH in the courts.
GO talk to a lawyer. You models look nice. It would be cool if you can use them.
It seems like that is really the bottom line :-/
It would be cheaper for me to have my current models obfuscated than it would be to talk to a lawyer about it all.
Thankfully only about half the models are done now, so it's not too late to address this issue, and a majority of the models I have (Taxi, police car, armoured car, 50s hot rod) are already unique enough.
Plus there are tons of racing games that have exact models of real life cars, they just changed the name of the car....though anyone who is familiar with cars can tell immediatly what the car is.
In one racing game (I think it was Gran Turismo 4), they didn't get a porsche license for the game...but what they did was include the cars under the name of a company that buys porsches and upgrades them. The models looked exactly like porsches though, just under some the name of an obscure german racing company.
I've still got a lot of questions about how model distribution sites dodge this...and how it's possible to copyright/trademark the shape of a vehicle.
Ford sues Honda because their new car looks like an existing Ford car?
- Dan
Quote:... they didn't get a porsche license for the game...but what they did was include the cars under the name of a company that buys porsches and upgrades them. The models looked exactly like porsches though, just under some the name of an obscure german racing company.fwiw a couple of years ago I worked at a game company where the car names and likenesses were licensed for the pc version of a game. My boss there told me the exact same models were being used in the previously released (unlicensed) playstation version of the game, just under a different name and without the grille logo/motif etc :)
The original Tokyo Xtreme Racer on the Dreamcast used real cars, and then used the Chassis Codes to name the cars.
Edit: Corvette, Escalade, Camry, and they all look fantastic :)
Edit: Corvette, Escalade, Camry, and they all look fantastic :)
Author
Well I've already had the cars obfuscated :-/ I was soooo happy with the way they looked before, but since this is my first published game...I need to play it safe.
I kind of want to release the cars the way they were before...just to see what kind of complaints if any I could get from car manufacturers...I guess that's a bad idea though ;-)
Check 'em out:
Below is the first set...the "range rover lookalike" and the "'70 boss 'stang lookalike" are going to be changed around before release.
I've also got 5 more cars in the works...I can't wait to see how they come out. I'm still urked that I can't have them look the way I really want them to.
- Dan
I kind of want to release the cars the way they were before...just to see what kind of complaints if any I could get from car manufacturers...I guess that's a bad idea though ;-)
Check 'em out:
Below is the first set...the "range rover lookalike" and the "'70 boss 'stang lookalike" are going to be changed around before release.
I've also got 5 more cars in the works...I can't wait to see how they come out. I'm still urked that I can't have them look the way I really want them to.
- Dan
Corvette C6
Mercedes-Benz CLK
Cadillac Escalade
BMW M3/5
Toyota Corolla (?)
Ford Interceptor/Police Cruiser
(same, but civilian taxicab variant)
(It's a Plymouth, but I forget the mode name; they stole one in the remake of Gone in 60 Seconds)
Armored Truck
Land Rover Range Rover
1969 Ford Mustang 2+2 Fastback
Given that I can still clearly recognize the obfuscated vehicles, I'd say not to worry about not having them the way you originally wanted. Car guys will recognize them and most likely refer to them by their real world names. Heck, I recognized the real world cars that inspired the parodies in the original, top-down GTA!
Project looks great. Hope to get some hands-on time with it at next year's GDC!
Mercedes-Benz CLK
Cadillac Escalade
BMW M3/5
Toyota Corolla (?)
Ford Interceptor/Police Cruiser
(same, but civilian taxicab variant)
(It's a Plymouth, but I forget the mode name; they stole one in the remake of Gone in 60 Seconds)
Armored Truck
Land Rover Range Rover
1969 Ford Mustang 2+2 Fastback
Given that I can still clearly recognize the obfuscated vehicles, I'd say not to worry about not having them the way you originally wanted. Car guys will recognize them and most likely refer to them by their real world names. Heck, I recognized the real world cars that inspired the parodies in the original, top-down GTA!
Project looks great. Hope to get some hands-on time with it at next year's GDC!
Author
Hah! It's a Z06 not a C6 ;-)! The vent in front of the rear tire is darkened by the shadows so I guess that's not really fair...though you can barely see it in the reflection in the first post.
Camry not a Corolla, and the hot rod is a '49 Mercury...but damn good work, you know your stuff.
As long as other car guys can still pick em out, I'm happy.
I was working to simulate accurate handling, mass, gear ratios, redlines, transmission, 0-60 time, top speed, engine sounds, etc.
I basicly gave him my dream car list to make, he did a great job at modeling them.
btw. The M3 looked so sexy before it hit the chopping block :-/
Glad you like the way the game's looking :-D
- Dan
Camry not a Corolla, and the hot rod is a '49 Mercury...but damn good work, you know your stuff.
As long as other car guys can still pick em out, I'm happy.
I was working to simulate accurate handling, mass, gear ratios, redlines, transmission, 0-60 time, top speed, engine sounds, etc.
I basicly gave him my dream car list to make, he did a great job at modeling them.
btw. The M3 looked so sexy before it hit the chopping block :-/
Glad you like the way the game's looking :-D
- Dan
Quote:Original post by dgreen02
I kind of want to release the cars the way they were before...just to see what kind of complaints if any I could get from car manufacturers...I guess that's a bad idea though ;-)
You've obviously worked extreamly hard on this project, and you deserve for it to be very successful (and I hope it is). Make sure don't take any risks that that might jeperdise all that.
Keep up the good work.
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